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Ankit_sharma03

India A vs Aus A - 4 day test series

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13 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

chahar???? is he even an option for test cricket

Nadeem...........WTH

Nadeem is better than most spinners. So, i dont mind that.  Would have liked Gopal in place of Kudeep though in this game.

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8 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Nadeem is better than most spinners. So, i dont mind that.  Would have liked Gopal in place of Kudeep though in this game.

u think he ll play for India 

Their is a line

Ashwin

JAdeja

Kuldeep

Chahal(whom now kohli wants, even ill say nadeem is better then him)

 

If its in India , axar will be as good or lil less then jadeja . We have a pace attack now if needed we can field 3 pacers in India. Shami, umesh, bumrah, siraj all are gr8 with reverse swing . Axar batting gives him an edge n m sure county will help his bowling.

Ashwin n jadeja now only play one format n what are the chances of them missing out injury. Nadeem cnt replace them but a wrist spinner can which is what our look out shud be . Gopal shud be in place of Nadeem not kuldeep, kuldeep wnt learn unless he plays red ball cricket and now is a good chance. During ranji he ll be on national duty most of the time.So when will Kuldeep develop his Red ball game and white ball cricket does give u bad habbbits after a point. Nadeem has played a lot of A games now , its kuldeep who needs to now.....

 

Our problem is in overseas condition we need to find some wrist spinners and gopal is not even play A games , rahul chahar is not even considered among 100 player who recent played A games, duleep trophy ......

 

A-games are rare and concentration shud be to find player who can play for India even if it means at times u hve ignore domestic performers for yrs. 

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25 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

u think he ll play for India 

Their is a line

Ashwin

JAdeja

Kuldeep

Chahal(whom now kohli wants, even ill say nadeem is better then him)

 

If its in India , axar will be as good or lil less then jadeja . We have a pace attack now if needed we can field 3 pacers in India. Shami, umesh, bumrah, siraj all are gr8 with reverse swing . Axar batting gives him an edge n m sure county will help his bowling.

Ashwin n jadeja now only play one format n what are the chances of them missing out injury. Nadeem cnt replace them but a wrist spinner can which is what our look out shud be . Gopal shud be in place of Nadeem not kuldeep, kuldeep wnt learn unless he plays red ball cricket and now is a good chance. During ranji he ll be on national duty most of the time.So when will Kuldeep develop his Red ball game and white ball cricket does give u bad habbbits after a point. Nadeem has played a lot of A games now , its kuldeep who needs to now.....

 

Our problem is in overseas condition we need to find some wrist spinners and gopal is not even play A games , rahul chahar is not even considered among 100 player who recent played A games, duleep trophy ......

 

A-games are rare and concentration shud be to find player who can play for India even if it means at times u hve ignore domestic performers for yrs. 

TBH , in his current state, I dont see a great red ball future for Kuldeep.  Brad Hogg was such an amazing bowler, but could never do it in tests and mind you Hogg was 100 times better LOI bowler than Kuldeep will ever be.  

 

Why we have hung all our hopes on Kuldeep? We need to try other spinners as well.  Test cricket needs more orthodox spinners, who can just keep things simple.  Look at Lyon, he is no magical big spinner or mystery spinner or a wrist spinner, still does the job for his team on those pitches in Australia.  It is just farcical thinking that you need a wrist spinner overseas.  We dont need a wrist spinner, we need a good spinner whether he is a finger spinner or a wrist spinner.  Wrist spinners are good for LOIs where batsmen attack and look to score runs and play shots and variation comes into play.  

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4 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

TBH , in his current state, I dont see a great red ball future for Kuldeep.  Brad Hogg was such an amazing bowler, but could never do it in tests and mind you Hogg was 100 times better LOI bowler than Kuldeep will ever be.  

 

Why we have hung all our hopes on Kuldeep? We need to try other spinners as well. 

Has he failed, we hvent tried him properly . 

How ru even declaring his case hopeless when he is so young in his career....he can go on to do better and even worse but its to early to say anything 

 

Hogg only played 7 test  out of which 1 was in 1996 which he himself has said he had no idea about his game then and last 3 vs India in Aus ....and that indian side had good players of spin .

4 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Test cricket needs more orthodox spinners, who can just keep things simple.  Look at Lyon, he is no magical big spinner or mystery spinner or a wrist spinner, still does the job for his team on those pitches in Australia.

Simple doesnt mean ordinary , nadeem is ordinary . If this guy was good enough he wud have made it yrs ago... 

A the end u need wkt taking spinners and kuldeep is one , all he needs is to be more disciplined but at the end the job is to take wkts 

We do have ashwin as orthodox spinner, jadeja is their as someone who controls one end and now need the other variety

 

4 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

It is just farcical thinking that you need a wrist spinner overseas.  We dont need a wrist spinner, we need a good spinner whether he is a finger spinner or a wrist spinner.  Wrist spinners are good for LOIs where batsmen attack and look to score runs and play shots and variation comes into play.  

Their is not rule but wrist spinner do get that extra bite . 

At this point we dnt have a spinner that is owning his place in overseas like Lyon does so every options needs to be looked at 

 

And in recent times our pacers are doing the job so a spinner who can come up n clean middle n lower middle will be handy which is what kuldeep can with his variety 

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49 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Has he failed, we hvent tried him properly . 

How ru even declaring his case hopeless when he is so young in his career....he can go on to do better and even worse but its to early to say anything 

 

Hogg only played 7 test  out of which 1 was in 1996 which he himself has said he had no idea about his game then and last 3 vs India in Aus ....and that indian side had good players of spin .

Simple doesnt mean ordinary , nadeem is ordinary . If this guy was good enough he wud have made it yrs ago... 

A the end u need wkt taking spinners and kuldeep is one , all he needs is to be more disciplined but at the end the job is to take wkts 

We do have ashwin as orthodox spinner, jadeja is their as someone who controls one end and now need the other variety

 

Their is not rule but wrist spinner do get that extra bite . 

At this point we dnt have a spinner that is owning his place in overseas like Lyon does so every options needs to be looked at 

 

And in recent times our pacers are doing the job so a spinner who can come up n clean middle n lower middle will be handy which is what kuldeep can with his variety 

I am talking current status of Kuldeep as he lacks any sort of control.  Regarding Nadeem, no he is not an ordinary spinner.  He has been as good or as bad as Jadeja or Kuldeep in FC cricket and has been among top wicket takers in domestic cricket.  Neither i am talking about playing Nadeem in test team.  We have some other bowlers to try as well.

 

Add Hogg's FC average was 40, the reason he played so less number of tests.

Edited by rkt.india

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4 hours ago, rkt.india said:

I am talking current status of Kuldeep as he lacks any sort of control. 

N how wud he get better if he doesnt play , what are we gaining playing nadeem

Kuldeep was selected as 3rd spinner means higher in pecking order 

4 hours ago, rkt.india said:

Regarding Nadeem, no he is not an ordinary spinner.  He has been as good or as bad as Jadeja or Kuldeep in FC cricket and has been among top wicket takers in domestic cricket. 

What point does does domestic cricket has now for jadeja n kuldeep when they have done well in international cricket where nadeem is yet to selected

N if he was that good he wud have been pushing them instead jadeja,kuldeep came ahead of him 

4 hours ago, rkt.india said:

Neither i am talking about playing Nadeem in test team.  We have some other bowlers to try as well.

We have to try gopal n even rahul chahar but thats where i dnt want nadeem....m pretty sure he ll never play for India 

And he already has played a lot of A-games 

4 hours ago, rkt.india said:

Add Hogg's FC average was 40, the reason he played so less number of tests.

He didnt play a lot of was also due to warne n mcgill and then he himself retired 

N how hogg did wud not decide kuldeep career its how kuldeep will take his career ahead.....it wud his hard work n hunger 

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What is the point of trying swing bowler Deepak Chahar in Unofficial tests before the Australia tour and home series against WI  ?  We don't need swing bowlers there.

 

If they had to try a swing bowler, it had to be before the England test series, when the A-team toured England.

Edited by express bowling

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On Saturday, September 08, 2018 at 1:04 PM, rkt.india said:

.  mind you Hogg was 100 times better LOI bowler than Kuldeep will ever be 

 

None of us are fortune tellers.

 

Quote

  Test cricket needs more orthodox spinners, who can just keep things simple.  Look at Lyon, he is no magical big spinner or mystery spinner or a wrist spinner,

 

Warne, Murali, Chandrasekhar ...  none of them were simple spinners ... but the first 2 are the two most successful spinners in test cricket history and Chandra was very successful too.  Even Kumble was unorthodox in his bowling style for a spinner.

 

Quote

  We dont need a wrist spinner, we need a good spinner whether he is a finger spinner or a wrist spinner.  Wrist spinners are good for LOIs where batsmen attack and look to score runs and play shots and variation comes into play.  

 

Kuldeep does not have that many variations.  Just the normal leg spinner and the googly.  And he is on his way to developing his flipper.

 

Quite simple in his approach I would say.  But batsmen can't read which way the ball will spin and that makes him a top prospect.

Edited by express bowling

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1 hour ago, express bowling said:

 

None of us see fortune tellers.

 

 

Warne, Murali, Chandrasekhar ...  none of them were simple spinners ... but the first 2 are the two most successful spinners in test cricket history and Chandra was very successful too.  Even Kumble was unorthodox in his bowling style for a spinner.

 

 

Kuldeep does not have that many variations.  Just the normal leg spinner and the googly.  And he is on his way to developing his flipper.

 

Quite simple in his approach I would say.

      Warne, Murali, Chandrasekhar ... .

       Simple spinners have never taken buckets of wickets in tests . Its only those who could not be read easily have been phenomenal and who had lot of guile.

   

 

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On 9/8/2018 at 12:12 PM, rkt.india said:

Nadeem is better than most spinners. So, i dont mind that.  Would have liked Gopal in place of Kudeep though in this game.

Your dislike for Kuldeep is obvious. A 5fer and 50 with bat. Kuldeep struggles with control at times but it's perfectly fine for his type of bowlers.

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1 hour ago, Pollack said:

Your dislike for Kuldeep is obvious. A 5fer and 50 with bat. Kuldeep struggles with control at times but it's perfectly fine for his type of bowlers.

Yeah agree. Kuldeep is easily the best spin talent we have, he may not be finished product yet but he's not far off from some senior bowlers we have. It's silly to write him off. 

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6 hours ago, jusarrived said:

Nonsense. Gowtham has better fc record than nadeem. Even for karnataka he's picked as a front line bowler over gopal.

He has done his job as an all-rounder in these two games. 

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17 hours ago, Pollack said:

Your dislike for Kuldeep is obvious. A 5fer and 50 with bat. Kuldeep struggles with control at times but it's perfectly fine for his type of bowlers.

I have no dislike for Kuldeep in particular.  I just dont like bowlers who lack control.

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9 hours ago, Lannister said:

Had high hopes on Gurbani after his performance in Duleep trophy. It seems like he is another trundler. Who's idea it was to give an opportunity to D. Chahar? 

 

Kuldeep should spend some more time in A team before getting back to international cricket. This is best for his personnel growth. 

yes, that is what i want too and people think i have dislike for Kuldeep or hate him.  Let him play more FC games.  We dont need to play him against WI or take him to Australia tests.  Let him play this FC season and hone his control.  Spinners take time to mature especially wrist spinner and it is not advisable to give them early test debuts.

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Just now, rkt.india said:

yes, that is what i want too and people think i have dislike for Kuldeep or hate him.  Let him play more FC games.  We dont need to play him against WI or take him to Australia tests.  Let him play this FC season and hone his control.  Spinners take time to mature especially wrist spinner and it is not advisable to give them early test debuts.

Hope we can do the same for Pandya as well.

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18 minutes ago, Suhaan said:

Kuldeep needs a season in first class cricket to tighten his skills..test cricket altogether a different proportion,he is a wicket taker and we definitely want him in test cricket but shouldn't be rushed 

 

We need only 1 spinner in Australia most of the time.  And it is going to be either Jaddu or Ashwin.

 

So ... I am in favour of Kuldeep playing full Ranji season instead of going to Australia.   But I will play him against the WI at home ... where he will have a chance to hone his skills.

 

He picked up 8 wickets in this match and is on the right path.

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1 hour ago, rkt.india said:

I have no dislike for Kuldeep in particular.  I just dont like bowlers who lack control.

    His craft is quite different to have shivalkar like accuracy . Even Chandra used to bowl quite a few loose balls even at his peak. 

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3 hours ago, Switchblade said:

Hope we can do the same for Pandya as well.

Pandya isnt a spinner.  he is a fast bowler and batsman.  It is opposite in case of pacers and better to give them early debut rather than burning them domestic cricket.

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2 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Pandya isnt a spinner.  he is a fast bowler and batsman.  It is opposite in case of pacers and better to give them early debut rather than burning them domestic cricket.

But you said he is a batting all rounder and his bowling is not 100% reliable neither his batting.

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