Trichromatic Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 7 minutes ago, bharathh said: This a more updated version of the same - Perhaps when that report was published it didn't take into account late submissions or those under review/dispute? There is a clear jump in the number of individual tax payers as seen below. I am sure 2018-19 will change when next year's results are published as well. https://www.incometaxindia.gov.in/Documents/Direct Tax Data/IT-Department-Time-Series-Data-FY-2000-01-to-2018-19.pdf So, increase in taxpayers was 13% in FY 15-16. It decreased to 10% in the DeMo year FY 16-17 And then increased to 14% once country recovered in FY 17-18. If DeMo is reason for these numbers then it seems that DeMo slowed it down and then brought back to normal once country started recovered from shock of DeMo. Forget about providing acceleration, effect was -ve (if we are attributing DeMo as reason).
dial_100 Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 If we go by how much currency was in circulation as per RBI (15.41 L crore) then yes 99.3% returned to the system. Of course, we can trust cong with this one for sure.
bharathh Posted July 21, 2021 Author Posted July 21, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Trichromatic said: So, increase in taxpayers was 13% in FY 15-16. It decreased to 10% in the DeMo year FY 16-17 And then increased to 14% once country recovered in FY 17-18. If DeMo is reason for these numbers then it seems that DeMo slowed it down and then brought back to normal once country started recovered from shock of DeMo. Forget about providing acceleration, effect was -ve (if we are attributing DeMo as reason). 2017-18 and 18-19 also allowed for tax returns to be filed for 2 yrs in a row for those who didn't file the year before. It's 13% increase for 16-17 .. and 8% for 15-16. 14% for 18-19 Edited July 21, 2021 by bharathh
Trichromatic Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 16 minutes ago, bharathh said: 2017-18 and 18-19 also allowed for tax returns to be filed for 2 yrs in a row for those who didn't file the year before. It's 13% increase for 16-17 .. and 8% for 15-16. 14% for 18-19 How did you calculate 8% for 15-16?
bharathh Posted July 21, 2021 Author Posted July 21, 2021 4 minutes ago, Trichromatic said: How did you calculate 8% for 15-16?
Trichromatic Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 20 minutes ago, bharathh said: Ok, total number of taxpayers. So, it's clear that rate which was 13% before DeMo, decreased to 7% in DeMo year. Rate of increase was lowest in 5 year during DeMo year.
Singh bling Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 Currency in circulation hits Rs 29 lakh crore on 2nd wave https://m.timesofindia.com/business/india-business/currency-in-circulation-hits-rs-29-lakh-crore-on-2nd-wave/amp_articleshow/82380149.cms If cash = black money then people should accept that black money doubled after demo from 15.41 lakh crore to 29 lakh crore now. Where are the tall claims that people are dealing in cheques, digital payments etc ? Real McCoy 1
bharathh Posted July 21, 2021 Author Posted July 21, 2021 11 minutes ago, Trichromatic said: Ok, total number of taxpayers. So, it's clear that rate which was 13% before DeMo, decreased to 7% in DeMo year. Rate of increase was lowest in 5 year during DeMo year. ?You make elementary math mistakes and then double down just to keep your narrative going. 2016-17 is filed in 2017... after demonetisation. You can admit when you're wrong you know.
Trichromatic Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 21 minutes ago, bharathh said: ?You make elementary math mistakes and then double down just to keep your narrative going. 2016-17 is filed in 2017... after demonetisation. You can admit when you're wrong you know. Elementry Math mistake? I had quoted your post about individual tax payers and posted increase in individual tax payers in You quoted my post and added increase in total number of taxpayers. There is no elementary maths mistake. And it seems you're confusing assesment year with financial year.
bharathh Posted July 21, 2021 Author Posted July 21, 2021 Assessment year 2016-17 gets filed in 2017. Demo happened in 2016 nov. So number of tax payers increased by 13% after demo
Real McCoy Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 1 hour ago, Singh bling said: Currency in circulation hits Rs 29 lakh crore on 2nd wave https://m.timesofindia.com/business/india-business/currency-in-circulation-hits-rs-29-lakh-crore-on-2nd-wave/amp_articleshow/82380149.cms If cash = black money then people should accept that black money doubled after demo from 15.41 lakh crore to 29 lakh crore now. Where are the tall claims that people are dealing in cheques, digital payments etc ? Lots of people are scared not just because of corona but also economic slowdown. In this timeframe, our FM also tried the bail in clause which was removed later. She still won't give up on that clause and is trying to fit that in with some strange legality which only bankers would know. I know one old guy who follows economy too much. He was in panic mode when he read this clause. No doubt some people want money to be in hand. money in hand is worth twice(or more) the money in the bank which is untrustworthy with such an evil system of legal plundering of the masses. Also if you read how much hospitals are charging for even non-covid cases for entry into the hospital, people are bound to have cash. equating cash with black money like one of the posters here did is not only stupid but disingenuous diehardpacer and Singh bling 2
Trichromatic Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 57 minutes ago, bharathh said: Assessment year 2016-17 gets filed in 2017. Demo happened in 2016 nov. So number of tax payers increased by 13% after demo Not sure if this is a serious post. ITR of assessment year 2016-17 is supposed to be filed in 2016, not in 2017. AY 2016-17 is FY 2015-16. I think you're confusing assessment year with financial year. https://www.policybazaar.com/income-tax/difference-between-financial-year-and-assessment-year/
bharathh Posted July 21, 2021 Author Posted July 21, 2021 My bad - I was wrong about the assessment year. Thanks for the link. That helped. Still the data I talked about still stands - so taxpayers on 2016-17 earnings increased 13%
Trichromatic Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 10 minutes ago, bharathh said: My bad - I was wrong about the assessment year. Thanks for the link. That helped. Still the data I talked about still stands - so taxpayers on 2016-17 earnings increased 13% How does it stand? Before DeMo it was 13% in FY 2015-16 (AY 2016-17) Reduced to 7% in FY 2016-17 (AY 2017-18) - this was DeMo Year Recovered to 14% in FY 2017-18 (AY 2018-19) And the figure in DeMo year 7% was lowest in 5 years. I think you still didn't understand meaning of AY and FY. Real McCoy 1
Real McCoy Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 5 hours ago, bharathh said: ?You make elementary math mistakes and then double down just to keep your narrative going. 2016-17 is filed in 2017... after demonetisation. You can admit when you're wrong you know. You have some audacity calling him making math mistakes when you don't even know the difference between AY and FY. I thought you were joking when you said you pay your maid using googlepay. But now I'm doubting that you even live in India much less work or pay taxes here. kuch bhi
bharathh Posted July 21, 2021 Author Posted July 21, 2021 2 hours ago, Trichromatic said: How does it stand? Before DeMo it was 13% in FY 2015-16 (AY 2016-17) Reduced to 7% in FY 2016-17 (AY 2017-18) - this was DeMo Year Recovered to 14% in FY 2017-18 (AY 2018-19) And the figure in DeMo year 7% was lowest in 5 years. I think you still didn't understand meaning of AY and FY. Yes you are right I was wrong. The 13% is apparently attributed to an amnesty scheme that was introduced in June. The next year did indeed have a rise of 7%. BacktoCricaddict 1
Trichromatic Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 21 minutes ago, bharathh said: Yes you are right I was wrong. The 13% is apparently attributed to an amnesty scheme that was introduced in June. The next year did indeed have a rise of 7%. And that 7% YoY was lowest rise in total number of taxpayers in 5 years. So far, 10k crores flushed out of system at cost of 8k crores in printing new notes. Taxpayers growth slowed down. Indian economy lost 1-2% of GDP which could be probably 1 lakh crore (disclaimer - all speculation, economy lost, but no official estimate on how much and we won't get that). Harship faced by common people. But lot of mythical benefits which are mostly opinion based as it was just a theorectically good plan with incompetent government.
BacktoCricaddict Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 7 minutes ago, Trichromatic said: And that 7% YoY was lowest rise in total number of taxpayers in 5 years. So far, 10k crores flushed out of system at cost of 8k crores in printing new notes. Taxpayers growth slowed down. Indian economy lost 1-2% of GDP which could be probably 1 lakh crore (disclaimer - all speculation, economy lost, but no official estimate on how much and we won't get that). Harship faced by common people. But lot of mythical benefits which are mostly opinion based as it was just a theorectically good plan with incompetent government. So, assuming that the intent of de-mo did not come to fruition and it caused many unintended problems, the question becomes - if/how must the black money situation be tackled?
Trichromatic Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 1 hour ago, BacktoCricaddict said: So, assuming that the intent of de-mo did not come to fruition and it caused many unintended problems, the question becomes - if/how must the black money situation be tackled? There is hardly any clarity on intent of DeMo, let alone it's benefits. That can be entirely separate discussion where challenges specific to India can be posted and how it has been tackled around the world. Some may be applicable to Indian scenario with modification.
Trichromatic Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 Quote When the decision to scrap these high-denomination notes was taken, the government had estimated that up to Rs 3 lakh crore or almost 20 per cent of the total value of demonetised currency would not return, and be available for spending once the liability is extinguished. https://indianexpress.com/article/business/economy/demonetisation-black-money-cash-crunch-rs-14-lakh-crore-in-old-notes-are-back-only-rs-75000-crore-out-rbi4465542/ DeMo targeted removing 3 lakhs crores from system. Ended up removing 10k crores only at much higher cost. Has any govt step failed so spectacularly?
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