Clarke Posted March 4, 2012 Posted March 4, 2012 Shouldn't we? No! We should've cleaned up the place and then sent the bill, simple as that. We didn't do the former for decades and agreed upon a certain amount of compensation at the highest levels. Its pure disgusting to have Greenpeace workers explore the area to this day researching the toxicity levels. Somehow that level of incompetence is acceptable but then its easier to attack/boycott the foreigner rather than demand clean water and soil in your own country. Whats even more disheartening is that in spite of being a numerically visible and economically strong diaspora in the USA, the Indians there haven't had any concerted efforts to bring Warren Anderson to justice. ( Many of our politicians are also complicit in his repatriation, no doubt, but thats besides the point). Easy isn't it, don't expect answers from your leaders on why Anderson was let go, what the ministries of environment/labor/heavy industry were up to all along before and after the disaster, why there's not been a proper cleanup of toxic residue decades after the accident, its the diaspora which is supposed to bring justice to the citizens of India. Would you also like to complain about the high property prices because of these NRIs as is the practice of the ignorant lot ? What about the settlement that was reached with Dow chemical ? You can't show up with a new amount every day can you, hey the actual cost of the disaster is alphabetagamma! As an analogy, would Israel participate in an Olympics event in which one of the companies that manufactured the nerve gases of the concentration camps was a major sponsor? All major German corporations had a major role to play in WWII. The Messerschmitts that bombed London day & night were powered by BMW engines. The third reich drove around in Mercs while making those decisions on the war & the holocaust. The tanks that killed countless Allied soldiers were designed by the likes of Ferdinand Porsche. IBM also supplied computers that helped in implementing the genocidal plans of the third reich. Which ones do you think the Jews boycott ? Israel or any other WWII Allied power doesn't carry that baggage coz its not stupid like many of us. IMO, we should boycott these Olympics. Boycotting the opening ceremony means nothing. Why not boycott USA itself, after all it used its muscle in protecting its industrialist ? Tell that to Pranabda, wonder why he was wooing American businesses a month earlier. Lets also return the billions in aid that America gave for some odd reason.
gs Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 We usually send 50 athletes and 200 officials. That is a decent crowd. Wasn't referring to the crowd that we send here. I was referring to our medals tally where we are a non entity. It's not as if we win a bunch of medals every Olympics that people would notice our absence this time if we decide not to participate.
Mariyam Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Well MI is owned by Ambani' date=' MI has destroyed the happiness of many of it's fans, barring the one off victory in the recent CL. Should MI fans protest in front of Anitlla everytime the door opens? :P[/quote'] I have to regretfully inform you that you've become thoroughly 'Mericanized. That wasn't funny at all. :((
Mariyam Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 We should just boycott the Olympics completely' date=' not like the world is going to care or miss us. We are pathetic at sports in general, will never be any good, too much corruption and mismanagement.[/quote'] We should just boycott ban NeutralCat, not like the ICF is going to care or miss him. He is a pathetic poster in general and will never be any good, too much 'holier than thou' preaching and self loathing.
Mariyam Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 No! We should've cleaned up the place and then sent the bill' date=' simple as that. We didn't do the former for decades and agreed upon a certain amount of compensation at the highest levels. Its pure disgusting to have Greenpeace workers explore the area to this day researching the toxicity levels. Somehow that level of incompetence is acceptable but then its easier to attack/boycott the foreigner rather than demand clean water and soil in your own country.[/quote'] WRT the compensation there is some ambiguity, because IIRC there were two bodies which arrived at a compensation figure. One was a commission set up by the GoI and the other a body formed by survivors/victims of the tragedy. Some background info. In the immediate aftermath of the disaster, the GoI passed a Bhopal Gas leak disaster Act, according to which they had the rights to represent the victims inside and outside India. It is alleged that this body agreed for a very small compensation (even after asking for an amount that was reasonable) as a result of an under the table deal with Union Carbide. That is when the survivors started with their own informal bodies and paid out of their own pockets for their legal proceedings. For years, Union Carbide refused to even meet/recognize the representatives of the body formed by the tragedy survivors. Compensation aside, do you not think Anderson to be guilty of culpable homicide? It was on his directives that standards were lax. It was on his directives that the place was understaffed. Why mix the issue of compensation with that of justice? Also, I really do not understand what 'demanding clean water and soil' has to do with this case? So if the GoI (hypothetically) cannot provide for clean water and soil, does it give a Green signal to all foreign companies to operate in India without following their own safety norms? Really poor arguement that. As far as cleaning the place up is concerned, there is only so much cleaning that can be done superficially. The gas has caused mutations which will be carried forward to the next generation(s) and also many respiratory disorders, Prevalence of these is high even among those who were born years after the disaster. And this is not the first time a US company has gone to another country and operated with scant regard for the ecosystem/ human life. You can read up on the impact Shell's oil extraction had on Nigeria's ecology and even polity.
jusarrived Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Top post That was a post ? I skipped thinking it was a old article :giggle:
Mariyam Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 That was a post ? I skipped thinking it was a old article :giggle: :(( It was my post. :hitler: However, I will take your comment as a compliment. :giggle:
jusarrived Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Shouldn't we? Union Carbide is now owned by Dow Chemicals. The gas leak is directly responsible for the deaths of nearly 25,000+ people over the years. Many many more have been disabled and the future generations will bear symptoms of the toxicity of the gas. 2 lakh plus children exposed to the gas(es). Safety standards weren't maintained ( according to the testimony of mid level managers, workers) so that profits could be maximized. The orders were from the highest echelons of the management- and that amounts to culpable homicide. (Leaving aside the finer judicial details for now). We all know where Warren Anderson is today. Whats even more disheartening is that in spite of being a numerically visible and economically strong diaspora in the USA, the Indians there haven't had any concerted efforts to bring Warren Anderson to justice. ( Many of our politicians are also complicit in his repatriation, no doubt, but thats besides the point). As an analogy, would Israel participate in an Olympics event in which one of the companies that manufactured the nerve gases of the concentration camps was a major sponsor? IMO, we should boycott these Olympics. Boycotting the opening ceremony means nothing. Further more, if the US refuses to extradite Anderson, we should send our helicopters to his house and execute him in an overnight operation. He should then be buried at sea. :P Completely agree . lol @ boycotting the opening ceremony
EnterTheVoid Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 We should just boycott the Olympics completely' date=' not like the world is going to care or miss us. We are pathetic at sports in general, will never be any good, too much corruption and mismanagement.[/quote'] Moronic reasoning of epic proportions. If you suck at something, simply give up. Not work hard and improve, take the easy way and give up.
Mariyam Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Moronic reasoning of epic proportions. If you suck at something, simply give up. Not work hard and improve, take the easy way and give up. Sree anna, That guy does the same in all threads. Tries to wind up people with his 'reasoning' and when called out, beats a hasty retreat. Don't bother with him.
jusarrived Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 :(( It was my post. :hitler: However, I will take your comment as a compliment. :giggle: just saying it was too long :icflove: & here i think twice b4 contributing my one liners
EnterTheVoid Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Sree anna, That guy does the same in all threads. Tries to wind up people with his 'reasoning' and when called out, beats a hasty retreat. Don't bother with him. Cheers but I am not anna. I am 2 years your junior, going by the information provided on your profile page. Postgraduate, at present.
Sidhoni Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 I do not think the whole Olympics should be boycotted, but they can think of something else to protest against Dow.
Trichromatic Posted March 11, 2012 Posted March 11, 2012 Should India boycott London Olympics? Should India do so as it seems Dow will remain sponsor of Olympics?
Stuge Posted March 11, 2012 Author Posted March 11, 2012 Nobody cares until you take a step or send a strong message ,but boycotting Olympics isn't a child's play .Olympics can make or break carrier's of many athletes .Its the athletes who's carriers are at stake .So Athletes should be asked before anyone in my opinion.
Sidhoni Posted March 11, 2012 Posted March 11, 2012 Being a person who lives in Bhopal, I say that they should not be boycotted. The athletes have been working hard for about 4 years and its not that if we boycott the games, the compensation that is left to be paid, will be paid.
Sachin=GOD Posted March 11, 2012 Posted March 11, 2012 It would be foolish to boycott the Olympics for this reason. Here's an interesting article on Dow's responsibility in this entire case: Our's to Dow or die! I've begun to dread phone calls from Pertie. He has an uncanny knack of raising awkward subjects on which his invariably turns out to be the right view. I'm usually on the losing side. Last week was no different. "Is India justified in demanding Dow Chemicals be dropped as a sponsor of the London Olympics?" I knew it wasn't an innocent question but still fell into the trap. "Why not? After all, when Dow bought Union Carbide it also acquired its liabilities and perhaps the most important is responsibility for what happened in Bhopal in 1984. Now, if Dow won't acknowledge that, is it fitting it should be an Olympic sponsor?" "Hang on. Check your facts. Given that the Indian Supreme Court in 1989 negotiated a full and final settlement, which the government readily accepted and which was twice upheld on appeal, the question of legal responsibility has been settled once and for all. So what responsibility are you talking about?" "What about the fact that the settlement turned out to be grossly inadeq-uate? And what about the environmental damage that needs rectification? If that's not Dow's responsibility, who's is it?" "The Indian government's! And do you know why?" Pertie paused for me to say something but I decided silence was the better part of valour. Before long he continued. "Because the Supreme Court in the 1991 appeal ruled that if the settlement proved inadequate it would be the responsibility of the government to make up the shortfall. That's the legal position. And, very clearly, no responsibility devolves on Dow." I must say the facts had me stumped. Pertie knew them pat. So, drawing a deep breath, I tried a new tactic. "What about moral responsibility? As Union Carbide's successor company, Dow can't escape from that." "Now this is an interesting one. First, moral responsibility is an undefined and vague concept. Second, it has to be accepted. It can't be enforced. Third, in the absence of any legal culpability I'm not sure what it amounts to." "Oh come," I spoke up, suddenly sensing a chink in his armour. "Moral responsibility flows from ethics and fair play. And, remember that's what the Olympics is all about. The charter specifically says so." "Not so fast, old chap." Pertie was not be put off his stride so easily. "Again, check the facts. Dow bought Union Carbide in 1999, 15 years after the Bhopal tragedy. Second, in 1994 Union Carbide sold Union Carbide India to an Indian company then called Mcleod Russel and now called Eveready. So if there is any moral responsibility, hasn't it been inherited by Eveready? How does it get passed on to Dow?" Once again, he had the clinching answer. Pertie had anticipated my questions and his ripostes were ready. "In which case what do you make of the brouhaha that's going on?" It was a weak way of deflecting the subject and it played straight into his hands. "This is nothing but politics. Once the Bhopal NGOs raised the issue, the government had to play along. Not to do so would have made them look callous. And in Britain its Labour MPs stirring the pot to keep Cameron on edge. Expediency in either case." "So will India end up boycotting the games if Dow continues as a sponsor?" "I doubt it." This time Pertie sounded calm and very certain. "That would annoy Indian athletes and spoil relations with Britain. Twenty eight years after Bhopal they definitely won't go that far!" Views expressed by the author are personal Hindustan Times
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