Yes, Dhoni fans are Pakistanis

[sourab10forever]

Dhoni should stay in the LOi team..But should give up his captaincy. Very unlikely to happen given his ego but India's LOI team needs his keeping and virats captaincy both at the same time. Unfortunate :(

 

[express bowling]

14 hours ago, Cricketics said:

 who still averaging 50s in ODi and when our ODI batting does not even look settled?

 

If Dhoni's average was massively dropping, then I would agree to drop him, but he's been scoring runs in ODI's.

 

 

 

Dhoni's batting form has dropped sharply in ODIs in the last 2 years.  Excluding Zimbabwe, he is averaging just 34.7 in this period and the main main problem has been his SR.....which has dropped to only 82, although he has batted below No. 4 in 19 of the 27 games in this period.

 

Dhoni had an average of 51  and SR of  88  before this period against non-minnows .....in an era when finishers had SR of 85 to 95...he had such a good SR.  Now, with top finishers having SR of 105 to 145.....his SR has actually come down to 82.

 

This is the precise reason why Dhoni himself wants to bat at No.4.  If he can adjust to this role then he can play on.....no problem.  If he cannot, then .....

 

 

Career averages   Span Mat Inns NO Runs HS Ave BF SR 100 50 0 4s 6s   unfiltered 2004-2016 283 246 67 9110 183* 50.89 10259 88.80 9 61 8 705 197 Profile filtered 2015-2016 27 26 2 833 92* 34.70 1008 82.63 0 4 1 60 18

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/28081.html?class=2;filter=advanced;opposition=1;opposition=2;opposition=25;opposition=3;opposition=4;opposition=5;opposition=7;opposition=8;orderby=default;spanmax1=01+Jan+2017;spanmin1=01+Jan+2015;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

 

[Cricketics]

^the stats prove that his strike rate came down because he had to also play the role of anchoring the innigs plenty of times since we haven't had settled middle order as only Kohli has added runs consistently along with Rohit on top. Yes, he doesn't possess the same power probably consistently but he is still scoring. Averaging 35 coming down, and that being one of his worst years, isn't bad. This is still better than most. He needs to come up because Indian batting order has struggled big time and he is trying to only strengthen it. 

 

Hence, there is no reason to replace Dhoni. Or you think there is? You want Dhoni dropped? Please list me a team without Dhoni. 

[express bowling]

23 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

^the stats prove that his strike rate came down because he had to also play the role of anchoring the innigs plenty of times since we haven't had settled middle order as only Kohli has added runs consistently along with Rohit on top. Yes, he doesn't possess the same power probably consistently but he is still scoring. Averaging 35 coming down, and that being one of his worst years, isn't bad.

It is last  2 years, not one.

 

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This is still better than most. He needs to come up because Indian batting order has struggled big time and he is trying to only strengthen it. 

 

We have a very strong top 3 in Rohit, Dhawan and Kohli ( averages of  54, 41 and 52 in the last 2 years excluding Zim )  ....Pandey did well in Australia as a No.4....Rahul is another good batsman who has been added to the team and will probably play in the top 4.  There was and is no need for another batter to anchor the innings.

 

Dhoni is batting at no.4 as he himself said that his power game has deteriorated and he is unable to finish games with consistency nowadays.

If anything, our No.5 and No. 6 positions are open now. It is incorrect to say that Dhoni is coming up to bolster an already strong top 4.

 

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Hence, there is no reason to replace Dhoni. Or you think there is? You want Dhoni dropped? Please list me a team without Dhoni. 

 

No, I do not want to drop Dhoni in ODIs....I just want to see how he does in his new role at No.4

But  I am not under the false impression that Dhoni is still a high average ODI batsman in the last 2 years.

 

Edited January 1, 2017 by express bowling

[Cricketics]

2 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

No, I do not want to drop Dhoni in ODIs....I just want to see how he does in his new role at No.4

But  I am not under the false impression that Dhoni is still a high average ODI batsman.

 

Sometimes people go too much into stats and that is where we go wrong. Dhoni has changed his slots, batted at times when he has come in late and has to just throw his bat in order to get quick runs, and that is where it is hard to maintain your average.

 

 

 

 

[express bowling]

3 hours ago, Cricketics said:

Sometimes people go too much into stats and that is where we go wrong. 

I stated the stats because you said that he is still averaging 50.   Fact is, it has come down to 50 because of him averaging in the  30s in the last 2 years.

 

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Dhoni has changed his slots, batted at times when he has come in late and has to just throw his bat in order to get quick runs, and that is where it is hard to maintain your average.

 

Dhoni has batted either in the same slots or at a higher slot  in the last 2 years.  In such a case, the need to throw his bat around either remains the same as before or reduces when he comes in early.

 

It is quite clear that Dhoni the ODI batsman has lost his fluency and his hitting ability has become more inconsistent in the last 2 years. The thing to see now is whether his new style of batting is suitable for the No. 4 role. I hope he does well at No. 4 because he has a wealth of experience chasing totals in ODIs.

Edited January 1, 2017 by express bowling

[Lannister]

1 minute ago, express bowling said:

It is quite clear that Dhoni the ODI batsman has lost his fluency and his hitting ability has become more inconsistent in the last 2 years. The thing to see now is whether his new style of batting is suitable for the No. 4 role. I hope he does well at No. 4 because he has a wealth of experience chasing totals in ODIs.

His new style of batting = hacking the ball with his eyes closed. The way he hacks his willow you would think the ball will go out of the stadium, but it hardly even reaches the bowler. 

[sourab10forever]

Rohit

Rahul

Kohli

Dhoni

Pandey/Raina

Pandya

*One slogger

Ashwin

Jadeja/Other spinner

Bumrah

Shami

That's a pretty good lineup untill CT2017. Dhoni at 4 is the best option we have. Only if we could find a proper slogger at 7 (sigh!)

[express bowling]

11 minutes ago, Lannister said:

His new style of batting = hacking the ball with his eyes closed. The way he hacks his willow you would think the ball will go out of the stadium, but it hardly even reaches the bowler. 

Dhoni's batting technique was not classical.   He did not always go to the pitch of the ball while hitting on the front foot  or did not always go to the line of the ball  but had tremendous reflexes by which he could make last second adjustments and still hit the ball.  Recently, his reflexes have slowed down and he is having problems hitting those same balls.  It is still easier on absolute flat decks but slightly challenging ones are posing problems. 

 

He will have to go to a more classical technique nowadays if he wants to continue his success.

Edited January 1, 2017 by express bowling

[Cricketics]

3 hours ago, express bowling said:

I stated the stats because you said that he is still averaging 50.   Fact is, it has come down to 50 because of averaging in the mid 30s in the last 2 years.

 

Dhoni has batted either in the same slots or at a higher slot  in the last 2 years.  In such a case, the need to throw his bat around either remains the same as before or reduces when he comes in early.

 

It is quite clear that Dhoni the ODI batsman has lost his fluency and his hitting ability has become more inconsistent in the last 2 years. The thing to see now is whether his new style of batting is suitable for the No. 4 role. I hope he does well at No. 4 because he has a wealth of experience chasing totals in ODIs.

And that is where people need to come back down to earth.

All of a sudden seeing our success in test matches, people have started going into their own fantassy world and are seeing our ODI team as world beaters if we drop Dhoni, like many seem to feel here. 

 

As much as it is fun to see new talent in the Indian team, not all of them can be tried at the same time. Some of them can be but not by dropping Dhoni. Dhoni's average drop just shows how bad we would have been had Dhoni's average been 35 few years ago. The fact is that in recent times only him and Kohli are the ones who have kept us going in ODI's and to some extent Rohit lately. 

 

Drop in Dhoni's average exposes only one thing that our batting was too dependent on his success and Kohli's. You can not always win when only same two guys are scoring.

 

Bring in some youngsters, but let them fight for other slots, but not for Dhoni's. 

 

Asking to drop Dhoni from ODI side is a very Pakistani kind of move. Fans who come out without any forethought. Watch same fans will be asking for the head of players likes like Pant, etc if they fail to impress in few games after replacing Dhoni.

 

[express bowling]

31 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

And that is where people need to come back down to earth.

All of a sudden seeing our success in test matches, people have started going into their own fantassy world and are seeing our ODI team as world beaters if we drop Dhoni, like many seem to feel here. 

 

Drop in Dhoni's average exposes only one thing that our batting was too dependent on his success and Kohli's. You can not always win when only same two guys are scoring.

 

Bring in some youngsters, but let them fight for other slots, but not for Dhoni's. 

 

Asking to drop Dhoni from ODI side is a very Pakistani kind of move. Fans who come out without any forethought. Watch same fans will be asking for the head of players likes like Pant, etc if they fail to impress in few games after replacing Dhoni.

I  am not asking for Dhoni to be dropped from the ODI side....as I have clearly stated before.

 

Why are you harping on about this point  ?     

 

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As much as it is fun to see new talent in the Indian team, not all of them can be tried at the same time. Some of them can be but not by dropping Dhoni. Dhoni's average drop just shows how bad we would have been had Dhoni's average been 35 few years ago. The fact is that in recent times only him and Kohli are the ones whonjabe kept us going in ODI's and to some extent Rohit lately. 

 

Kohli. Rohit and Dhawan have been our 3 best ODI batsmen in the last 2 years.....averaging 52, 54 and 41 respectively ( excluding Zim ). 

Edited January 1, 2017 by express bowling

[Cricketics]

3 minutes ago, express bowling said:

I  am not asking for Dhoni to be dropped from the ODI side....as I have clearly stated before.

 

Why are you harping on about this point  ?     

 

 

Kohli. Rohit and Dhawan have been our 3 best ODI batsmen in the last 2 years.....averaging 52, 54 and 41 respectively ( excluding Zim ). 

i am not saying you are asking. That is why I used "people".

 

Lot of people are asking to be dropped, if you check some of the earlier posts, even the ones where I have quoted some posters.

 

 

[New guy]

29 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

i am not saying you are asking. That is why I used "people".

 

Lot of people are asking to be dropped, if you check some of the earlier posts, even the ones where I have quoted some posters.

 

 

When the captain of a team changes, the entire team goes through a transformation and gets re-energized. This is what happened when Dhoni took over in 2007. Suddenly there was a new energy on the field and we looked like world beaters with the same players. The transformation was amazing. Every captain has a shelf life and things go stale in few years. The effect of a new captain is under-rated

[Cricketics]

2 minutes ago, New guy said:

When the captain of a team changes, the entire team goes through a transformation and gets re-energized. This is what happened when Dhoni took over in 2007. Suddenly there was a new energy on the field and we looked like world beaters with the same players. The transformation was amazing. Every captain has a shelf life and things go stale in few years. The effect of a new captain is under-rated

Yes, but changing captain and asking for a player to be dropped are two different things.