Worst Bowling figures in ODI (most runs conceded)

[adi B]

truth be told i thought before odi 5 indian bowlers did quite ok in the series.

nah,only the spinners.barring the Indore odi ,mohit and booby went 6.5+ an over in every match.mohit was decent in Chennai only

[Debutant]

Did I see people blabbering about control here. Booby koomar keeps bowling full tosses whenever he tries to bowl a yorker. I don't know how he has control. No speed, no swing and no damn control too.

[rkt.india]

I would take Mohit anyday over Yadav in Subcontinent conditions. C'mmon RKT ..you know what I am talking about. In these type of flat batting pitches you need bowlers with variations - back of the hand slower balls, cutters, surprise bouncers etc. Just running and bowling fast without any control will not work. Lets put it this way I would take bowlers like Bravo, Balaji, Sohail Khan, Azhar Mehmood etc. anyday over someone like Mohammed Shami (Pakistani one). Yadav is a must in tests and can play in overseas ODIs but in these conditions, a big no no. Even in Bangladesh last year when likes of Binny, Mohit were making mockery of their batting...Yadav was going over 6rpo

Umesh Yadav could not even feature regularly in playing XI for KKR neither does Aaron for RCB. MS Dhoni is not the leader of those 2 teams so why you think they are dropped? That is because as a skipper you are always scared to play bowlers who lacks control. Then compare the bowlers like Bravo, Mohit etc. how well they perform in IPL. Now you would say IPL should not be an yardstick for internationals but the point is if they cannot even feature in their IPL teams how are they certainity in Indian national side?

Dont take me worng I am a big fan of fast bowling but not at the expense of control. I am not asking Umesh to become Mcgrath overnight but he lacks control big big time. In test matches it works but in ODI's he will go for more often than not 10-0-64-2.

I would take a line and length trundler anyday over an erratic fast bowler. Sorry.

My ODI bowling attack going forward will be:

Ishant Sharma

Mohammed Shami

Bhuv Kumar

Ashwin

Jadeja

Didnt BK play last game with Mohit, both reincarnation of McGrath, and we conceded the biggest total ever in India. Those two conceded 189 runs in 17 overs. We are still losing no matter who you play, so, I will prefer losing by playing fast bowlers because those type of bowlers have more probability of succeeding in long term. Regarding IPL, KKR a lot of times play 4 spinners on Eden rank turner and regarding RCB, every bowler gets thrashed on Bengalore paatta and the smallest ground you will ever find, so, they keep changing bowlers after every 2nd game. 

[misty]

I think when Ishant return at Banglore we should stick with bhuvi instead of  umesh in test matches.ind. never need 3 seamer in india in test

I would rather like 3 spinner in all 8 innings vs proteas.Umesh use to take wickets during long time ago when he debut for india but he gave too much runs lately with no wicket.

Mohd Shami's coach recently predict,'' its not Risk for india,to select shami in test matches''.india needs him in Mohali,he is kind of bowler who always among wicket plus abitily to play cameo innings while we have to hide umesh to number 11, Recently umesh hits 128 in ranji trophy vs ordinary team does not mean india find allrounder for 2016WC.

For awhile I think for Mohali [ if MS not recover from fitness as seam bowler ] we should have Bhuvi/umesh  and 3 spinner Sir jadeja-Ashwin-Mishra.

Looks like india has edge over Proteas in test but indian batting vs Tahir-Harmer-piedt  not easy as Tendulkar warns india vs tahir..he is totally diffrant sort of bowler in test matches. any way kohli wants to dominate india for next 5 years with 5 bowler in test.During 70's we had 4 bowler  and opening batsman,shared bowling with seam bowler than spinner take over from the 3rd. over til 90th over, it could be prabhakar.Aabid Ali or some other opener, that trend change now we have 5 specialist bowler minus all rounder and our keeper not @‌ good with the bat unless MSD,good luck saha vs Phillander in test matches.i wish Rabada plays test

Nightmare for india with combination of  Rabada/Styne/Phillander and Harmer./ Imran T.i doubt if Bavuma make it for test but Elgar/Van Zyl/villas very much in line for test selection.i heard herby @‌ married man, wants to play in test matches vs SA.

 

 

[misty]

rkt india

I think india should includes shami for todays 30/31 game vs proteas inplace of Nathu singh before includes him in  test directly, Ajmal fit to play for Pakistan but Haq think' he is not same bowler with restriction'

here is fitness issue,we can not efford unfit bowler in 5 day game.why india turn to mohit for test matches?.i can select even nathu singh or Thakur because they have to sends 18 balls in 5 days otherwise my spinner take over entire burden of  rest of overs.i predict series 2/2. southafrica not loose test series outside of southafrica since 2006.

Edited October 30, 2015 by misty

[rkt.india]

rkt india

I think india should includes shami for todays 30/31 game vs proteas inplace of Nathu singh before includes him in  test directly, Ajmal fit to play for Pakistan but Haq think' he is not same bowler with restriction'

here is fitness issue,we can not efford unfit bowler in 5 day game.

Shami hasnt played cricket since his knee surgery. He will have to first play Ranji trophy and prove his fitness only then he will be selected for test team.

[express bowling]

Even in ODIs I feel the objective should be to pick bowlers who give a nice mix between wicket taking ability and economy rate...or has the potential to provide this mix. 

Demarcation must be made between economical bowlers and accurate bowlers because, we usually see, that short trundlers often go for runs even if they are accurate. This fact gets magnified when there is no variation in the pace attack and all are short trundlers. It becomes too predictable and the batsmen are very comfortable.

In ODIs

Umesh 72 wickets from 52 matches @ 1.38 wickets per match, average 32.23, eco 5.8

Bhuvi 60 wickets from 55 matches @ 1.09 wickets per match, average 36.45, eco 4.8

Mohit 31 wickets from 26 matches @ 1.19 wickets per match, average 32.90, eco 5.5

Shami 87 wickets from 47 matches @ 1.85 wickets per match, average 24.89, eco 5.5

Ishant 106  wickets from 76 matches @ 1.39 wickets per match, average 31.25, eco 5.7

This clearly shows that, apart from Bhuvi ( very economical ) , the economy of all the other pacers are very comparable.

Shami is the stand-out wicket taker followed by Ishant and Umesh. Bhuvi is not an ODI wicket taker and Mohit is not that good either.

All these facts must be considered carefully before choosing our ODI pace attack.

Edited October 30, 2015 by express bowling

[Mosher]

Even in ODIs I feel the objective should be to pick bowlers who give a nice mix between wicket taking ability and economy rate...or has the potential to provide this mix. 

Demarcation must be made between economical bowlers and accurate bowlers because, we usually see, that short trundlers often go for runs even if they are accurate. This fact gets magnified when there is no variation in the pace attack and all are short trundlers. It becomes too predictable and the batsmen are very comfortable.

In ODIs

Umesh 72 wickets from 52 matches @ 1.38 wickets per match, average 32.23, eco 5.8

Bhuvi 60 wickets from 55 matches @ 1.09 wickets per match, average 36.45, eco 4.8

Mohit 31 wickets from 26 matches @ 1.19 wickets per match, average 32.90, eco 5.5

Shami 87 wickets from 47 matches @ 1.85 wickets per match, average 24.89, eco 5.5

Ishant 106  wickets from 76 matches @ 1.39 wickets per match, average 31.25, eco 5.7

This clearly shows that, apart from Bhuvi ( very economical ) , the economy of all the other pacers are very comparable.

Shami is the stand-out wicket taker followed by Ishant and Umesh. Bhuvi is not an ODI wicket taker and Mohit is not that good either.

All these facts must be considered carefully before choosing our ODI pace attack.

But these facts dont matter to Dhoni. Once he makes up his mind on some bowler, his opinion of him wont change no matter what. Even commentators keep blabbering about some bowlers like Umesh being really expensive without looking at the facts. There is not much to choose between the bowlers based on economy except Bhuvi. Mohit is most useless among the bowlers neither a wicket taker nor a economical bowler. He is only there in ODI team because of the Dhoni.

Edited October 30, 2015 by Mosher

[Laaloo]

But these facts dont matter to Dhoni. Once he makes up his mind on some bowler, his opinion of him wont change no matter what. Even commentators keep blabbering about some bowlers like Umesh being really expensive without looking at the facts. There is not much to choose between the bowlers based on economy except Bhuvi. Mohit is most useless among the bowlers neither a wicket taker nor a economical bowler. He is only there in ODI team because of the Dhoni.

Dhoni and his chamchas on this site dont let facts get in their way. Mohit has been useless since his debut. Gotta pick bowlers on their merit something which our captain jackal doesnt do.

[Mosher]

in asia

mohit-eco 6.52 ,avg-42 in 11 matches

umesh eco-6.02 ,avg-29 in 21 matches

 

in india 

mohit-eco 6.93 ,avg-61 in 7 matches

umesh eco-5.65 ,avg-26 in 14 matches

Thanks. This is really eye opening for some people who still blindly believe Mohit is a better bowler than Umesh.

[Laaloo]

in asia

mohit-eco 6.52 ,avg-42 in 11 matches

umesh eco-6.02 ,avg-29 in 21 matches

 

in india 

mohit-eco 6.93 ,avg-61 in 7 matches

umesh eco-5.65 ,avg-26 in 14 matches

Umesh Yadav sucks - Dhoni

[rkt.india]

Notice how that list is full of trundlers

Southee used to be a trundle

 

Holder is also a trundle at around 133 KPH but with height

Tall trundlers can work because the bounce they get. Southee is 6'4 and can bowl good yorkers.

[express bowling]

Even in ODIs I feel the objective should be to pick bowlers who give a nice mix between wicket taking ability and economy rate...or has the potential to provide this mix. 

Demarcation must be made between economical bowlers and accurate bowlers because, we usually see, that short trundlers often go for runs even if they are accurate. This fact gets magnified when there is no variation in the pace attack and all are short trundlers. It becomes too predictable and the batsmen are very comfortable.

In ODIs

Umesh 72 wickets from 52 matches @ 1.38 wickets per match, average 32.23, eco 5.8

Bhuvi 60 wickets from 55 matches @ 1.09 wickets per match, average 36.45, eco 4.8

Mohit 31 wickets from 26 matches @ 1.19 wickets per match, average 32.90, eco 5.5

Shami 87 wickets from 47 matches @ 1.85 wickets per match, average 24.89, eco 5.5

Ishant 106  wickets from 76 matches @ 1.39 wickets per match, average 31.25, eco 5.7

This clearly shows that, apart from Bhuvi ( very economical ) , the economy of all the other pacers are very comparable.

Shami is the stand-out wicket taker followed by Ishant and Umesh. Bhuvi is not an ODI wicket taker and Mohit is not that good either.

All these facts must be considered carefully before choosing our ODI pace attack.

These stats clearly prove that not choosing faster bowlers in ODIs because they are not as good and more expensive is a grossly incorrect notion that Dhoni has. 

Dhoni needs to be see these stats. Mohit Sharma is as expensive as the faster bowlers and can't take as many wickets as them. The much maligned Ishant Sharma is among the better ones. Shami is really good and if he is left out because he is pacy then that would be madness.

 

 

[express bowling]

CRICBUZZ ARTICLE

Venkatesh Prasad: Are the Indian seamers thinking for themselves?

Last updated on Saturday, 31 October, 2015, 07:28 AM

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India's forte was never producing tear-away pacers, so they must look to protect their swing bowlers, feels Venkatesh Prasad.

 

- By Venkatesh Prasad

India's struggles with the ball against South Africa have opened a Pandora's Box of questions regarding the culture of excellence within the team, the long-term selection policies and the quality of ideas being generated by the team management.

I was surprised by the lack of imagination shown by our frontline seam bowlers in crisis situations. A quality seam bowler needs to judge the trigger movement of the batsman. He needs insight, ingenuity and a set of skillful variations. He needs to know when to serve up a change of pace, when to set a particular field, when to try a yorker or the shorter one and how to wriggle out of tough situations.

Are the bowlers being taught to think for themselves? This is very, very important in international cricket and raises the issue of what the team management is doing - is it providing the bowlers with a Plan A, Plan B and Plan C? Is it asking bowlers to express their own views on particular issues, and learn if they are confident of implementing them? Is the management, in turn, confident of a bowler going ahead with his own plans?
At this level, it is all about performing under pressure. The management must ensure bowlers can think on their feet. At the moment, the seam and spin bowlers seem to be bringing a Twenty20 thought process into the ODI game - it is all right to go for seven runs an over in a T20, so the bowlers don't seem to mind if they go for seven runs an over in an ODI, too.This perception needs to change.

This is why Ashwin is India's most successful bowler, since he is also the one who bowls with the most intelligence. It is the team management's job to inculcate the right approach - there is no point correcting technique at this level. What is needed is a fresh set of ideas to enable every bowler to handle his responsibility, and his body, the best he can.

Injury management is another area where the team management plays a key role, because a bowler must be trained to think for himself what his workload can be, and how he will train within the constraints of his physique. Knowing your personal fitness schedule is key. Zaheer Khan was a master when it came to this.

If the thought process is not right, it needs to be questioned if enough is being done to nurture a culture of excellence within the team. I am all for multiple captains and it can work in India. However, there is a tendency within dressing rooms here to lean towards one side or the other. Excellence, or attitude towards fitness, should not be about taking sides.

Now let me address some longterm concerns. There has been debate over whether control and accuracy is to be preferred over out-and-out pace when it comes to the selection of seam bowlers. Every captain has a right to think differently. My own viewpoint is that India has always struggled to produce genuine pace bowlers who can scare batsmen, so looking for them around every corner may be a waste of time.

This penchant for pace developed in the 2000s when some of the batsmen in the team struggled to cope with real pace. India has, of course, produced only a handful of fast bowlers who were both quick and accurate - Javagal Srinath is one, and Ishant Sharma in his prime was another. But swing and control is our forte, because genetically we may be a bit lacking when it comes to producing fast bowlers with threatening pace who can remain injury free and bowl with control.

This is why reports of Bhuvneshwar Kumar trying to increase his pace after his injury are worrying. He is a swing bowler first, and a very good one at that. He must keep the ball longer in the air to enable it to swing. Trying to hit the deck hard to scare batsmen will not work for him.

As for Ishant, he is very committed when it comes to his fitness, and that is why he has lasted longer than many bowlers who played for India in the recent past and faded away after a good season. But he still does not look like he can lead the attack - he is either very good on a particular day, or not. There is no in-between with him. If he can find his rhythm, he is impressive.There is no consistency. That is a worrying factor.

Last, but certainly not the least, is the selection policy. Bowlers should be selected for ODIs and Tests based on Ranji Trophy performance, not Indian Premier League (IPL). The new generation of players are in danger of lowering the bar a bit when it comes to their ambitions -playing for the country should be of paramount importance. For long-term improvement of Team India's bowling health, selectors must retain a sense of perspective.

(As said to Partha Bhaduri.) 

http://www.cricbuzz.com/cricket-news/75528/venkatesh-prasad-former-india-cricket-bowler-are-the-indian-seamers-thinking-for-themselves

Edited October 31, 2015 by express bowling

[rkt.india]

Typical Indian mindset. We cant produce genuine pace bowlers rubbish.

[express bowling]

Typical Indian mindset. We cant produce genuine pace bowlers rubbish.

He was our bowling coach for so long. God only knows what he did.

And there are so so many such people in our cricketing fraternity who are impeding the  development and inclusion  of genuine quicks in our country.

Edited October 31, 2015 by express bowling

[Mosher]

Venky spouting rubbish. India has recently produced genuine pace bowlers like Umesh and Aaron and will keep producing such quick bowlers. It's another matter that they are taking a long time to develop into really good strike bowlers. So that is the area where BCCI needs to focus on. Getting good bowling coaches can certainly help in that regard. In India we have people like Venky, Manju, Gavaskar etc who have this fetish, a strange obsession with medium pacers. It's like they don't want to see fast Indian bowlers but cream their pants in excitement(especially Manju) when they see a genuine quick from other countries.

Edited October 31, 2015 by Mosher

[Malcolm Merlyn]

One thing that must be kept away from Indian bowlers is Venky Prasad.

[Silva]

 

Now let me address some longterm concerns. There has been debate over whether control and accuracy is to be preferred over out-and-out pace when it comes to the selection of seam bowlers. Every captain has a right to think differently. My own viewpoint is that India has always struggled to produce genuine pace bowlers who can scare batsmen, so looking for them around every corner may be a waste of time.

 

We have no accurate bowlers that are in the international bowling rotation. Mohit and BK are not accurate. They are spray guns if you compare them to someone like Philander. 

To me an accurate bowler is someone who can pick up wickets consistently when their is no seam movement or swing available. 

[CG]