Speeds and Performances of Pacers and Spinners

[Gunner]

Bumrah is our best Yorker bowler currently. Period.

He was consistently hitting the blockhole and got 2 wickets with yorkers, one of them breaking the legstump.

We'll have to watch if he can show the same kind of consistency and accuracy when he bowls under pressure at the death, as today the match was already in the bag when he came on to bowl.

[express bowling]

He was slower by 7-8ks compared to the 1st t20.

He set up Dhawan and had him caught behind with a 139k well-directed short delivery.

Thanks bro

[Rightarmfast]

I was surprised Indian bowlers weren't hitting 140s yesterday. In Australia they were bending their back and got good speeds. I don't understand what happened yesterday. It was a green track and they should have been bowling lot quicker.

I'm sure there was no glitch in speed guns since Chameera was shown hitting 149k.

 

I am not sure if you have seen the trend, but under Dhoni, no bowler goes flat out. They all bowl medium pace. I am more than sure Dhoni has instructed if the bowlers want to be in the team, they have to bowl medium pace.

 

This should be a first, but after seeing his stumping in 2nd game ( ranch, watched only some highlights, my work sched is crazy ) , I am 1000% convinced that Dhoni doesnt like fast bowlers for a few reasons. One of those reasons is he won't get stumping chances to match the world records, also it hurts his palms the genuine pace of Umesh and Aaron ( and I am not trolling ). Also, I think he is insecured because genuine pacers get a lot of highlight and he wants to hog the limelight always!

 

Can't stress enough how much I hate Dhoni. Hate is a small word, I absolutely detest Dhoni. This man has singlehandedly taken Indian cricket 10yrs backward. All the hard work of Ganguly in making a pool of fast bowlers, which gave Zaheer Khan, has been undone by this selfish man

[cricquest]

We are trying  to test our brand new cricket app during the India vs Sri Lanka T20I to be played tomorrow. It is still in alpha stages. It asks you questions related to a live cricket match. Please help us to get ready and meanwhile you can also win exciting prizes by participating in the context during next T20I.

Please provide your feedback regarding your experience (preferably after playing tomorrow's game on this app) to android-developer@game.tv
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http://game-tv.kickoffpages.com/?kid=8FZZ5

[Mosher]

We are trying  to test our brand new cricket app during the India vs Sri Lanka T20I to be played tomorrow. It is still in alpha stages. It asks you questions related to a live cricket match. Please help us to get ready and meanwhile you can also win exciting prizes by participating in the context during next T20I.

Please provide your feedback regarding your experience (preferably after playing tomorrow's game on this app) to android-developer@game.tv
Please feel free to share the link with your friends and family. Some of the prizes offered in yesterday's match are: Mi Pad tablet, 2 TB USB 3.0 HardDisk, amazon gift vouchers :) Thanks.

http://game-tv.kickoffpages.com/?kid=8FZZ5

Please stop spamming the thread.

[express bowling]

There was a McGrath interview on Starsports 1.  He was explaining how he bowled. ...said that he used to bowl with a release point as high as possible...and gave the ball counter-clockwise revolutions ( right hander's perspective ) and put "work " on the ball on the top....so that he got bounce and zip off the pitch.  Often, he got seam movement too.

He said that pacers who try to swing the ball impart underspin on the ball, put " work " at the bottom and give it clock-wise revolutions..... and those who bowl quicker usually release the ball more from the side. According to the great pacer...top batsmen, like Tendulkar and Lara, found it easier to play 150 k deliveries that don't bounce than 135 k deliveries which suddenly kick up.

Some interesting points for those members interested in the intricacies of pace bowling.

I have always felt that bounce is more important than pace....but, in India, bounce is an aspect that has always been ignored.

Edited February 13, 2016 by express bowling

[Rightarmfast]

There was a McGrath interview on Starsports 1.  He was explaining how he bowled. ...said that he used to bowl with a release point as high as possible...and gave the ball counter-clockwise revolutions ( right hander's perspective ) and put "work " on the ball on the top....so that he got bounce and zip off the pitch.  Often, he got seam movement too.

He said that pacers who try to swing the ball impart underspin on the ball, put " work " at the bottom and give it clock-wise revolutions..... and those who bowl quicker usually release the ball more from the side. According to the great pacer...top batsmen, like Tendulkar and Lara, found it easier to play 150 k deliveries that don't bounce than 135 k deliveries which suddenly kick up.

Some interesting points for those members interested in the intricacies of pace bowling.

I have always felt that bounce is more important than pace....but, in India, bounce is an aspect that has always been ignored.

Mcgrath is 6'5'. How many of our bowlers are that tall, express bhai? You can't expect Umesh or Aaron who are hardly 5'10'-6. Ishant has the potential but doesnt always use. I believe pace is always a plus. Tom Moody also used to get bounce. But bounce at a speed of 120-130 is hardly of use on Indian pitches. 

If Indian curators make more pitches like the one in the 1st T20 matches, I believe there will be such bowlers.

[Mosher]

There was a McGrath interview on Starsports 1.  He was explaining how he bowled. ...said that he used to bowl with a release point as high as possible...and gave the ball counter-clockwise revolutions ( right hander's perspective ) and put "work " on the ball on the top....so that he got bounce and zip off the pitch.  Often, he got seam movement too.

He said that pacers who try to swing the ball impart underspin on the ball, put " work " at the bottom and give it clock-wise revolutions..... and those who bowl quicker usually release the ball more from the side. According to the great pacer...top batsmen, like Tendulkar and Lara, found it easier to play 150 k deliveries that don't bounce than 135 k deliveries which suddenly kick up.

Some interesting points for those members interested in the intricacies of pace bowling.

I have always felt that bounce is more important than pace....but, in India, bounce is an aspect that has always been ignored.

Do you guys remember Avishkar Salvi? Tall pacer from Mumbai. He had modeled his action after McGrath. He used get good bounce at a decent pace and used to come close to the stumps while bowling just like McGrath. He played for India in a few ODI's. He started of well against Bangladesh but then injury happened and he was never the same bowler after that. He turned into a trundler. Sad story that has been repeated many times with Indian bowlers.

[express bowling]

Mcgrath is 6'5'. How many of our bowlers are that tall, express bhai? You can't expect Umesh or Aaron who are hardly 5'10'-6. Ishant has the potential but doesnt always use. I believe pace is always a plus. Tom Moody also used to get bounce. But bounce at a speed of 120-130 is hardly of use on Indian pitches. 

If Indian curators make more pitches like the one in the 1st T20 matches, I believe there will be such bowlers.

I don't disagree with you.  Every bowler does not need to copy McGrath.  Umesh and Aaron's plus point is raw speed and they need to utilize that.  I am actually disappointed that Umesh is not bowling flat out in ODis. His speciality is speed and he needs to go for some 145 k to 150 k spells....as does Aaron.

I was talking about bounce being ignored as a weapon by Indian pacers and Indian bowling coaches. Genuine fast bowlers can improve their ability to bounce the ball too. Also, tall, fast-medium pacers need to improve their ability to extract steep bounce. In the bowling line-up there must be some pacers who are bouncing the ball regularly.

If we look at our pace attack after Srinath retired...we have had only Ishant, Aaron and Munaf in his first year who has used bounce as a weapon. We need more such pacers. ( And Aaron is almost never picked )

Nathu Singh, Ankit Rajpoot , Avesh Khan and Khaleel Ahmed are 4 young Indian pacers who have pace as well as bounce and I am looking forward to some of them playing for India

I am not looking for 130 k pacers with bounce....a bowling attack with two 140 k to 150 k pacers and two others who are tall, bouncy and bowl atleast 135 k to 142 k....would make our attack more potent..

Edited February 13, 2016 by express bowling

[express bowling]

Do you guys remember Avishkar Salvi? Tall pacer from Mumbai. He had modeled his action after McGrath. He used get good bounce at a decent pace and used to come close to the stumps while bowling just like McGrath. He played for India in a few ODI's. He started of well against Bangladesh but then injury happened and he was never the same bowler after that. He turned into a trundler. Sad story that has been repeated many times with Indian bowlers.

I do remember Avishkar Salvi.  He was an interesting bowler...but bounce and accuracy at 127 k does not work....as Salvi found out after his injury.

Ashok Malhotra was a big fan of Salvi...and, to this day, he keeps on mentioning a particular spell by Salvi in Wankhede, which he refers to as the fastest spell by an Indian pacer that he has ever seen. Don't know how true it is...but Salvi was not that quick after an injury.

McGrath must have bowled 135 k to 142 k in his first 5  years, when speeds were not shown on TV.  

Edited February 13, 2016 by express bowling

[Trichromatic]

I do remember Avishkar Salvi.  He was an interesting bowler...but bounce and accuracy at 127 k does not work....as Salvi found out after his injury.

McGrath must have bowled 135 k to 142 k in his first 5  years, when speeds were not shown on TV.  

Even when speeds were shown, he was consistently in high 130s and 140s in early years. He started as fast mmedium, rather than medium fast or medium bowler. 

[express bowling]

Even when speeds were shown, he was consistently in high 130s and 140s in early years. He started as fast mmedium, rather than medium fast or medium bowler. 

I would say ..more 132 k to 142 k range in 1999...when TV broadcasters started showing speeds regularly. He slowed down to 130 k to 138 k in his last few years, which is quite natural.

Many people, who have started watching cricket after 2000, think that McGrath was a trundler and that is not true. 

Edited February 13, 2016 by express bowling

[express bowling]

@ RightArmFast

McGrath once said that, if he could bowl any faster without losing bounce ( which was his USP ) then he would have. After maintaining one's own strengths, the more speed the better and young guys should always try to bowl quick.

[AnkurUpadhyay]

I do remember Avishkar Salvi.  He was an interesting bowler...but bounce and accuracy at 127 k does not work....as Salvi found out after his injury.

Ashok Malhotra was a big fan of Salvi...and, to this day, he keeps on mentioning a particular spell by Salvi in Wankhede, which he refers to as the fastest spell by an Indian pacer that he has ever seen. Don't know how true it is...but Salvi was not that quick after an injury.

McGrath must have bowled 135 k to 142 k in his first 5  years, when speeds were not shown on TV.  

Salvi used to bowl in the 135-140k range before the injury. He was a very exciting prospect. But the injury ruined him. After that he changed his action and his pace dropped too..

[Rightarmfast]

I do remember Avishkar Salvi.  He was an interesting bowler...but bounce and accuracy at 127 k does not work....as Salvi found out after his injury.

Ashok Malhotra was a big fan of Salvi...and, to this day, he keeps on mentioning a particular spell by Salvi in Wankhede, which he refers to as the fastest spell by an Indian pacer that he has ever seen. Don't know how true it is...but Salvi was not that quick after an injury.

McGrath must have bowled 135 k to 142 k in his first 5  years, when speeds were not shown on TV.  

I saw Mcgrath bowling quick only once in his entire career. And that was during Aussie tour of WI in 97-98. In the innings in which Lara won the game for WI, chasing a huge target, Mcgrath was pumped up and he was bowling quick ( they didnt have speed guns then, but he seemed to be running up quick with a quick arm action ). He would have been around 140-145 ( speculation ). But he couldn't do jacksh..t to Lara.

 

About Avishkar Salvi, he was super hyped. I remember talking to Eddie Smith too, around early 2000's and he was excited about the prospect. But Salvi turned out to be more medium fast, than fast medium.

 

[express bowling]

I saw Mcgrath bowling quick only once in his entire career. And that was during Aussie tour of WI in 97-98. In the innings in which Lara won the game for WI, chasing a huge target, Mcgrath was pumped up and he was bowling quick ( they didnt have speed guns then, but he seemed to be running up quick with a quick arm action ). He would have been around 140-145 ( speculation ). But he couldn't do jacksh..t to Lara.

 

About Avishkar Salvi, he was super hyped. I remember talking to Eddie Smith too, around early 2000's and he was excited about the prospect. But Salvi turned out to be more medium fast, than fast medium.

 

My impression is ...McGrath was a fast-medium bowler in his first 5 or 6 years...... neither fast ...nor medium-fast.

He became medium-fast in his last few years.

One interesting thing about the McGrath interview that I talked about was...he was teaching how to get zip and bounce off the deck. Every pacer, whatever his release speed, can get more zip off the deck if he imparts "top-spin" on the ball in place of the "under-spin " that swing bowlers often impart.  Even a 150 k pacer can use this.   In India , our tendency is generally to go for swing always and hence losing out on bounce.  

 

[express bowling]

Ian Bishop and Dominic Cork were discussing bowling speeds in the u19 final commentary box.

Bishop said  that he was military-medium at u19 level and became quicker after that ....as he improved his bowling technique and his body became stronger.

Something to consider .....as we analyze the bowling speeds of Avesh, Khaleel,  Nathu etc.

[express bowling]

U19 final

Speed ranges ( of most deliveries excluding slower ones )

Avesh   130 k to 138 k ...lots of deliveries at 136 k to 138 k 

Khaleel  129 k to 137 k

 

Avesh has bowled a great line mostly. Looked dangerous whenever he bowled good length.  Has bowled some sizzling bouncers and got good bounce generally.  Has seamed the ball both ways.

Khaleel has erred in line at-times but still decent control. Got bounce but not much movement. Has bowled a couple of good bouncers. Would have liked it if he got more seam movement on this track.

Our opening bowlers have managed  31 for 2 in the first 11 overs...quite good  normally...but is it good enough for this match ?

 

Edited February 14, 2016 by express bowling

[Rightarmfast]

This match we will lose. But lets concentrate on the takeaways - Avesh, Khaleel and Sarfaraz. I think thats good enough.

[express bowling]

Pandya was bowling 125 k, 127 k etc. today.  I don't like it.

He should try to bowl at his normal speed of 132 k to 142 k.

Slowing down won't help him as a bowler.

Quite a few pacers in our team are bowling slower than normal in LOIs...not a good idea.