R!TTER Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 2 minutes ago, rollingstoned said: Drs was around for a while before the Indians also decided to adopt it, wasn't it after Dhoni retired? No, it was nearly 2 years after that.
vvvslaxman Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 3 minutes ago, R!TTER said: How many minnows he's played against? Less than Ashwin that's for sure & in case the last argument went over your head - it's the commentator's bias! Manjrekar was a constant in those days & he always had a bias against Jadeja. Now admittedly some series you could flip a coin, but in some of them Jadeja was the biggest difference! Jadeja deserved it in Eng vs India 2016 just as much as Brat. hmm Ashwin made 306 runs & 28 wickets.
ShoonyaSifar Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 2 hours ago, vvvslaxman said: Based on your own argument how is Bumrah/Shami better than bowlers from other eras? I can also say Mahela , Younish Khan, Inzama will thash our seamers. This was in zimbabwe. Mind you we clean swept in 2005. Look at Kumble's figures.. We have seen Kumble's bowling through 2000s. Fantastic bowler. But many teams figured out his style and treate him like a seamer instead of a genuine leggie. That is why his average against almost all teams are 30 except Zimbabwe/NZ. Argument : FAIL Logic: FAIL Unlike Ashwin in SENA, our pacers do not go missing in India (and in Asia) where there is little help from them. Shami is a beast at home, Bumrah hasn't played enough Try better. Shift the goalposts now.
vvvslaxman Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 3 minutes ago, R!TTER said: Hey you're the one who brought up his stats post DRS & then you run away when he didn't play tests in any of them? Or do you not know DRS started full time, for us, in Ind vs Eng 2016 at home? Eng 2011 away we had no lbws you could challenge, that's why I brought up that hattrick! Stop acting deliberately dumb So upto 2015 Ashwin did not benefit from DRS as per your theory 32 tests 176 wickets 25.39 average 52.4 strike rate Anymore filters?
vvvslaxman Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 (edited) 6 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said: Argument : FAIL Logic: FAIL Unlike Ashwin in SENA, our pacers do not go missing in India (and in Asia) where there is little help from them. Shami is a beast at home, Bumrah hasn't played enough Try better. Shift the goalposts now. Let me borrow your first two lines. Argument was about quality of batsman. As per the argument 2000 batsmen would devour our current spinners. Same goes for seamers. Edited January 2, 2022 by vvvslaxman
ShoonyaSifar Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 A guy who cannot even start in SENA tests regularly (because of consistently poor performances) cannot be in India all time 11 based on bullying teams at home on helpful wickets.
R!TTER Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 (edited) 4 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said: So upto 2015 Ashwin did not benefit from DRS as per your theory Have you got an aneurism or what? DRS benefits when you actually have DRS in the games, or do I need to write a rhyme for you to recite? India did not have DRS in any of the series, except partial DRS in Eng 2011, till 2016 end. View overall figures [change view] Home or away away (home of opposition) or neutral venue Start of match date less than or equal to 1 Dec 2016 Involving the player R Ashwin (INDIA) Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 20 Ordered by wickets taken (descending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 6 of 6 First Previous Next Last Return to query menu Cleared query menu Overall figures Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10 R Ashwin (INDIA) 2011-2016 17 29 694.1 112 2227 67 7/83 10/160 33.23 3.20 62.1 5 1 I Sharma (INDIA) 2011-2016 15 26 456.3 81 1519 42 5/54 8/86 36.16 3.32 65.2 1 0 UT Yadav (INDIA) 2011-2016 11 21 331.3 54 1418 30 4/41 7/176 47.26 4.27 66.3 0 0 Mohammed Shami (INDIA) 2013-2016 7 13 230.3 39 814 28 5/112 6/145 29.07 3.53 49.3 1 0 A Mishra (INDIA) 2015-2016 5 10 148.5 27 457 21 4/43 7/72 21.76 3.07 42.5 0 0 GP Swann (ENG) 2012-2012 4 7 185.5 44 495 20 5/144 8/113 24.75 2.66 55.7 1 0 Now go mental on these stats View overall figures [change view] Home or away away (home of opposition) or neutral venue Start of match date between 1 Dec 2016 and 31 Dec 2021 Involving the player R Ashwin (INDIA) Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 20 Ordered by wickets taken (descending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 5 of 5 First Previous Next Last Return to query menuCleared query menu Overall figures Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10 R Ashwin (INDIA) 2017-2021 16 30 658.5 130 1709 62 5/69 7/121 27.56 2.59 63.7 1 0 Mohammed Shami (INDIA) 2017-2021 14 25 384.0 77 1268 51 5/44 8/107 24.86 3.30 45.1 1 0 JJ Bumrah (INDIA) 2018-2021 11 22 408.0 97 1146 41 5/85 7/122 27.95 2.80 59.7 1 0 I Sharma (INDIA) 2018-2021 8 15 244.4 55 688 31 5/51 6/97 22.19 2.81 47.3 2 0 RA Jadeja (INDIA) 2017-2021 5 9 161.1 30 524 21 5/152 7/236 24.95 3.25 46.0 1 0 Edited January 2, 2022 by R!TTER
vvvslaxman Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 Able to polarize a large group.. RITTER youa re cool man. Lol
vvvslaxman Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 3 minutes ago, R!TTER said: Have you got an aneurism or what? DRS benefits when you actually have DRS in the games, or do I need to write a rhyme for you to recite? View overall figures [change view] Home or away away (home of opposition) http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif or neutral venue http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif Start of match date less than or equal to 1 Dec 2016 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif Involving the player R Ashwin (INDIA) http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 20 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif Ordered by wickets taken (descending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 6 of 6 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/ciPhotoFirst-icon_13x13.gifFirst http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/ciPhotoPrev-disable-icon_13x13.gifPrevious Next http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/ciPhotoNext-disable.gif Last http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/ciPhotoLast-disable.gif http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/dblBakArwB.gifReturn to query menuhttp://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/dblBakArwW.gifCleared query menu Overall figures Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wktshttp://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/blackArrowDown.gif BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10 R Ashwin (INDIA) 2011-2016 17 29 694.1 112 2227 67 7/83 10/160 33.23 3.20 62.1 5 1 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif I Sharma (INDIA) 2011-2016 15 26 456.3 81 1519 42 5/54 8/86 36.16 3.32 65.2 1 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif UT Yadav (INDIA) 2011-2016 11 21 331.3 54 1418 30 4/41 7/176 47.26 4.27 66.3 0 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif Mohammed Shami (INDIA) 2013-2016 7 13 230.3 39 814 28 5/112 6/145 29.07 3.53 49.3 1 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif A Mishra (INDIA) 2015-2016 5 10 148.5 27 457 21 4/43 7/72 21.76 3.07 42.5 0 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif GP Swann (ENG) 2012-2012 4 7 185.5 44 495 20 5/144 8/113 24.75 2.66 55.7 1 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif Now go mental on these stats View overall figures [change view] Home or away away (home of opposition) http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif or neutral venue http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif Start of match date between 1 Dec 2016 and 31 Dec 2021 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif Involving the player R Ashwin (INDIA) http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 20 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif Ordered by wickets taken (descending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 5 of 5 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/ciPhotoFirst-icon_13x13.gifFirst http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/ciPhotoPrev-disable-icon_13x13.gifPrevious Next http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/ciPhotoNext-disable.gif Last http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/ciPhotoLast-disable.gif http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/dblBakArwB.gifReturn to query menuhttp://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/dblBakArwW.gifCleared query menu Overall figures Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wktshttp://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/blackArrowDown.gif BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10 R Ashwin (INDIA) 2017-2021 16 30 658.5 130 1709 62 5/69 7/121 27.56 2.59 63.7 1 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif Mohammed Shami (INDIA) 2017-2021 14 25 384.0 77 1268 51 5/44 8/107 24.86 3.30 45.1 1 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif JJ Bumrah (INDIA) 2018-2021 11 22 408.0 97 1146 41 5/85 7/122 27.95 2.80 59.7 1 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif I Sharma (INDIA) 2018-2021 8 15 244.4 55 688 31 5/51 6/97 22.19 2.81 47.3 2 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif RA Jadeja (INDIA) 2017-2021 5 9 161.1 30 524 21 5/152 7/236 24.95 3.25 46.0 1 0 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif Basically away stats lol Another filter
R!TTER Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 Just now, vvvslaxman said: Basically away stats lol Another filter Because at home we demolish everyone anyway, is that you wanna hear? Or that Eng series in 2012 where Ashwin did * all? sarchasm 1
ShoonyaSifar Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 8 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said: Let me borrow your first two lines. Argument was about quality of batsman. As per the argument 2000 spinners would devour our current spinners. Same goes for seamers. Which is exactly where your logic fails. Ashwin is a condition dependent bowler. Our seamers are not. That's the whole point. Obviously you can't see the difference sarchasm 1
vvvslaxman Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 Just now, R!TTER said: Because at home we demolish everyone anyway, is that you wanna hear? Or that Eng series in 2012 where Ashwin did * all? Ashwin was struggling early part of his career under Dhoni. No one denies that. He was a very defensive option with funky field set from Dhoni. Even he was trying too much. Only later in his career he stopped experimenting. Besides he has missed 50% of the overseas game. Was never a regular. Infact none of our spinners were regular. By the time he started doing well we became an out and out seamer oriented bowling unit in SENA. So more of a holding job for spinners.
vvvslaxman Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 1 minute ago, ShoonyaSifar said: Which is exactly where your logic fails. Ashwin is a condition dependent bowler. Our seamers are not. That's the whole point. Obviously you can't see the difference hmm That is not what it is about. Batsman are good enough to play against any bowler in any condition as per the theory.
ShoonyaSifar Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 9 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said: Able to polarize a large group.. RITTER youa re cool man. Lol Umm no. Only thing you've done is to again prove that you are an expert in shifting goalposts. But sadly all this disco dance still doesn't make Ashwin a good bowler in SENA. He still has his chance in next two tests after failing in the 1st test.
R!TTER Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 (edited) 11 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said: Basically away stats lol Another filter Now don't *ing tell me you don't know the discrepancy in numbers! View overall figures [change view] Home or away home venue Start of match date between 1 Dec 2016 and 31 Dec 2020 Involving the player R Ashwin (INDIA) Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 50 Ordered by bowling average (ascending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 3 of 3 First Previous Next Last Return to query menu Cleared query menu Overall figures Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10 UT Yadav (INDIA) 2016-2019 16 32 419.3 68 1376 66 6/88 10/133 20.84 3.28 38.1 2 1 RA Jadeja (INDIA) 2016-2019 18 36 761.2 187 1839 83 7/48 10/154 22.15 2.41 55.0 3 1 R Ashwin (INDIA) 2016-2019 18 34 798.1 169 2202 86 7/145 12/167 25.60 2.75 55.6 4 1 And for the last time stop acting like a deliberate dumb* View overall figures [change view] Home or away home venue Start of match date between 1 Dec 2016 and 31 Dec 2021 Involving the player R Ashwin (INDIA) Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 50 Ordered by bowling average (ascending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 3 of 3 First Previous Next Last Return to query menu Cleared query menu Overall figures Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10 R Ashwin (INDIA) 2016-2021 24 46 1089.2 235 2832 132 7/145 12/167 21.45 2.59 49.5 7 1 UT Yadav (INDIA) 2016-2021 18 36 459.3 76 1486 68 6/88 10/133 21.85 3.23 40.5 2 1 RA Jadeja (INDIA) 2016-2021 19 38 822.2 207 1936 88 7/48 10/154 22.00 2.35 56.0 3 1 Edited January 2, 2022 by R!TTER
vvvslaxman Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 Just now, ShoonyaSifar said: Umm no. Only thing you've done is to again prove that you are an expert in shifting goalposts. But sadly all this disco dance still doesn't make Ashwin a good bowler in SENA. He still has his chance in next two tests after failing in the 1st test. That phrase is so worn out dude lol That is almost like a defensive line "shifting goal post". He probably won't dominate for the rest of his life overseas given that our attack is primarily seam oriented. Back then our attack was pace/spin ratio was 50/50. Even in the 2000s it was 75/25 ratio. Nowadays it is more like 80/20 ratio Their role is extremely limited. HE doesn't have scope to prove at this age. He just has to do a holding role.
Majestic Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 (edited) Top 3 Indian spinners of all-time:- 1. Kumble/Chandra 2. Chandra/Kumble 3. Bedi Edited January 2, 2022 by Majestic ShoonyaSifar 1
vvvslaxman Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 5 minutes ago, R!TTER said: Now don't *ing tell me you don't know the discrepancy in numbers! View overall figures [change view] Home or away home venue Start of match date between 1 Dec 2016 and 31 Dec 2020 Involving the player R Ashwin (INDIA) Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 50 Ordered by bowling average (ascending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 3 of 3 First Previous Next Last Return to query menu Cleared query menu Overall figures Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10 UT Yadav (INDIA) 2016-2019 16 32 419.3 68 1376 66 6/88 10/133 20.84 3.28 38.1 2 1 RA Jadeja (INDIA) 2016-2019 18 36 761.2 187 1839 83 7/48 10/154 22.15 2.41 55.0 3 1 R Ashwin (INDIA) 2016-2019 18 34 798.1 169 2202 86 7/145 12/167 25.60 2.75 55.6 4 1 And for the last time stop acting like a deliberate dumb* View overall figures [change view] Home or away home venue Start of match date between 1 Dec 2016 and 31 Dec 2021 Involving the player R Ashwin (INDIA) Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 50 Ordered by bowling average (ascending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 3 of 3 First Previous Next Last Return to query menu Cleared query menu Overall figures Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10 R Ashwin (INDIA) 2016-2021 24 46 1089.2 235 2832 132 7/145 12/167 21.45 2.59 49.5 7 1 UT Yadav (INDIA) 2016-2021 18 36 459.3 76 1486 68 6/88 10/133 21.85 3.23 40.5 2 1 RA Jadeja (INDIA) 2016-2021 19 38 822.2 207 1936 88 7/48 10/154 22.00 2.35 56.0 3 1 How is this a proof that Jadeja didn't have big matches or didn't win many man of the series lol With those numbers shouldn't he be biggest dominator in series. Now that he is battin very well. Can you share the list of Jaddu matches where Ashwin didn't play where he ran through sides.
ShoonyaSifar Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 8 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said: That phrase is so worn out dude lol That is almost like a defensive line "shifting goal post". He probably won't dominate for the rest of his life overseas given that our attack is primarily seam oriented. Back then our attack was pace/spin ratio was 50/50. Even in the 2000s it was 75/25 ratio. Nowadays it is more like 80/20 ratio Their role is extremely limited. HE doesn't have scope to prove at this age. He just has to do a holding role. What a strange defence! But let's test your own argument. At home our attack is 80/20 loaded in favor of spin. Is that the reason for Ashwin doing so well?
R!TTER Posted January 2, 2022 Posted January 2, 2022 5 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said: Can you share the list of Jaddu matches where Ashwin didn't play where he ran through sides. Ashwin plays all games at home, if his excuse about injury between 2017-2020 (4 years ) is true then why did he not sit out? There's also no filter to include one player & exclude another from cricinfo IIRC, so you'll have to do the legwork on that. 6 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said: With those numbers shouldn't he be biggest dominator in series You can count the number of series in which Jadeja played 2 or more tests at home. Against big teams - S.E.N.A. he's been consistently the biggest difference between the sides! AuxiliA 1
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