Guys, Calm Down. It's Not That Our Batsmen Are Hopeless, It's Just That We Are Woefully Under-Prepared

[rkt.india]

So what about England batsmen? Are they also underprepared? You can never really be prepared for pitches like these.

[rkt.india]

14 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

pitch is good  ,movement is due to clouds ,once the clouds move away it looks good for batting like towards the end .i have seen many teams score runs in such conditions.

I am talking about those conditions. They suddenly change drastically and just too much happen, not just in the air but off the pitch as well.

[Vilander]

Within this series:

 

Bring Pant in as a batsman simple, give chance to Nair. 

 

hope DK and Ashwin do better, Ash is a gun bowler so selects himself. DK still seems better bet than Pujara to be in the team at say at 6.

 

Dhawan - may be drop him down to 5 have Rahane go at 3 have Rahul and Vijay open. 

 

If dhawan is able to negate curran then you have a ploy for rest of the series.  they can always bring in stokes to remove Dhawan but at the moment he is useless unless he can cross broad and anderson examination and stay long enough.  if not then replace Rahul at top with Pujara and drop Rahul to 3 again -> Rahane back to his position.  So two experiments Dhawan at 5 and Puraja at 2 can be done.

 

And Vijay/Rahane wtf no 'in series' solutions - they just need to do their job if they are incompetent then time to look at Gill and Shah..try others but no easy solutions there..you dont find batsmen who do well overseas easily it takes time for these to develope..so disappointing - just *ing support Kohli..all that these two need to do is hang around, they are clearly skilled enough to do more but not even hanging around atm. May be its down to the pressure that english bowlers create. no one can carry replacements for their settled top order bats even India or Australia or Eng with their big benches. ( no replacements for players like cook, warner etc who are sort of secondary heroes just behind skill to the prime smith/root/kohli /williamson - lead heros)

 

I am sure England are doing same thinking against spin atm -> they were saved by Curran ( their Bhuvi - (ours is injured thanks to incompetent team management - no thanks also for Bumrah injured).

Edited August 4, 2018 by Vilander

[Vilander]

33 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

I am talking about those conditions. They suddenly change drastically and just too much happen, not just in the air but off the pitch as well.

distinctly swinging under cloud cover, and no when sun is out may be its perception - but very odd. Sun is out mostly wen kohli bats..lol

[Vilander]

5 hours ago, Forever Indian said:

This is precisely why there should be a couple more practise games for the batsmen. Kohli should realise that just because he may not need much practise, he should not force the same for other batsmen. 

i think Kohli is a Sachinistic in captaincy in that respect, need Rahane to lead so that there is more understanding for how it feels for lesser more normal folks.

[R!TTER]

Application and mindset, we're playing same way Aus did in SL or SA for that matter. Need more positive approach and better tactics against the incoming ball.

Edited August 4, 2018 by R!TTER

[rkt.india]

1 minute ago, Vilander said:

distinctly swinging under cloud cover, and no when sun is out may be its perception - but very odd. Sun is out mostly wen kohli bats..lol

Not really, ball was doing yesterday even when Kohli was batting, Stokes was swinging it miles and DK just got his foot outside the line on two occasions and even in the first innings, it was doing a lot when Kohli was batting and had 2-3 catches dropped.  It gets a bit easier when ball gets older after 45-50 overs.  When sun is out it does not move in the air as much, but some seam movement is still there. 

 

Look at Vijay's dismissal yesterday, Broad is not a swing bowler.  it came back miles from outside off stump and even hit him outside the line but was hitting stumps and Vijay offered no shot as he was trying to leave the ball that was far outside off but caught off guards as it seamed back after pitching.

[rkt.india]

5 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

Seam movement has always there in eng unless the pitch is very flat .Conditions change around due to cloud cover and sweaty muggy conditions ,i have seen this often in eng (last seasons's oval test is a typical example)but with a bit of luck and patience you can still get 300-350 runs in such conditions .Problem is eng bowlers  are very accurate ,they dont give away anything .Ind bowlers are not as accurate hence eng has a better chance of scoring runs compared to ind batsmen.

yes that is a difference and England batsmen are also better against pacers than ours.  Here, even England could not score 350.  

[CG]

thats part of the game ,they got more runs against better pace attack like sa,

Sa bowlers like rabada Morkel were not swing bowlers.If Bhuvi was there he would have been an asset in these conditions.

[Vilander]

32 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

when Kohli was batting, Stokes was swinging it miles and DK just got his foot outside the line on two occasions and even in the first innings

Kohli is covering swing ? how is he doing it against Curran in that left armer angle though. 

[rkt.india]

18 minutes ago, Vilander said:

Kohli is covering swing ? how is he doing it against Curran in that left armer angle though. 

Kohli is also getting beaten too.  Plays and misses, inside edges.  Need a lot of luck when ball is going both ways.  Of course, the most important thing is to have assured and decisive leaves and playing close to the body, which Kohli has done better than others.  Rahane and Dhawan played bad shots as those could easily have been left, Rahul got a good one.  Ashwin does not leave the ball at all.  He was fishing for every ball outside off from Anderson and getting beaten on away swingers.

[rkt.india]

47 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

thats part of the game ,they got more runs against better pace attack like sa,

conditions and pitches are not same every year.  For SA, they usually prepare drier tracks

[Vilander]

53 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

thats part of the game ,they got more runs against better pace attack like sa,

i dont think SA is better pace attack than India - specifically from what we have seen in this game.

 

Eng first inning to second inning there is definite improvement in Indian bowling -and definite drop in Eng bowling, conditions have gotten easier and Indian bowling got better in the game.

[Vilander]

5 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

it was all down to ishant's spell , on their day ind can bowl well but sa are more consistent .

agreed..

 

My point was more in match situation. As in India bowled out Eng cheap ( but for curran it was basically won in third innings) now Eng have a sliver of hope albeit a small one that will disappear in 10 over tomorrow morning.

[rkt.india]

44 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

 They do prepare dryer pitches for sa and aus but then you get seam/ swing friendly conditions as well like at nott in the last ashes .....if it's down to exactitude, pitches dont remain the same even within the course of a match but the point is the oval pitch was quite similar to this pitch ,also outfields are such that pitches become dry .

and Aus crumbled to 70 odd at Notts. Pitches at Oval are generally flatter and have truer bounce than any other place in England. Though i dont remember which oval pitch you are talking about.

[FreakazoiD]

I think Indian fans are being way too fatalistic after one test match. Batting conditions yesterday were awful, the ball was hooping around all over the place and even English batsmen who are born and bred in these conditions found batting hard (Sam Curran basically had nothing to lose - he had already performed above expectations and cemented his spot for at least 2 more tests, so he had the license to go out and play his shots and it came off for him, the dropped catch notwithstanding). The commentators were repeatedly saying that the conditions couldn't have been more English, with thick cloud cover and ball swinging. In such conditions, any team will struggle, leave alone India. Add to that the pressure of a 4th innings chase and a top quality attack in swinging conditions, batting becomes incredibly hard. Had this match been happening in London where there has been bright sunshine and sub-continental temperatures of 35 degrees, it would have been a totally different story (at least batting-wise). I still expect these guys to score big in the next few tests if the current heatwave persists, if only we can scrape through today 

[Sooda]

40 minutes ago, FreakazoiD said:

I think Indian fans are being way too fatalistic after one test match. Batting conditions yesterday were awful, the ball was hooping around all over the place and even English batsmen who are born and bred in these conditions found batting hard (Sam Curran basically had nothing to lose - he had already performed above expectations and cemented his spot for at least 2 more tests, so he had the license to go out and play his shots and it came off for him, the dropped catch notwithstanding). The commentators were repeatedly saying that the conditions couldn't have been more English, with thick cloud cover and ball swinging. In such conditions, any team will struggle, leave alone India. Add to that the pressure of a 4th innings chase and a top quality attack in swinging conditions, batting becomes incredibly hard. Had this match been happening in London where there has been bright sunshine and sub-continental temperatures of 35 degrees, it would have been a totally different story (at least batting-wise). I still expect these guys to score big in the next few tests if the current heatwave persists, if only we can scrape through today 

Problem is the batsmen who got out unnecessarily- Dhawan and Rahane especially.

 

We cant change too much in the middle or this series, but KL needs to open and in the next home series we need to groom a new opener, give Mayank a run maybe?

 

[Sooda]

Shame we are saying under prepared after all the months of planning- A team tour, Virat coming to play county (ok that didnt materalise) The prep was better than the last two tours . 

 

Its the inability to not waft outside off, mental discipline required to leave balls that do not need playing.

 

I think the concept of having a camp before a big away tour is a very good one. Work on skills and technique required. 

Edited August 4, 2018 by Sooda

[chewy]

Lack of preparation is an excuse

These guys have been out in England for over a month

And when they had one game four day they cut it to three days

Tbh some of these guys are not cut out to be top level cricketers, they are lucky white ball cricket is played on flat decks with two bouncer rule and two balls

[sensible-indian]

I am hearing from @Austin 3:!6 that we haven't had a practice session since the day we lost.

 

Lmao......what do these guys think of themselves when they have a million issues to sort out in the nets?

 

They are hoping for some flat tracks to do some FTBing?