Is Hardik Pandya more talented than Jadeja in tests?

[zen]

4 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

Kapil averaged 26 with ball in first 3-4 years with ball and 32 with bat. 

Pandya already averages 31 with the bat in his first season. And since he plays as the 5th bowler, his bowling avg depends on a variety of factors .... which is why I want Pandya to be given more chances 

 

I would want Pandya to avg higher with the bat, which he will when he plays in various conditions .... and his bowling to improve as well so he can even be played even as the 4th specialist bowler if required .... playing in various formats will make him a better cricketer, which will help Ind in LOIs as well 

Edited January 27, 2019 by zen

[express bowling]

11 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

 

+1. That's the only point I have been advocating in all threads.

Not judging him by FC numbers. He is already better than what he has done in FC cricket so far. But batting doesn't go far if it isn't developed at FC level. Players can score a century in 100, score good 40s-50s, but to do it consistently requires practice in domestics. Playing long innings require grinding in FC. 

 

Someone like Pant didn't magically turn off his insticts in 3rd test. He has a test triple century where he faced 326 deliveries even though it was a flat track.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/8050/scorecard/1053493/maharashtra-vs-delhi-group-b-ranji-trophy-2016-17

He had done it before and such experiences help players.

 

Test matches are FC too.  Kohli became a 54 averaging batsman from a 40 odd averaging batsman by playing more test cricket.

 

Pandya needs to play all tests vs Aim, Afghanistan, WI and SL.

 

But should also play all other FC that he can,  including Ranji, Unofficial tests and others.

 

Quote

Bowling is completely different where you can throw a player directly into international without even a single FC game and can still expect him to succeed.

 

 

 

No, you shouldn't.  

 

Bowling 20 overs a day, with intensity and pace, requires grinding at FC level.

 

Look at Avesh Khan this season.  He is bowling in good areas at good pace and picking loads of wickets after gathering good FC experience.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Trichromatic]

 

19 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

Test matches are FC too.  Kohli became a 54 averaging batsman from a 40 odd averaging batsman by playing more test cricket.

Pandya needs to play all tests vs Aim, Afghanistan, WI and SL.

But should also play all other FC that he can,  including Ranji, Unofficial tests and others.

 

Quote

 

Kohli was already averaging close to 60 with 7 centuries before his debut in ~30 FC matches he had played.

 

Bolded part is exactly what I thought for Pandya. But we have some fans who were ruing his absence even in test series victory thread against Aus.

 

19 minutes ago, express bowling said:

No, you shouldn't.  

 

 Bowling 20 overs a day, with intensity and pace, requires grinding at FC level.

  

Look at Avesh Khan this season.  He is bowling in good areas at good pace and picking loads of wickets after gathering good FC experience.

Not saying it should be followed every time, FC experience helps, but unlike batting bowling can progress without FC experience. Having FC experience is important there too in most cases. 

[express bowling]

Just now, Trichromatic said:

 

Kohli was already averaging close to 60 with 7 centuries before his debut in ~30 FC matches he had played.

 

No.  Kohli was averaging around 45 in FC before test debut as far as I remember.   Scored  4 or 5 centuries.

 

He has played some FC matches after test debut too and averages around 54 in non-test FC now.

 

 

Just now, Trichromatic said:

 

Not saying it should be followed every time, FC experience helps, but unlike batting bowling can progress without FC experience.

 

I doubt it.

[mani sha]

this thread is irrelevsnt

 

selectors , players and captain consider him gold 

even if he is 12 karet gold , our team will shine .

 

the mix of experience and ageing will make him 20 karet

 

if he becomes 24 karet it will be from sheer discipline.

 

 

[Trichromatic]

31 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

No.  Kohli was averaging around 45 in FC before test debut as far as I remember.   Scored  4 or 5 centuries.

 He has played some FC matches after test debut too and averages around 54 in non-test FC now.

Season		Matches	Inns	Not Out	Runs	HS	Ave	100
2006-07	(India)	6	9	2	257	90	36.71	0
2007-08	(India)	5	8	1	373	169	53.28	2
2008-09	(India)	10	12	1	613	197	55.72	2
2009-10	(India)	4	7	2	430	145	86	1
2010-11	(India)	5	8	1	458	173	65.42	2
2011	(West Indies)	3	5	0	76	30	15.2	0
			44	7	2131
				Bat avg	57.5945945945946

 

 

2131 runs at avg of 57.59 with 7 centuries in 30 FC matches.

 

And some of those are big 100s.

http://cricketarchive.com/Archive/Players/101/101095/f_Batting_by_Season.html

 

[jf1gp_1]

Per coffee with Karan he certainly is 

[Clarke]

I'm surprised at Pandya getting a third of the votes. It can purely be a projection since there is no way he is more anything in tests currently. Even in batting Jadeja has contributed in Eng & Aus.

 

I do look forward to seeing both in the test XI.

[Straight Drive]

3 hours ago, zen said:

Note that Pandya is a fast bowler though so the metrics are different. For e.g. if you recall, Kapil's bowling avg is around 30 and batting avg around 31, and he is considered a better AR than Jadeja, who is probably not even played as one  

 

 

I would compare none of the all rounder with Kapil. 

 

Kapil is world's ATG all rounder, others are struggling to be even India's w2nd best.

 

Kapil has double of 5000+ runs and 400+ test wickets. A lot of out all rounders even fail to register a double of 1000 test runs and 100 wickets. 

 

Jadeja is yet to cross test double of 2000 runs and 200 wickets. Which will still be half of what Kapil did in career. 

 

Pandya is just 11 tests experienced. I would not even compare him with Jadeja or for that matter even Irfan Pathan given that he hardly has test experience. Let Pandya play at least 30 test, then we might be having at least some insight to compare him with couple of all-rounders. At this point he is getting in very early phase of test career with just 11 test under his belt. Too inexperienced to be compared with others 

 

 

 

Edited January 27, 2019 by Straight Drive