Time to acknowledge India cant play spin

[Adamant]

8 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Unfortunately that'll be applicable only to fringe players. I suspect the core group will go unscathed just like they did after WT20 in 2021 & 2022 or in WC2023 final.

Which core group do you think deserved the axe after 2023 world cup? Who didn’t score runs?

[Manucrick]

More like Indian seniors. Indian younger players now how to play spin we seen that in England test series 

[singhvivek141]

3 hours ago, Adamant said:

Which core group do you think deserved the axe after 2023 world cup? Who didn’t score runs?

Kamaal Lajawaab Rahul ?

Edited August 5, 2024 by singhvivek141

[Ultimate_Game]

8 hours ago, Adamant said:

Which core group do you think deserved the axe after 2023 world cup? Who didn’t score runs?

 

Kohli, KL Rahul and to an extent Iyer. Their time is done and they've shown it's beyond them to win anything. Other than stats padding not really good for anything. Wasted Bumrah, Shami and stellar bowling and couldn't win a WC at home either - the first team in 4 WCs not to do so.

[Frustrated]

9 hours ago, Adamant said:

Which core group do you think deserved the axe after 2023 world cup? Who didn’t score runs?

Sometimes we hv to understand that scoring runs doesnot make any difference in WC if those runs come at a SR of 50%.     Viz:  Kela scored 66 in WC Final.  From 115 balls.  That knock actually killed 1.4 Billion indians' hopes.  

[Adamant]

1 hour ago, Frustrated said:

Sometimes we hv to understand that scoring runs doesnot make any difference in WC if those runs come at a SR of 50%.     Viz:  Kela scored 66 in WC Final.  From 115 balls.  That knock actually killed 1.4 Billion indians' hopes.  

KL yes, Kohli no.

 

[Adamant]

1 hour ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Kohli, KL Rahul and to an extent Iyer. Their time is done and they've shown it's beyond them to win anything. Other than stats padding not really good for anything. Wasted Bumrah, Shami and stellar bowling and couldn't win a WC at home either - the first team in 4 WCs not to do so.

Show me the stats and how Kohlis poor performance knocked us out, compare it to other members and prove he was the reason we lost. 
 

Chalo Niklo.

 

Do kaudi ke hater.

Edited August 5, 2024 by Adamant

[Frustrated]

3 minutes ago, Adamant said:

KL yes, Kohli no.

 

Your question was "which core group needed to be axed after the WC2023?".    By core group, I thought u were referring to our entire middle order (incl Kela).    Now U hv admitted that one member of our core group needed to be axed.  But hasn't been yet.   

 

[Ultimate_Game]

2 minutes ago, Adamant said:

Show me the stats and how Kohlis poor performance knocked us out, compare it to other members and prove he was the reason we lost. 
 

Chalo Niklo.

 

Do kaudi ke hater.

 

Stats are continuous failures to win anything of note over the last decade.

 

Stats are the last 3 ODIs when he couldn't even capitalize on the great start provided by Rohit. Happened in Wc2023 final and in the first 2 SL ODIs. It's a consistent theme.

 

Stats are depending on bowling and expecting them to perform miracles every tourney. When someone like Head out-performs you when it matters, it shows where you stand.

[Adamant]

4 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Stats are continuous failures to win anything of note over the last decade.

 

Stats are the last 3 ODIs when he couldn't even capitalize on the great start provided by Rohit. Happened in Wc2023 final and in 

 

Stats are depending on bowling and expecting them to perform miracles every tourney. When someone like Head out-performs you when it matters, it shows where you stand.

Okay now I finally got it that you are basically a logicless entity.

 

Martyn Outperformed Sachin in finals, does it speak volumes about Sachin, Jayawardene did the same thing.

 

Please use your brain

 

So only last 3 odis are the stats you will check?

 

The continous failure to win anything was a team issue and was not related to one player who outperformed everyone.

 

People like you pick his one innings and that too a 55(63) in finals and somehow use it to bring him down, he was still the highest scorer with a respectable str rate in that match what happened to uour Sky, Gill?

 

The reason India won a trophy this year was bco he stood tall in the finals without his knock we would be 40/4 and would have ended with 120 runs, he took all the pressure and won you a match, be grateful of that.

 

The finals of last 3 trophies that India won

 

t20 Kohli Motm

Ct Kohli highest scorer

Wc very impressive 35 runs

55(63) in the finals we lost

 

Thats as good a final performance as any

 

[Praveen 06]

8 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Stats are continuous failures to win anything of note over the last decade.

 

Stats are the last 3 ODIs when he couldn't even capitalize on the great start provided by Rohit. Happened in Wc2023 final and in the first 2 SL ODIs. It's a consistent theme.

 

Stats are depending on bowling and expecting them to perform miracles every tourney. When someone like Head out-performs you when it matters, it shows where you stand.

Kohli won everything in international cricket. He don't need to prove anything to haters. 

[Ultimate_Game]

17 minutes ago, Praveen 06 said:

Kohli won everything in international cricket. He don't need to prove anything to haters. 

 

Kohli was carried to those wins. In 2011 WC it was Gambhir-Dhoni show. In 2024 WT20 it was Bumrah masterclass and stellar bowling by Pandya. Whenever team relied on the so called "King" to play like the top dog he failed. A performance like Travis Head has been beyond him in every tourney.

[Chakdephatte]

56 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Stats are continuous failures to win anything of note over the last decade. 

 

26 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Kohli was carried to those wins. 

You contradicted yourself big time. 

 

First you say he should be dropped for not winning (in a team sport). 

 

Someone pointed out that he was won three trophies. Now you are talking about his individual performance in those finals. 

 

Stay consistent, at least. Either you talk about his performance or team's performance. 

 

And in those three finals, he scored 43, 35, and 74. Not a failure at all. 

 

50 minutes ago, Praveen 06 said:

Kohli won everything in international cricket. He don't need to prove anything to haters. 

Doesn't matter even if he had not. I guess Brian Lara hasn't much either. That does not make him bad. It's a team sport. 

 

1 hour ago, Adamant said:

KL yes, Kohli no.

 

Were we going to win without KL's innings though? And had he not done enough before that match to warrant a place? 

[Praveen 06]

31 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Kohli was carried to those wins. In 2011 WC it was Gambhir-Dhoni show. In 2024 WT20 it was Bumrah masterclass and stellar bowling by Pandya. Whenever team relied on the so called "King" to play like the top dog he failed. A performance like Travis Head has been beyond him in every tourney.

Top scorer in 2013 ct knockouts 

Top scorer in 2024 t20 wc knockouts 

 

Dhoni, sachin also praised the kohli knock in 2011 finals

 

3 Potts as a player+3 icc trophies 

 

Total 6 memorable icc tournaments as a player.

 

[singhvivek141]

57 minutes ago, Chakdephatte said:

 

You contradicted yourself big time. 

 

First you say he should be dropped for not winning (in a team sport). 

 

Someone pointed out that he was won three trophies. Now you are talking about his individual performance in those finals. 

 

Stay consistent, at least. Either you talk about his performance or team's performance. 

 

And in those three finals, he scored 43, 35, and 74. Not a failure at all. 

 

Doesn't matter even if he had not. I guess Brian Lara hasn't much either. That does not make him bad. It's a team sport. 

 

Were we going to win without KL's innings though? And had he not done enough before that match to warrant a place? 

Are we talking about KL or Kohli ?

 

For KL, hell no...he has never done enough to warrant his place. He screwed our T20 2022 WC just like Rahane did in 2014 & 2016...he simply has no place in the team.

 

As I talked in another thread, avergaing 45-50 is easier these days in ODI's. KL is just the beneficiary of that statpadding.

[Chakdephatte]

2 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said:

Are we talking about KL or Kohli ?

 

For KL, hell no...he has never done enough to warrant his place. He screwed our T20 2022 WC just like Rahane did in 2014 & 2016...he simply has no place in the team.

 

As I talked in another thread, avergaing 45-50 is easier these days in ODI's. KL is just the beneficiary of that statpadding.

You people are too good at mixing things.

 

T20 WC? Where did it even come into picture? 

[singhvivek141]

Just now, Chakdephatte said:

You people are too good at mixing things.

 

T20 WC? Where did it even come into picture? 

Ignore it then, if you don't want to go that far. 

KL don't deserve in any form of Indian Cricket.

He is Bhuvaneshwar Kumar of batters. 

[putrevus]

45 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said:

Are we talking about KL or Kohli ?

 

For KL, hell no...he has never done enough to warrant his place. He screwed our T20 2022 WC just like Rahane did in 2014 & 2016...he simply has no place in the team.

 

As I talked in another thread, avergaing 45-50 is easier these days in ODI's. KL is just the beneficiary of that statpadding.

With Pant injured there was no one there for 2023 World cup.So they had to select KL.

[Frustrated]

9 hours ago, Chakdephatte said:

Were we going to win without KL's innings though?                          And had he not done enough before that match to warrant a place? 

"Were we going to win?"    Not entirely sure.   But 66 from 115 balls on a flat pitch where Rohit had given us a decent start & Kohli carried along reasonably well (till the 30th over) was beyond pathetic. A middle order batter is expected to accelerate after having played 100+ balls at a SR of 50.   And not throw it away, leaving his team in dire straits.                                         "Had he not done enough to warrant a place?"  No. 

The only decent/memorable ODI knock by KL before the WC2023 was the one vs Pak (asia cup 2023) in which a solid platform was already laid by Rohit & Gill.  And it was against a mediocre Pak bowling line up which didn't hv a single spinner.  It had only part timers like Ifti chacha & Shahdab.  On top of that, one of their pacers (Harris Rauf) had already heen injured when KL came out to the crease.  Not to forget there was Kohli at the other end. That made things quite easier for KL.  

[vvvslaxman]

It will be interesting to see the stat of our players on pitches like this in the last few years across the formats. There was one England series where ball was spitting like a cobra. I think only Rohit did okay. THen the Bangladesh series where our superstars failed. I think KL Rahul made 10 runs in 53 balls or so in the 2nd test. Kohli made 1 run in 22 balls before succumbing to Mehidy.  Then there was one test against Australia where pitch was turning from day 1. India folded like a cheap suit in both innings. Against now here we are. There is no secure game against spin on a turning track. Heck they can't even survive let alone score runs. Most of them failed when they tried to defend