Pakistan may face another 1971, warns Nawaz Sharif

[chewy]

http://www.thehindu.com/news/international/pak-may-face-another-1971-warns-nawaz-sharif/article19562529.ece

Mr. Sharif’s outburst came a day after the Lahore High Court banned broadcast of “anti-judiciary” remarks by him and his party men.

Pakistan may face another “dismemberment” like the one it witnessed in 1971 if the people’s mandate is not respected, ousted Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif warned on Friday as he took a dig at the Supreme Court for disqualifying him.

 

 

lol, after affects of 1970s still being felt, scars will remain for eternity in Pakistan. 

[sandeep]

They keep paying for their original sin. 

 

Like Sardar Patel said way back then - let then make their paradise next door, we have no issues.  If they succeed, we will get some cool breezes blowing through here as well!. 

 

Unfortunately it's the fetid stink of a hellhole that wafts over every so often; in the form of paradise seeking jihadis. 

[kira]

Pakistan is going to face many 1971s before it is completely wiped off the map of the earth. Pakistan is a fake nation, there is not historical entity called pakistan, you just can't pull a nation out of your a$$ based on religion. Pakistan was destined to be a failed state the moment it was born, the idiots who built there nations didn't have the vision or IQ to understand the implications. The two nation theory was smashed into pieces when we created a third nation called Bangladesh. Even the pakistanis today are ashamed to call themselves as pakistanis in the foreign lands and are hiding, masquerading as Indians to save themselves from the humiliation that comes with the tag of pakistan.

[sandeep]

6 hours ago, kira said:

Pakistan is going to face many 1971s before it is completely wiped off the map of the earth. Pakistan is a fake nation, there is not historical entity called pakistan, you just can't pull a nation out of your a$$ based on religion. Pakistan was destined to be a failed state the moment it was born, the idiots who built there nations didn't have the vision or IQ to understand the implications. The two nation theory was smashed into pieces when we created a third nation called Bangladesh. Even the pakistanis today are ashamed to call themselves as pakistanis in the foreign lands and are hiding, masquerading as Indians to save themselves from the humiliation that comes with the tag of pakistan.

This is an ignorant fantasy.  Multiple generations have been born in Pakistan now that are going to stay loyal to their country.  That is a main reason that in spite of its questionable artificial origins, the country will keep on muddling through some state of existence.  Also the fact that there's enough stakeholders - military and non, corrupt and clean, with self interest to keep the entity going.   

[narenpande1]

On 8/31/2017 at 7:10 AM, sandeep said:

This is an ignorant fantasy.  Multiple generations have been born in Pakistan now that are going to stay loyal to their country.  That is a main reason that in spite of its questionable artificial origins, the country will keep on muddling through some state of existence.  Also the fact that there's enough stakeholders - military and non, corrupt and clean, with self interest to keep the entity going.   

 

Looks more like your own ignorance.

 

The number of countries over the years has ONLY increased not decreased. 

 

From about 120 nation states a few decades back, we are at nearly 200.

 

This trend can only continue as countries with large populations and a weak  civil society tends to have sects that want  to come out of a centralized command.

 

Most of the power in Pakistan is concentrated in its Punjab and Pak as such is almost entirely dominated by Sunni Punjabi Muslims.

 

Few provinces/states around the world are INTERNALLY (and without external fuel)   as keen to form an independent country as Balochistan - which is half of Pakistans area geographically.

 

Pakistan stupidly thinks its nuclear status is a guarantor of its physical sovereignty. 

 

Well it maybe to an extent only from external threats . But it cannot contain the internal fire raging in Balochistan.

 

Yugoslavia an Eastern European powerhouse was dismantled into 6 republic 2 decades ago. These days nobody identifies them as being former Yugoslavians. they are known as Croatians, Serbians, Slovenians...

 

Likewise, the Pakistan is a non starter.

 

Pakistans end game will be that of Punjabistan. Dominated by Sunni Muslim Punjabis.

 

Balochistan , Sindhis,  Pashtuns are alll different nationalities and will have their own states.

 

The roadmap is pretty clear.

 

To serve their Chinese masters economic corridor -

Pakistan will continue slaughtering Balochis and driving them from them from their own land. 

 

Sooner or later most Pakistanis will come to the realization that they are losing their sovereignty to  China whose only motive is to exploit resource rich Balochistan and find an alternative land route to Malacca strait -- - that can easily be closed off by US- India naval combine in the Indian Ocean.

 

Pakistan will also face massive  economic sanctions as CPEC rolls and more stories about bloodbath in Balochistan come out.

 

Pakistan will again try to come back to the American fold for bailout - realizing that they are far lesser devil than the exploitative greedy Chinese.

 

America (and India ) in a bid to kick out China from that region will ask that Pakistan will be bailed out should they cede  independence to Balochistan. Caught between a rock and hard place Pakistan will be forced to relent. 

 

Balochistan becomes a joint US-Indian naval base. 

 

Balochistans independence will set the stage for Mohajir dominated Sindh to find its own statehood.

 

 

 

[sandeep]

^ You can keep dreaming about a balkanisation of Pakistan.  I don't agree with your "assessment".   And even this wild-eyed fantasy came true, its not exactly in India's interest to have Pakistan self-flagellating itself into separate countries.   

[KeyboardWarrior]

18 minutes ago, narenpande1 said:

 

Looks more like your own ignorance.

 

The number of countries over the years has ONLY increased not decreased. 

 

From about 120 nation states a few decades back, we are at nearly 200.

 

This trend can only continue as countries with large populations and a weak  civil society tends to have sects that want  to come out of a centralized command.

 

Most of the power in Pakistan is concentrated in its Punjab and Pak as such is almost entirely dominated by Sunni Punjabi Muslims.

 

Few provinces/states around the world are INTERNALLY (and without external fuel)   as keen to form an independent country as Balochistan - which is half of Pakistans area geographically.

 

Pakistan stupidly thinks its nuclear status is a guarantor of its physical sovereignty. 

 

Well it maybe to an extent only from external threats . But it cannot contain the internal fire raging in Balochistan.

 

Yugoslavia an Eastern European powerhouse was dismantled into 6 republic 2 decades ago. These days nobody identifies them as being former Yugoslavians. they are known as Croatians, Serbians, Slovenians...

 

Likewise, the Pakistan is a non starter.

 

Pakistans end game will be that of Punjabistan. Dominated by Sunni Muslim Punjabis.

 

Balochistan , Sindhis,  Pashtuns are alll different nationalities and will have their own states.

 

The roadmap is pretty clear.

 

To serve their Chinese masters economic corridor -

Pakistan will continue slaughtering Balochis and driving them from them from their own land. 

 

Sooner or later most Pakistanis will come to the realization that they are losing their sovereignty to  China whose only motive is to exploit resource rich Balochistan and find an alternative land route to Malacca strait -- - that can easily be closed off by US- India naval combine in the Indian Ocean.

 

Pakistan will also face massive  economic sanctions as CPEC rolls and more stories about bloodbath in Balochistan come out.

 

Pakistan will again try to come back to the American fold for bailout - realizing that they are far lesser devil than the exploitative greedy Chinese.

 

America (and India ) in a bid to kick out China from that region will ask that Pakistan will be bailed out should they cede  independence to Balochistan. Caught between a rock and hard place Pakistan will be forced to relent. 

 

Balochistan becomes a joint US-Indian naval base. 

 

Balochistans independence will set the stage for Mohajir dominated Sindh to find its own statehood.

 

 

 

and in the end you wke up becoz of the wet dreams ..... 

or you must be too high when you wrote this sh1t damn fantasy story ..... 

[narenpande1]

4 hours ago, KeyboardWarrior said:

and in the end you wke up becoz of the wet dreams ..... 

or you must be too high when you wrote this sh1t damn fantasy story ..... 

 

Half your country broke 25 years after independence. That was not a fantasy but a reality.

 

It is also a reality that you have a slave mentality. Serving another country's agenda has been driving force behind your pathetic existence.

 

First it was jihad against Soviets at the behest of US, then war against terror again at the behest of US, now having china use your territory as a trade transit route for their own selfish purpose. 

 

No national goal or ambition apart from being a sh>tty provider to a master country.

 

Countries with such existence have not lasted historically - and you will be no different.

[surajmal]

If god wills it (PBUH, DDF, ABCD, XXASDASD...). 

[sandeep]

2 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 

Half your country broke 25 years after independence. That was not a fantasy but a reality.

 

It is also a reality that you have a slave mentality. Serving another country's agenda has been driving force behind your pathetic existence.

 

First it was jihad against Soviets at the behest of US, then war against terror again at the behest of US, now having china use your territory as a trade transit route for their own selfish purpose. 

 

No national goal or ambition apart from being a sh>tty provider to a master country.

 

Countries with such existence have not lasted historically - and you will be no different.

Pakistan's like a ho with Daddy issues that will sell itself to any bidder as long as the pimp and the john are hostile to her daddy.

[KeyboardWarrior]

3 hours ago, narenpande1 said:

 

Half your country broke 25 years after independence. That was not a fantasy but a reality.

 

It is also a reality that you have a slave mentality. Serving another country's agenda has been driving force behind your pathetic existence.

 

First it was jihad against Soviets at the behest of US, then war against terror again at the behest of US, now having china use your territory as a trade transit route for their own selfish purpose. 

 

No national goal or ambition apart from being a sh>tty provider to a master country.

 

Countries with such existence have not lasted historically - and you will be no different.

 

history history history .... wake up budy this is 2017 .... 

still living in the past .... well, its good for us , but not good for you , so try to live in the present .... 

[narenpande1]

3 hours ago, KeyboardWarrior said:

 

history history history .... wake up budy this is 2017 .... 

still living in the past .... well, its good for us , but not good for you , so try to live in the present .... 

 

In the past (history) you were wiping Sam Chacha's potty, now (future) you have signed up to wipe Uncle She Jinping's potty.

 

When as a nation your only ambition is to find a master whose potty you must clean ...for some crumbs/alms - it must be difficult to hold you head high.

 

 

[chewy]

Pak population has exploded to 210 million according to latest census, that puts there GDP per capita on par with Bangla, and estimate was 190 million in 2016.

with country being so power centric in Punjab, Sindh and Balochistan will get even more irritated

 

cant rule out a breakup

[surajmal]

11 minutes ago, chewy said:

Pak population has exploded to 210 million according to latest census, that puts there GDP per capita on par with Bangla, and estimate was 190 million in 2016.

with country being so power centric in Punjab, Sindh and Balochistan will get even more irritated

 

cant rule out a breakup

Bullshit. Their census numbers are hugely fudged. 300 million jihadis easily call naPakiland their home. 

[chewy]

Probably true, because so many pakistanis are found with genuine refugees entering Europe illegally

Also already rumours they have manipulated numbers for Karachi to limit political influence

[randomGuy]

Pakistan may or may not get disintegrated, but my biggest fixation is at levels of retardedness in supposedly educated Pakistanis. If an Illiterate, madrassachhap porky shows such levels of retardedness, then that's understandable but it's found in English speaking, internet literate Pakistanies like some who you see on this forum as well. That is mind-boggling.

[zen]

A break up of Pak should not be seen as a negative by Pakistanis. Rather than warn the country, Nawaz should work towards it 

[G_B_]

Pakistan more likely to break in future due to water issues especially among sindh and punjab.

 

 

[mishra]

On 9/3/2017 at 9:40 AM, chewy said:

Pak population has exploded to 210 million according to latest census, that puts there GDP per capita on par with Bangla, and estimate was 190 million in 2016.

with country being so power centric in Punjab, Sindh and Balochistan will get even more irritated

 

cant rule out a breakup

Arent Punjabis the ones that are ruling Pakistan? Most of alleged terrorist that are killed in Pakistan are actually non Punjabi.

 

  @panther suggested that CPEC isnt coming to their region which means infrastructure loan taken by Punjabis to develop their area and spread and interest to bore by everyone?

 

I think CPEC part of Pakistan will sooner than later be detached by rest on condition that Chinese found unrest in rest is effecting their CPEC investment.

 

For Chinese, This idea can be easily sold to successor of likes of Doval and feed on the hate for economic gains in India

 

Edited September 4, 2017 by mishra

[mishra]

Pakhtoon province where Afghans are treated as refugees and there has been a flare up and Pakistan installed check post actually belongs to Afghanistan. Pakistan has been trying to win the region diplomatically by crushing locals in name of terrorism and selling the land to Chinese. The worry is so clear as per recent article from Pakistan.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1356524/us-asked-to-condition-afghan-aid-to-recognition-of-durand-line

 

Quote

Mr Sherman proposed conditioning US aid to Kabul while outlining his views on Pakistan’s interests in Afghanistan and its fears of a growing Indian influence in that country.

“The Durand line — the border between Afghanistan and Pakistan — has not been recognised by the Afghan government,” he said.

“I realise that’s tough. They’ll say, oh, don’t — but the fact is, as long as Afghanistan leaves open the idea that they’re claiming Pakistani territory, it’s going to be very hard to get the Pakistanis involved, as we need them involved, in controlling the Afghan Taliban,” he exp

However below is what Afghanistans stand is

http://thepashtuntimes.com/the-durand-line-cant-separate-afghans-hamid-karzai-in-a-historic-interview-with-the-pashtun-times/

 

Quote

The Durand Line is not a claim but an aspiration and a historical right of the Afghan people; If Pashtuns from Pashtunkhwa decide to Pashtunistan, we will respect their decision; Pashtuns on other side of the Durand Line are victims of conspiracies; Daesh is a foreign project; the Pakistani military must stop creating challenges for Afghanistan; Afghans will respond if challenges were created concerning India; Pakistan’s constructed gate on Torkham should be removed.

 

Former President of Afghanistan, Hamid Karzai told THE PASHTUN TIMES in an exclusive interview that the Durand Line could not separate Afghans from each other as the history has proved. The former president warned that whosoever recognized the Durand Line would be the most hated person in Afghanistan. Talking to Aurang Zeb Khan Zalmay, host of The Pashtun Times’ flagship current affairs program Mubareza, the ex-president said the Durand Line was imposed by British Empire on Afghan people. “It was imposed on Afghans because of a weak government and during a difficult time. We (the Karzai administration) told Pakistan two things: First, we do not recognize the line because it was imposed on Afghans by the British. The whole world knows this. Pakistan knows this. Second, we hold no grudges against the people of Pakistan. We want friendly and brotherly relations,” Below is a full transcript of Aurangzeb Zalmay’s interview with the former president of Afghanstan, Hamid Karzai.

 

 

 

he Pashtun Times: In an interview with a private Pakistani TV channel, you said that if war broke out between Pakistan and India and if Pakistan needed Afghanistan, Afghanistan will support Pakistan. Still you stand on that statement?

Karzai: The question was not if there was war between Pakistan and India but if a country attacked Pakistan. My answer was that, as the people of Pakistan stood firmly beside Afghanistan and welcomed the Afghan people—they embraced us—, the Afghan people would also treat the people of Pakistan in the same way; only with the people of Pakistan. We cannot forget the support provided by the people of Pakistan and all the provinces. Khyber Pakhtunkhwa supported us a lot and is like our body. Likewise, Balochistan, Punjab and Sindh helped the Afghan refugees. If any trouble comes to Pakistan, and I pray such time shall not come, I will stand beside my Pakistani brothers and sisters to help them.

The Pashtun Times: In your view, can the Durand Line separate the Afghans living on both sides of the line?

Karzai: No. Durand Line cannot separate Afghans because the line has not been recognized by anyone for over a century. No one will recognize it. It cannot separate the nation. The line has not separated the nation. As I said before, when we went to the other side of the Durand Line, the people welcomed us as their own brothers. Therefore, it cannot separate us and no-one recognizes it. It cannot keep us away from each other.

The Pashtun Times: When we study the history, it is mentioned that the Durand Line was imposed on King Ameer Abdur Rahman Khan. When the Taliban came they did not recognize it, Pakistan-backed people did not even recognize the Durand Line. In your opinion, will someone emerge in Afghanistan who will recognize the Durand Line?

Karzai: No. Such a person will never arise in Afghanistan. If such a person did come, at that very moment, the people of Afghanistan will kick him out of Afghan Millat.

The Pashtun Times: What is your viewpoint? Do you recognize the Durand Line?

Karzai: No. When have I ever recognized the Durand Line? I have repeatedly said that I do not recognize this.

The Pashtun Times: What you mean by not recognizing the Durand Line?

Karzai: I mean that this line was imposed by British Empire on Afghan people. It was imposed on Afghans because of a weak government and at difficult time. Neither then or now does Afghan recognize the line. We did not complain about this to Pakistan because at that time Pakistan did not exist. There was Hindustan only, which was ruled by the British, part of the British Empire. Pakistan came into being later. We say two things to Pakistan, first, we do not recognize the line because it was imposed on Afghans by the British and the whole world knows it, as does Pakistan. Second, we have no grudge against the people of Pakistan, we want friendly and brotherly relations.

The Pashtun Times: By not recognizing the Durand Line, do you mean to make Loy Afghanistan?

Karzai: As we have not recognized the line, it means the historic Afghanistan which existed before the line was imposed.

The Pashtun Times: You were in power for 14 years. Afghanistan’s Constitution was drafted and approved in your term. What was your policy on the Durand Line? Now, Ashraf Ghani is in power, what formula does the current government have on the Durand Line? Or is Durand Line just a claim and nothing else? 

Karzai: It is not a claim but an aspiration of Afghan people. It is about the historical right of the Afghan people—living on both sides of the Durand Line. Only people can solve this problem, not governments.

The Pashtun Times: Do you know about public opinion on Durand Line issue?

Karzai: History is very clear in this regard. Look at the political struggle of Bacha Khan and after him. Look at the sacrifices. A few days ago when the government of Pakistan was harassing Afghan’s refugees, all Pashtun elders stood with their Afghan brothers against Pakistan. They stood firmly. Therefore, it is very clear that what people want.

The Pashtun Times: Pakistan says that Pashtun land, as far as Attock as you claim, has been inherited by her from the British Empire. What is your answer to this?

Karzai: It is true. It was left to Pakistan from the British Empire. That’s why I said that we do not have grievances with the people of Pakistan because the Durand Line was imposed by British. What we say to the British, we say to the heir of British, which is now Pakistan. Neither Afghans that time nor now, will recognize the line. The fate of the line will be decided only by the people living on either side of the Durand Line. It cannot be decided through the use of violence or force.

The Pashtun Times: It is said that until 1947 the money from the lease was given to the Afghan government in regard of the Durand Line agreement?

Karzai: A lease was not involved in it. The British government announced assistance. It was in two phases. First, was Gandhamak agreement. If you study the agreement of Gandhamak, you will find that large part of Balochistan, including Zhob, Pashin and Sibbi, and then South and North Waziristan, Bajaur, Dir and other areas, were taken from Afghanistan for security and administrative purposes. Revenue collected from these areas would be given to the Afghan government. It is also mentioned that these areas are part of the Afghanistan’s sovereignty. It is very clear in the Gandhamak agreement. That time 0.6 million rupees were given to Afghanistan. After the Durand Line agreement the amount was increased to 1.2 million. In the Durand Line Agreement, the line was not called a border. It was not called a ‘border’ but the term ‘sphere of influence’ was used. It means sphere of influence between the British India and Afghanistan, not a border.

The Pashtun Times: We heard that all agreements with the British Empire expired in 1947 when the British left the region. The Durand Line agreement expired in 1993. The agreement has expired and it is now more than 20 years since that expiration. Have you taken steps to renew the agreement for five or ten years? And take the revenue from the government of Pakistan?

Karzai: Good question. We shall think about it. We shall discuss it on legal grounds to take steps.

The Pashtun Times: There is a debate going on that great changes will take place in the geography of this region in the near future. Do you see such changes? 

Karzai: Circumstances sometimes give a glimpse that something has been planned for this region. It is now clear that the war, which has been fought for 14 years, was not against extremism. Actually, extremism was promoted. Fourteen years ago there was no Daesh, but now Daesh is here. Fourteen years ago there was no extremism to such an extent that we see today. There is no doubt that somebody has had hand in this. No doubt that someone is benefiting from it. What and why this is happening and against whom, it should be asked. This needs an answer.

The Pashtun Times: If the Durand Line was not eliminated, would you stand beside Pashtuns living on the other side of the Durand Line to support an independent state of Pashtunistan? Are you in favor of a Pashtunistan? Will you support them to have an independent state?

Karzai: From the River Amu (Oxus) to Attock, Afghans live. There are different groups of Afghans. If Afghans living on the other side of the Durand Line decide to have an independent state we will accept it. We shall respect their decision whatever it is.

The Pashtun Times: How and who will bring Afghans, living on both sides of the Durand Line, together? 

Karzai: I tried to do so in Pervez Musharraf’s regime. We had a meeting, comprising of people from both sides, on the security situation. It was a productive meeting. From the other side of the Durand Line, our brothers and from here, different elders sat together. In my opinion, such meetings are very good. We will do it Insha’Allah.

The Pashtun Times: Has that gathering produced any results?

Karzai: It has not yielded results. The Pakistani government was not ready for it and did not want to end extremism and war. We tried but this did not give result. But we have come to know how people on the other side of the Durand Line are used in the foreign imposed war and killed in conspiracies. They are killed as well as defamed. In Afghanistan and Afghans, the same thing is happening.

The Pashtun Times: When Pakistan did not agree, did you take this to an international or any other platform?

Karzai: No. It is worth considering whether to do it or not.

The Pashtun Times: Recently, the Pashtun leader in Pashtunkhwa, Mehmood Khan Achakzai, said that Afghans living in the Sindh and Punjab provinces can come to Pakhtunkhwa if they are harassed, because Pakhtunkhwa belongs to them. Achakzai was brought under crippling pressure and severely criticized by the Pakistani media and government. At the end it seemed that he was helpless. What is your take on this?

Karzai: Mahmood Khan Achakzai is a much respected leader. We revere and respect him—greatly. I am glad that other leaders like Asfandyar Wali Khan, Aftab Ahmad Khan Sherpao and even Mullana Fazlur Rahman supported Achakzai. They expressed their feelings clearly. I respect them.

The Pashtun Times: Who are the Taliban or what we call terrorists? Do they have presence only in Afghanistan?

Karzai: Most of Afghans are Taliban.

The Pashtun Times: But there are also Punjabi Taliban.

Karzai: Yes, there are Punjabi Taliban but I am talking about Afghan Taliban. They are sons of this soil. We shall explore all the ways to convince them to end the war and killing of people—their people—and return to their own country. I also know that some secret hands are trying to stop this from happening. Circumstances have been created where Afghans are at each other’s throats and to disperse them using different names. The Afghan people are paying full attention to this challenge. I am sad to say that Pashtuns on the other side of the Durand Line are also going through tough time. What happened in Waziristan—elders were killed, the people who were famous for Jirgas— indicates that there is something else going on in this region. Whenever there was Jirga, there was either a suicide blast or a drone strike. This game is being played at the cost of our peoples’ lives—Afghans living on both sides of the Durand Line. Afghans on the both sides of the line are paying the cost.

 

 

Now you read above, A point of view from Afghan president andd the way he sees it, No wonder you will find that why Pakjabistan have been so heavily involved in creating a menace called Taliban and still doing so for over 7 decades, It doesnt matter if it is military or Civillian government. They just want to have something called Afghanistan=Taliban.

 

May be a lesson for so called Kashmiris too.