Hindenburg group accuses Adani group of fraud

[gattaca]

Wow 100 billion is lot of money 

[diga]

Not exactly illegal, but facebook is buying back 40B$ worth of its own stock... Stock is up 20% on this news. What it does is reduce the active floatation and boosts the price.

[Trichromatic]

28 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

loans to Adani are secured, backed up with real assets.  

 

Loans are backed by inflated shares.

[ravishingravi]

4 hours ago, SM2907 said:

Was there stock inflation by shell companies. ? It is a simple question

In the long run everything can nullify. In the long run even Adani can file for bankruptcy.

 

Yes, by conjecture. No, by proof. "In the long run, we will all be dead" - Keynes.

 

Adani won't be because businesses survive on fundamentals. If they deliver on fundamentals, they are good.

Edited February 2 by ravishingravi

[ravishingravi]

1 hour ago, Trichromatic said:

 

Loans are backed by inflated shares.

 

Shares are pledged with banks. Most of the loans are backed by assets.

[Under_Score]

3 hours ago, gattaca said:

Wow 100 billion is lot of money 

More than Adani losing that big chunk of money.......it is the global reputation at stake here.

 

From the article

 

‘Rude awakening’ for foreign investors'

 

The crisis swirling around one of India’s most prominent businessmen could have bigger consequences for the fast-growing economy, which only two weeks ago was pitching aggressively for foreign investment at the World Economic Forum in Davos.

 

“It is evident from looking at broader market activity that foreign investors …have had a rude awakening,” said Saurabh Mukherjea, founder of Marcellus Investment Managers.

 

The fallout from the Hindenburg report could engulf other large Indian businesses, experts warned.

 

https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/02/business/gautam-adani-speaks-hindenburg-hnk-intl/index.html

[rangeelaraja]

14 minutes ago, Under_Score said:

More than Adani losing that big chunk of money.......it is the global reputation at stake here.

 

From the article

 

‘Rude awakening’ for foreign investors'

 

The crisis swirling around one of India’s most prominent businessmen could have bigger consequences for the fast-growing economy, which only two weeks ago was pitching aggressively for foreign investment at the World Economic Forum in Davos.

 

“It is evident from looking at broader market activity that foreign investors …have had a rude awakening,” said Saurabh Mukherjea, founder of Marcellus Investment Managers.

 

The fallout from the Hindenburg report could engulf other large Indian businesses, experts warned.

 

https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/02/business/gautam-adani-speaks-hindenburg-hnk-intl/index.html

 

 

yeah....gora sahibs are always right. Most ethical and moral people on the planet. If they say something is wrong, it must be wrong. 

 

 

 

[Khota]

4 hours ago, diga said:

Not exactly illegal, but facebook is buying back 40B$ worth of its own stock... Stock is up 20% on this news. What it does is reduce the active floatation and boosts the price.

Facebook =/= Adani

[Khota]

4 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

 

yeah....gora sahibs are always right. Most ethical and moral people on the planet. If they say something is wrong, it must be wrong. 

 

 

 

goras are not always right. But Adani needs to prove that these shell companies did not help him inflate the value of stock.

[Under_Score]

3 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

 

yeah....gora sahibs are always right. Most ethical and moral people on the planet. If they say something is wrong, it must be wrong. 

 

 

 

You probably just saw CNN & made that assumption.

 

“It is evident from looking at broader market activity that foreign investors …have had a rude awakening,” said Saurabh Mukherjea, founder of Marcellus Investment Managers.

[Khota]

4 hours ago, Trichromatic said:

 

Loans are backed by inflated shares.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^This

[Khota]

2 hours ago, ravishingravi said:

 

Yes, by conjecture. No, by proof. "In the long run, we will all be dead" - Keynes.

 

Adani won't be because businesses survive on fundamentals. If they deliver on fundamentals, they are good.

Indeed his fundamentals are strong, and he will survive. The valuation of assets is the issue here.

[Khota]

4 hours ago, gattaca said:

Wow 100 billion is lot of money 

All monopoly money. Feel sorry for the investors who got duped.

[Mariyam]

18 minutes ago, Khota said:

All monopoly money. Feel sorry for the investors who got duped.

Why duped? If fundamentals are strong.... 

 

Institutional investors mainly. Surely they've done their due diligence. 

 

The Hindenburg "expose" is basically an amalgamation of reports that have been out for sometime now. Investors still put in their $.

 

TBH, I hadn't heard of Hindenburg until this episode.

[rangeelaraja]

43 minutes ago, Khota said:

goras are not always right. But Adani needs to prove that these shell companies did not help him inflate the value of stock.

 

 

Please be more informed. This news of shell companies investing in Adani is not new news. It was reported 2 years back.

 

But because a gora brought it up, people like you have made it more relevant.

 

Every company exploits loop holes and commits manipulation.

 

Some of the biggest tech companies in Silicon Valley do it. Apple - the most profitable company ever, pays a measly 7 % corporate tax through manipulations of tax regimes, while regular people pay 33 % income tax.

 

Read this and educate yourself along with @Under_Score.

 

https://americansfortaxfairness.org/issues/corporate-taxes/highlights-of-apples-tax-dodging/

 

 

Stop sucking up to everything goras say.  Every major corporation indulges in manipulating the system. 

Edited February 2 by rangeelaraja

[Lone Wolf]

From what I gather is it is the negative publicity of Adani which generated the first short sell which lead to $60 billion losses in the first two days and it increased to $100 billion, a week later. Nothing much, the Adani could do to stop it. Some investors who wished to retain the stock and bonds were victims of bad publicity. Remember media coverage isn't bankable. A good media word is worth tonnes of gold and the opposite is also true. Rather negative publicity routs faster than the good publicity.

Future business expansion at Adani will now be in question. There is no way for them to raise money. Hindenburg whether right or wrong has led the rout. This can only be remedied through an in depth investigation. It will take maybe 5 years but an inquiry has to be conducted.

All this could take 5 years but a lesson to be learnt here is that if you have to raise capital abroad then all your financial dealings have to be spot clean and constantly examined by outsiders.

I hope Adani will survive, because this is a business based on assets and good business practices.

Not looking good overall. 

[rangeelaraja]

2 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said:

From what I gather is it is the negative publicity of Adani which generated the first short sell which lead to $60 billion losses in the first two days and it increased to $100 billion, a week later. Nothing much, the Adani could do to stop it. Some investors who wished to retain the stock and bonds were victims of bad publicity. Remember media coverage isn't bankable. A good media word is worth tonnes of gold and the opposite is also true. Rather negative publicity routs faster than the good publicity.

Future business expansion at Adani will now be in question. There is no way for them to raise money. Hindenburg whether right or wrong has led the rout. This can only be remedied through an in depth investigation. It will take maybe 5 years but an inquiry has to be conducted.

All this could take 5 years but a lesson to be learnt here is that if you have to raise capital abroad then all your financial dealings have to be spot clean and constantly examined by outsiders.

I hope Adani will survive, because this is a business based on assets and good business practices.

Not looking good overall. 

 

The fastest way to end these losses and stock price slide is for SEBI to publicly give a clean chit to the Adani group.

 

Short sellers world over claim to do the job that regulators can't do ( SEC in the US, SEBI in India....etc ).

 

So if the grave  allegations against Adani are true, it would imply that SEBI was either incompetent or complicit in Adani's so called manipulation. None are good outcomes.

 

Ultimately only SEBi's judgement or action will determine which way this is going. If SEBI were to give a clean chit ( when there is actually a fraud proven eventually ) ...it would tarnish the image of India's institutions irreparably. 

 

So I don't think SEBI will do anything to favor Adani. 

 

 

 

[ravishingravi]

2 hours ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

The fastest way to end these losses and stock price slide is for SEBI to publicly give a clean chit to the Adani group.

 

Short sellers world over claim to do the job that regulators can't do ( SEC in the US, SEBI in India....etc ).

 

So if the grave  allegations against Adani are true, it would imply that SEBI was either incompetent or complicit in Adani's so called manipulation. None are good outcomes.

 

Ultimately only SEBi's judgement or action will determine which way this is going. If SEBI were to give a clean chit ( when there is actually a fraud proven eventually ) ...it would tarnish the image of India's institutions irreparably. 

 

So I don't think SEBI will do anything to favor Adani. 

 

 

 

 

SEBI won't stick it's head out. Bleeding will end by this week. Adanis will have to lick their wounds. They high stakes in all their companies and tangible assets. They can monetize later. 

[Khota]

5 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Why duped? If fundamentals are strong.... 

 

Institutional investors mainly. Surely they've done their due diligence. 

 

The Hindenburg "expose" is basically an amalgamation of reports that have been out for sometime now. Investors still put in their $.

 

TBH, I hadn't heard of Hindenburg until this episode.

It was overvalued.

 

There was a lot that went into that report. If someone has called other person a con artist and there has been no response, you can draw your conclusions.

[Khota]

2 hours ago, ravishingravi said:

 

SEBI won't stick it's head out. Bleeding will end by this week. Adanis will have to lick their wounds. They high stakes in all their companies and tangible assets. They can monetize later.