Sir Richard Hadlee on Pakistani's reverse swing

[cric_fan]

Man, some of you guys are sooooo bitter

[Vilander]

17 hours ago, cric_fan said:

 

Why are you obsessed with downplaying the pace of Wasim & Waqar? So I guess all the batsman that found Waqar to be genuinely quick are lying? Fact is the two W's were something else. There has not been any bowler like them since. Waqar at his peak was a monster. I started following cricket because of him.

 

Stop crying about it. Accept it & move on.

lol wtf about their cheating ? hehe what a country and people man never fail to amaze. They cheated boss, CHEAT--EDAA...CHE...CHEATAEDAAAH..you know.

[Vilander]

17 hours ago, Nikhil_cric said:

According to Eddie Smith he's. But I think he was clicked at 147 in the same tournament. Not sure though.

any documentary evidence ? i guess he hit 140 in an odd ball in 2003 worldcup, must have been capable of ~145 in his youth. But not fast but good enough, liek Bhuvi who hits 145-146 an odd ball but mostly bowls 135-138. Waqar was more like Yadav/Aaron in pace an odd ball 150+ but mostly around 140-148 fast but not express but towards his end of career waqar was trundling. Its basically their cheating thats the bigger discussion item here.

[Nikhil_cric]

2 hours ago, Vilander said:

any documentary evidence ? i guess he hit 140 in an odd ball in 2003 worldcup, must have been capable of ~145 in his youth. But not fast but good enough, liek Bhuvi who hits 145-146 an odd ball but mostly bowls 135-138. Waqar was more like Yadav/Aaron in pace an odd ball 150+ but mostly around 140-148 fast but not express but towards his end of career waqar was trundling. Its basically their cheating thats the bigger discussion item here.

Well if it's about cheating, then a lot of teams have cheated. English bowlers lifting the seam. Fafs zipper etc. I think all teams tamper with the ball to some extent. Just that no one did it as well as the Pakistanis. 

[Vilander]

1 hour ago, Nikhil_cric said:

Well if it's about cheating, then a lot of teams have cheated. English bowlers lifting the seam. Fafs zipper etc. I think all teams tamper with the ball to some extent. Just that no one did it as well as the Pakistanis. 

nope sorry pakistan cheated but using bottle caps, thats unique. Pringle did it only to compensate, no one does it like pak and there is not 'well' in cheating. Cheating is cheating, basically pathetic. so pakistan cheated in the most pathetic way, yeah that sounds right.

[Khota]

17 hours ago, cric_fan said:

Man, some of you guys are sooooo bitter

No one is bitter.

Those two guys were cheating.

Indian batting has not declined after retirements.

Your bowling has because you were cheating.

[Pakistani]

6 hours ago, Vilander said:

nope sorry pakistan cheated but using bottle caps, thats unique. Pringle did it only to compensate, no one does it like pak and there is not 'well' in cheating. Cheating is cheating, basically pathetic. so pakistan cheated in the most pathetic way, yeah that sounds right.

Keep living in ur delusional world no one gives a damn about you .

You think whole world was blind so was icc....the fact is no matter how bitter you become the country of 1.2b will not be able to produce a bowler who could tie their shoelaces and you will keep burning.

CHEERS

Edited May 14, 2017 by Pakistani

[Khota]

Our current bowlers are better than those two.

I challenge you to show me one clip where these tundlers bowled six consecutive deliveries at 140 +.

There is not any. They were average bowlers who changed the aerodynamics of the ball by messing with the seam.

[Khota]

On 5/12/2017 at 7:22 AM, Ultimate_Game said:

They were good, especially Wasim, but there's no doubt their numbers were inflated due to lot of "extra curricular" activities. That's the reason you see such a steep drop-off between Pak pace bowlers over the last 10-15 years. Earlier Pak bowler could rely on ball tampering and dodgy ball management techniques but they can't anymore and that's why they are struggling to unearth decent pacers at intl level.

 

The ball tampering practice started in the days of Sarfraz Nawaz, enhanced by Imran and passed on to Wasim & Waqar and so on. Since the days ICC started acting tough on these practices and started monitoring the ball, things changed for Pak pacers. Had it been the old days their golden boy Aamir would be picking wkts by the bagful but he's struggling and against everyone to pick up wkts coz now he can't rely on ball tampering like earlier generation used to.

This sums up pakistan fast bowling. They cheated.

[Vilander]

15 hours ago, Pakistani said:

Keep living in ur delusional world no one gives a damn about you .

You think whole world was blind so was icc....the fact is no matter how bitter you become the country of 1.2b will not be able to produce a bowler who could tie their shoelaces and you will keep burning.

CHEERS

lol some one is hurt...there is documentary evidence of your greats cheating, hehe cheating players are not greats but in pakistan they are.

[rtmohanlal]

On 5/14/2017 at 10:40 AM, Nikhil_cric said:

Well if it's about cheating, then a lot of teams have cheated. English bowlers lifting the seam. Fafs zipper etc. I think all teams tamper with the ball to some extent. Just that no one did it as well as the Pakistanis. 

But, but ... in general PAK bowlers have been the most  intense at it. Do you sincerely believe that in these multi camera days , it is possible to tamper with the ball  to those extends as that was the case in the 80s & then 90s ? I would say Imran was the worst tamperor of all time. His stats itself is proof of this. Till 1980 he was a 29 avg: category bowler as his  series wise avg:s reveal . All of a sudden it started getting into 10-15 & 15-20 ranges  series after series   from 81 onwards. Means a good bowler suddenly turns into  an  unplayable bowler  half way thru his career. So strange and odd.No wonder this  change in performance started from that 81 county match where he admitted to using bottle top.

As Mohinder Amarnath  points out  if Imran was motivated to tamper in a county match , it is naive to think that he wouldn't have been motivated to do that in the most important series of his life  ie: Indian series

[Nikhil_cric]

7 hours ago, rtmohanlal said:

But, but ... in general PAK bowlers have been the most  intense at it. Do you sincerely believe that in these multi camera days , it is possible to tamper with the ball  to those extends as that was the case in the 80s & then 90s ? I would say Imran was the worst tamperor of all time. His stats itself is proof of this. Till 1980 he was a 29 avg: category bowler as his  series wise avg:s reveal . All of a sudden it started getting into 10-15 & 15-20 ranges  series after series   from 81 onwards. Means a good bowler suddenly turns into  an  unplayable bowler  half way thru his career. So strange and odd.No wonder this  change in performance started from that 81 county match where he admitted to using bottle top.

As Mohinder Amarnath  points out  if Imran was motivated to tamper in a county match , it is naive to think that he wouldn't have been motivated to do that in the most important series of his life  ie: Indian series

No it's not possible to tamper to that extent nowadays. Not with the kind of scrutiny the players face and this shows in the general decline of reverse swing over the years. 

[Khota]

1 hour ago, Nikhil_cric said:

No it's not possible to tamper to that extent nowadays. Not with the kind of scrutiny the players face and this shows in the general decline of reverse swing over the years. 

Not today but in 80s and 90s they were doing it. As far as I am concerned Sarfraz, Imran, Waquar and Wasim were rogue bowlers.

[Rightarmfast]

After @rtmohanlal pointed out, I actually checked Imran Khan's stats. It is unbelievable, he was averaging  around 30-35ish till 79, and then all of a sudden his average started to come down series to series to 15-19 and stuff. That is kind of disturbing. I have no idea why that happened, was it the umpires or ball tampering or he improved that much? But nobody can to that level. I guess it was a mixture of all

[Vilander]

18 hours ago, Rightarmfast said:

After @rtmohanlal pointed out, I actually checked Imran Khan's stats. It is unbelievable, he was averaging  around 30-35ish till 79, and then all of a sudden his average started to come down series to series to 15-19 and stuff. That is kind of disturbing. I have no idea why that happened, was it the umpires or ball tampering or he improved that much? But nobody can to that level. I guess it was a mixture of all

the deafening silence means you have nailed it good work. @Rightarmfast

[cric_fan]

After @rtmohanlal pointed out, I actually checked Imran Khan's stats. It is unbelievable, he was averaging  around 30-35ish till 79, and then all of a sudden his average started to come down series to series to 15-19 and stuff. That is kind of disturbing. I have no idea why that happened, was it the umpires or ball tampering or he improved that much? But nobody can to that level. I guess it was a mixture of all

 

Keep weeping

 

You are just bitter & jealous

[Vilander]

7 minutes ago, cric_fan said:

 

Keep weeping

 

You are just bitter & jealous

read your comments in the thread again, its you who is butt hurt and weeping hehe..

[Khota]

23 hours ago, cric_fan said:

 

Keep weeping

 

You are just bitter & jealous

Cheating was the norm for Pakistan.