aceofbase Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 Well but this forum is a perfect proof that all is not well between Hindus and Muslims in India. The hate is evident. Indian Muslims are the among the better lot compared to other countries..they would rather be in India than pakistan...we have had muslim presidents, muslim captains and muslim superstars in bollywood .......few shining examples of India's secularism...Can a minority even live a decent life in Pakistan??
Clarke Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 If it were up to me, I'd have martial arts as compulsory curriculum. Besides banning low iq paki morons who go around lecturing others on secularism of nations based on internet forum behavior. Its really pathetic when genuine discussions get distracted by these idiotic douchebags.
asterix Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 Guys...we can do without personal attacks. Saying Paki morons could really be a personal attack on you... I agree...
Shivaji bhonsle Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 There is a difference between criticism and hate. Anyway I don't want to waste my time on this yet again. You are free to criticize Hinduism if you find something wrong with it. Don't run away. Every religion should be mocked and questioned. If you don't question, you are not evolving. Religions have to be criticized, mocked .
Guldozer Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 You are free to criticize Hinduism if you find something wrong with it. Don't run away. Every religion should be mocked and questioned. If you don't question' date=' you are not evolving. Religions have to be criticized, mocked .[/quote'] Well I believe in not hurting anyone's personal beliefs. If you believe in something, who am I to question you? As long as they don't have a negative impact on my life. These arguments on religion are incredibly pointless and only end in a bitter manner. I have the right to disagree but I would be an idiot to constantly try to argue over religion , over and over again. And if you really believe in mocking religions and questioning them, why do I only see Islam being questioned?
Guldozer Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 Indian Muslims are the among the better lot compared to other countries..they would rather be in India than pakistan...we have had muslim presidents' date=' muslim captains and muslim superstars in bollywood .......few shining examples of India's secularism...Can a minority even live a decent life in Pakistan??[/quote'] Yes a minority can live a decent life in Pakistan, there are many. But the people I'm referring to are the people of this forum. They definitely aren't secular, with exceptions of course.
Guldozer Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 If it were up to me, I'd have martial arts as compulsory curriculum. Besides banning low iq paki morons who go around lecturing others on secularism of nations based on internet forum behavior. Its really pathetic when genuine discussions get distracted by these idiotic douchebags. I'm sorry I'm not as intelligent as you. Teach me your ways. :haha: Please continue with your 'genuine' discussions (read hate).
Guldozer Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 And we are running into the same typical cycle...this argument isn't going anywhere. I don't have enough time to waste on these childish discussions.
zen Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 Well I believe in not hurting anyone's personal beliefs. If you believe in something' date=' who am I to question you?[b'] As long as they don't have a negative impact on my life. These arguments on religion are incredibly pointless and only end in a bitter manner. I have the right to disagree but I would be an idiot to constantly try to argue over religion , over and over again. And if you really believe in mocking religions and questioning them, why do I only see Islam being questioned? In a secular society, "a bad apple can spoil the whole lot" so many people do not like to wait and watch. For e.g. protesting against Yoga based on religious grounds is stupid and this came from an Muslim organization so naturally it would be criticized Almost all religions are being mocked / criticized / hated / questioned, except for may be religions such as Buddhism There are numerous discussions on a) Hindu extremists who try to do absurd things but Hinduism in general does not preach extreme things (for e.g. forceful conversions). It is rightly criticized for its infamous caste system which may have had meaning in the past but certainly not in the modern era b) Christians who try to convert poor people or in tribal areas Also people of other religions in India by and large practise Uniform Civil Code, while Muslims are allowed to practise Islamic Laws, so this is often a topic of discussion (personally, I have no major issues with this). Additionally, there is Islamic militancy (ISIS, AQ, etc.) which justifies its actions based on Koran and Allah, so naturally this invites discussion on the religion Finally, Ind's arch-enemy is Pakistan which tries to fight (including using militancy with people like Hafiz Saeed using Islam to spread hatred against India) on issues such as Kashmir based on religious grounds (Islam) .... Pakistani soldiers and sponsored militants attack Ind shouting "Allah hu Akbar" .... Pak's atom bomb is dubbed as "Islamic Bomb" So with so much going on, it is natural that there would be more discussions on Islam. A rational person should be able to understand this. With so many things going around, I don't know why would you act as if there is injustice against Islam?! Are you trying to suggest that we should also be criticizing religions such as Buddhism too as much as Islam? Or because religions such as Buddhism are not criticized as much, it is injustice/propaganda against Islam? Smell the coffee!
moniker Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 Yes a minority can live a decent life in Pakistan, there are many. But the people I'm referring to are the people of this forum. They definitely aren't secular, with exceptions of course. You should read up the definition of secularism. People can't be secular, the state can. India is secular because it does not have a state religion. Some intolerant people spouting rubbish doesn't equate to the Indian government accepting some religion as the state religion.
panther Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 I love my country BUT I hate Vande Mataram. Some Indian can answer that. I respect other faiths BUT I hate their false gods/idols/practices/books. I don't respect other faiths but I respect others right to practice Even though I believe they are all false. I love freedom of expression BUT behead those who insult my faith. I don't love freedom of expression in it's totality It does not even exist, In Islam insulting even false gods is prohibited in the Quran. I believe in equal rights BUT I can marry 4 women. Men and women are not equal. men have some rights over women and Women have some rights over men In Islam. I respect women BUT they should cover themselves completely. Irrelevant point. My God is merciful BUT He has created hell for non believers, no non believer no matter how good can be spared from hell and even a rapist/terrorist from my faith will land in heaven. No person will enter Paradise through his actions, It is through faith and the mercy of Allah that one will enter paradise. I am most capable and powerful because I follow the correct faith BUT give me quota in jobs/education. Some Indian can answer that. Not saying that all from that community are like that but quite a few are hypocrites.
zen Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 No person will enter Paradise through his actions' date=' It is through faith and the mercy of Allah that one will enter paradise. [/quote'] Thanks for that info. FYI, that is opposite of what is taught in Hinduism where you enter paradise based on your actions (Karma). And this encourages people to do good deeds It could be assumed that because in Islam the path to paradise depends up on the faith and mercy of Allah, one could be encouraged to think that no matter what good or bad one does, if the person has faith and the mercy of Allah, he/she will enter paradise .... To stretch the idea a little, one could even kill in the name of Allah (which could show faith), and if Allah is merciful, you can enter paradise Now I could be wrong, but it appears as if it is easier to misinterpret what is implied in Islam/Koran :hmmm:
dial_100 Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 In Islam insulting even false gods is prohibited in the Quran You name all your important monuments, missiles etc after all the invaders who did not follow Islam. Who insulted false gods for centuries and you are okay with it? I guess you are. So anything against others is .. NO PROBLEM. anything against islam, a problem? At least you should stop contributing to anything that deals with India Muslims. Most indian muslims do not consider these invaders as their heros unlike most in your country. No person will enter Paradise through his actions, It is through faith and the mercy of Allah that one will enter paradise. So even if I dont follow Islam correctly but i still have a faith in it and i still get to enter in the paradise? Wow nice theory. That means all these cruel invaders are already sitting in paradise right?? Why would i want to be next to them anyways. :haha:
zen Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 Most indian muslims do not consider these invaders as their heros unlike most in your country. I won't be surprised if many in Pakistan see themselves as Arabs than what they actually are (South Asians) :P .... In trying to differentiate themselves from India, many in Pak could have forgotten their true identity
panther Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 Thanks for that info. FYI, that is opposite of what is taught in Hinduism where you enter paradise based on your actions (Karma). And this encourages people to do good deeds It could be assumed that because in Islam the path to paradise depends up on the faith and mercy of Allah, one could be encouraged to think that no matter what good or bad one does, if the person has faith and the mercy of Allah, he/she will enter paradise .... To stretch the idea a little, one could even kill in the name of Allah (which could show faith), and if Allah is merciful, you can enter paradise Now I could be wrong, but it appears as if it is easier to misinterpret what is implied in Islam/Koran :hmmm: Islam also encourages people to do good deeds but Allah is clear in the quran that good deeds without faith are worthless. Yes even people who have killed can enter paradise through the mercy of Allah if he forgives them.
panther Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 In Islam insulting even false gods is prohibited in the Quran You name all your important monuments, missiles etc after all the invaders who did not follow Islam. Who insulted false gods for centuries and you are okay with it? I guess you are. So anything against others is .. NO PROBLEM. anything against islam, a problem? At least you should stop contributing to anything that deals with India Muslims. Most indian muslims do not consider these invaders as their heros unlike most in your country. No person will enter Paradise through his actions, It is through faith and the mercy of Allah that one will enter paradise. So even if I dont follow Islam correctly but i still have a faith in it and i still get to enter in the paradise? Wow nice theory. That means all these cruel invaders are already sitting in paradise right?? Why would i want to be next to them anyways. :haha: Well for me Ahmad shah Abdali is a hero for us pushtuns because he founded the Afghan nation, I do not have to defend every action of every king who conquered parts of India, for you guys ashoka is great but he also killed many people. So you have already put those people in heaven, Allah is the best of judges no soul will be delt with unjustly.
zen Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 Islam also encourages people to do good deeds but Allah is clear in the quran that good deeds without faith are worthless. Yes even people who have killed can enter paradise through the mercy of Allah if he forgives them. I will try to read Koran one day to understand it. I am sure it would be a good learning experience Let's try to understand what you interpreted by looking at the two examples below: A is not religious but a Muslim by birth. He is a kind nobleman. He feeds poor and hungry, donates clothes to those who shiver in cold, offers science based education to kids, and provides medicine to those in need for free. The entire population in the area vouch of his kindnesses and the positive difference he is making to their lives B is fanatically religious. He thinks that his job is to make more and more people believe in Allah. Those who do not comply with his wishes, he kills them in the name of Allah. He kills his own family to become the ruler and goes on to rule his citizens with an iron hand. Because he is very devoted, he never forgets his Namaz. So much so that even during a battle, he does his Namaz without the fear of getting killed Both A and B die on the same day and only one spot is open in the paradise. You are to make a recommendation. So which one (A or B) would you recommend for a berth in the paradise?
panther Posted June 3, 2015 Posted June 3, 2015 I will try to read Koran one day to understand it. I am sure it would be a good learning experience Let's try to understand what you interpreted by looking at the two examples below: A is not religious but a Muslim by birth. He is a kind nobleman. He feeds poor and hungry, donates clothes to those who shiver in cold, offers science based education to kids, and provides medicine to those in need for free. The entire population in the area vouch of his kindnesses and the positive difference he is making to their lives B is fanatically religious. He thinks that his job is to make more and more people believe in Allah. Those who do not comply with his wishes, he kills them in the name of Allah. He kills his own family to become the ruler and goes on to rule his citizens including Muslims with an iron hand. Because he is very devoted, he never forgets his Namaz. So much so that even during a battle, he does his Namaz without the fear of getting killed Both A and B die on the same day and only one spot is open in the paradise. You are to make a recommendation. So which one (A or B) would you recommend for a berth in the paradise? Well your question is flawed firstly because there is no limited spaces in paradise, Allah will forgive whomsoever he wills. Look it is not my job to compel this person to paradise and this person to hell only the all knowing, seeing Allah can do that as he is the best of judges. But what we do know from The Quran is that Only those who have faith can attain paradise that is not to say that they can not be punished but eventually if they had even an ounce of faith Allah will forgive them.
Recommended Posts