singhvivek141 Posted October 19, 2025 Posted October 19, 2025 Anti-Submarine Craft, Largest Dredger, and Hybrid Vessel Launched Simultaneously Cochin Shipyard Limited https://defence.in/threads/anti-submarine-craft-largest-dredger-and-hybrid-vessel-launched-simultaneously-cochin-shipyard-limited.15841/
singhvivek141 Posted October 19, 2025 Posted October 19, 2025 Defence Minister dedicates to the nation Titanium & Superalloy Materials Plant at PTC Industries’ Strategic Materials Technology Complex in Lucknow Atmanirbharta on Rare Earth is much needed. Good to see that govt is prioritizing in that front. https://defence.in/threads/defence-minister-dedicates-to-the-nation-titanium-superalloy-materials-plant-at-ptc-industries-strategic-materials-technology-complex-in-lucknow.15842/
MechEng Posted October 19, 2025 Posted October 19, 2025 Looks like 6-7 jets downed narrative hasn't worked much. Thanks to Maxar images which showed clean precision strikes. https://www.eurasiantimes.com/india-beats-china-as-asias-strongest-air-force/?amp
singhvivek141 Posted October 19, 2025 Posted October 19, 2025 Russia is apparently working on Sixth gen Mig 41. As usual, they lack manpower and hence their plans are going slower than usual. Indian defence industry, IMO, should join hands with Russia and co develop the Mig 41. We have worked together in Brahmos and Su30 Successfully...we may be building Su57 as well for them...lets enhance the partnership for sixth gen as well. Russia is key to India as it helps keeping both China and US in check.
Chaos Posted October 19, 2025 Posted October 19, 2025 2 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: Russia is apparently working on Sixth gen Mig 41. As usual, they lack manpower and hence their plans are going slower than usual. Indian defence industry, IMO, should join hands with Russia and co develop the Mig 41. We have worked together in Brahmos and Su30 Successfully...we may be building Su57 as well for them...lets enhance the partnership for sixth gen as well. Russia is key to India as it helps keeping both China and US in check. Orai van theeya raaa.
rangeelaraja Posted October 19, 2025 Posted October 19, 2025 https://www.newindianexpress.com/amp/story/nation/2025/Oct/19/army-chief-dwivedi-says-operation-sindoor-to-continue-as-preparations-begin-for-second-phase Why can’t we work in silence ? Why can’t we have an element of surprise ? Why do we always let go commanding positions when we can vanquish the adversary ? Instead coming from the highest offices - we always show preparation, we always telegraph our moves to the enemy and we always back out without finishing the job.
ravishingravi Posted October 19, 2025 Posted October 19, 2025 1 hour ago, rangeelaraja said: https://www.newindianexpress.com/amp/story/nation/2025/Oct/19/army-chief-dwivedi-says-operation-sindoor-to-continue-as-preparations-begin-for-second-phase Why can’t we work in silence ? Why can’t we have an element of surprise ? Why do we always let go commanding positions when we can vanquish the adversary ? Instead coming from the highest offices - we always show preparation, we always telegraph our moves to the enemy and we always back out without finishing the job. I think it's purposeful this time. I have been observing it. It's mind games at play. They know what they are doing.
rangeelaraja Posted October 19, 2025 Posted October 19, 2025 43 minutes ago, ravishingravi said: I think it's purposeful this time. I have been observing it. It's mind games at play. They know what they are doing. Indias acquisitions are being made public, our tests are public. Pak is not sleeping. They and their allies are are helping arm Pak to the teeth. Unless we are heavily deceiving them - they know our capabilities in and out and know how to fight an asymmetrical battle. Element of surprise is 40 % of the battle won - vaporize the enemy when he least expects. Instead we are making them aware of all our moves, and unless this is all part of one big deception, we are only causing them to make counter preparations.
IndianRenegade Posted October 20, 2025 Posted October 20, 2025 22 hours ago, rangeelaraja said: https://www.newindianexpress.com/amp/story/nation/2025/Oct/19/army-chief-dwivedi-says-operation-sindoor-to-continue-as-preparations-begin-for-second-phase Why can’t we work in silence ? Why can’t we have an element of surprise ? Why do we always let go commanding positions when we can vanquish the adversary ? Instead coming from the highest offices - we always show preparation, we always telegraph our moves to the enemy and we always back out without finishing the job. apart from the claim of op sindhoor 2.0 what exactly has he given away?
G_B_ Posted October 20, 2025 Posted October 20, 2025 Seems rafale 114 deal is jeopardy. Good. Import lobby aside. France simply refuses to do a ToT worth its salt. A lot of details of sindoor are coming out and india has struggled with the equivalent of pak data link 17. France refuses to link upto Russian tech (s400). French also dragging feet over meteors for su30mki even with indian radar.(said yes on paper). Blunt truth, india has 35 rafale and 26 on order for navy. Keep it at that. Focus on super sukhoi mki upgrade and have 400 of them alongside 200 off tejas varients. Have 10 to 12 netra. Arm all of them with astra and r37 varients for bvr etc. Focus on amca. Retire the rest. Air force aside focus on mass induction of brahmos 2 pralay and nibhay. Our new gen destoyers should be packed with these missiles. singhvivek141 1
singhvivek141 Posted October 21, 2025 Posted October 21, 2025 7 hours ago, G_B_ said: Seems rafale 114 deal is jeopardy. Good. Import lobby aside. France simply refuses to do a ToT worth its salt. A lot of details of sindoor are coming out and india has struggled with the equivalent of pak data link 17. France refuses to link upto Russian tech (s400). French also dragging feet over meteors for su30mki even with indian radar.(said yes on paper). Blunt truth, india has 35 rafale and 26 on order for navy. Keep it at that. Focus on super sukhoi mki upgrade and have 400 of them alongside 200 off tejas varients. Have 10 to 12 netra. Arm all of them with astra and r37 varients for bvr etc. Focus on amca. Retire the rest. Air force aside focus on mass induction of brahmos 2 pralay and nibhay. Our new gen destoyers should be packed with these missiles. India need to pivot fast. Relying only on 260 odd Sukhoi and 200 Tejas, with a handful of Rafale will deplete our squadron strength badly. We need atleast 1000-1100 fighter jets in our Air force. I am thinking that if we can upgrade the Su30s, whats stopping us to upgrade Mig 29s. If Russian lobby is a concern then just sign the deal for 7-8 squadrons of Su57 (2 off the shelf and remaining 5-6 make in India). That should keep our concerns in check will 2035 and allow Kaveri & AMCA to run without much haste.
Lone Wolf Posted October 21, 2025 Posted October 21, 2025 (edited) On 10/19/2025 at 9:10 PM, singhvivek141 said: Russia is apparently working on Sixth gen Mig 41. As usual, they lack manpower and hence their plans are going slower than usual. Indian defence industry, IMO, should join hands with Russia and co develop the Mig 41. We have worked together in Brahmos and Su30 Successfully...we may be building Su57 as well for them...lets enhance the partnership for sixth gen as well. Russia is key to India as it helps keeping both China and US in check. No way Su57 pull out was a huge lesson for us. Millions went down the drain. India should divert all its funds towards AMCA. Make it 5.5 gen. Why fund Russians out of Indian taxpayers money? Focus on Kaveri and Tejas Mk2 and Naval TEDBF fighters. Already there are talks about lack of funds which may lead to complete scrapping for TEDBF. In future 6th gen fighters will be anyways obsolete. Edited October 21, 2025 by Lone Wolf
singhvivek141 Posted October 21, 2025 Posted October 21, 2025 53 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said: No way Su57 pull out was a huge lesson for us. Millions went down the drain. India should divert all its funds towards AMCA. Make it 5.5 gen. Why fund Russians out of Indian taxpayers money? Focus on Kaveri and Tejas Mk2 and Naval TEDBF fighters. Already there are talks about lack of funds which may lead to complete scrapping for TEDBF. In future 6th gen fighters will be anyways obsolete. Rafale deal is in doldrums. With 29 squadrons, no Astra missile integration, we will be too reliant on S400 to defend ourselves in case of Air strikes. Can't depend on one layer...we need to have multi layered approach. Unless we keep Iran border and Afg border active, Pak will regroup against us, and I don't believe now that the US govt hasn't given them the latest AMRAAM missiles. Tejas Mk1A too is going to struggle without long range BVR missiles.
Lone Wolf Posted October 21, 2025 Posted October 21, 2025 49 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: Rafale deal is in doldrums. With 29 squadrons, no Astra missile integration, we will be too reliant on S400 to defend ourselves in case of Air strikes. Can't depend on one layer...we need to have multi layered approach. Unless we keep Iran border and Afg border active, Pak will regroup against us, and I don't believe now that the US govt hasn't given them the latest AMRAAM missiles. Tejas Mk1A too is going to struggle without long range BVR missiles. Haan toh focus on Kaveri and 4.5 gen fighters like Tejas Mk2 like the rest of the world and work on AMCA + Ghatak UCAV. 5th gen fighters except F35 are not used extensively .. and F35 itself is extremely costly to operate. European nations still rely on their F16s and Typhoons and Rafales mostly for a reason. 4.5 gen fighters should be in large numbers. Only Tejas Mk2 can give us that. Rafale is a temporary setback I am sure IAF will negotiate perhaps not 114 but 60 odd are coming... Safran deal is linked with it in the end. Buy 2-3 squadrons of Su57 along with long range R37M BVR Missiles and even Kinzhal Missiles if needed. We don't have to fight China in short term. We would anyways need to have our own MIC to even effectively deter them. That will take time won't happen overnight. Pakistan is manageable. Integrate Rudram 3 in Su MKI, Astra Mk2 in Tejas Mk1a, Meteors in 36 Rafale & upcoming Rafale M for Navy. Brahmos ER (800km) must be close or max 2 years away if Rajnath is making those claims. All of this is easily achievable without compromising any of our programs. I get IAF is a mess but no need to repeat earlier mistakes.
singhvivek141 Posted October 21, 2025 Posted October 21, 2025 2 hours ago, Lone Wolf said: Haan toh focus on Kaveri and 4.5 gen fighters like Tejas Mk2 like the rest of the world and work on AMCA + Ghatak UCAV. 5th gen fighters except F35 are not used extensively .. and F35 itself is extremely costly to operate. European nations still rely on their F16s and Typhoons and Rafales mostly for a reason. 4.5 gen fighters should be in large numbers. Only Tejas Mk2 can give us that. Rafale is a temporary setback I am sure IAF will negotiate perhaps not 114 but 60 odd are coming... Safran deal is linked with it in the end. Buy 2-3 squadrons of Su57 along with long range R37M BVR Missiles and even Kinzhal Missiles if needed. We don't have to fight China in short term. We would anyways need to have our own MIC to even effectively deter them. That will take time won't happen overnight. Pakistan is manageable. Integrate Rudram 3 in Su MKI, Astra Mk2 in Tejas Mk1a, Meteors in 36 Rafale & upcoming Rafale M for Navy. Brahmos ER (800km) must be close or max 2 years away if Rajnath is making those claims. All of this is easily achievable without compromising any of our programs. I get IAF is a mess but no need to repeat earlier mistakes. The decision on AMCA contracts will not be taken before 2026...I dont remember the month but maybe it was April or May. Astra I integration on Tejas Mk1a has again failed...I dont think the deal for F414 is signed yet. So Mk2 timings is still in jeopardy. 2029-30 onwards we will be able to see the fruits of the investments. But till then, we have to stay put and get something to ensure our Airforce remain competent. And with competent I dont mean to dominate by huffing or puffing, but rather a comprehensive decisive advantage which can be seen and heard from thousand of kilometers away. Su57 or Rafale..both deals will take their own sweet time to deliver considering the deal hasnt been signed yet.
Lone Wolf Posted October 21, 2025 Posted October 21, 2025 37 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: The decision on AMCA contracts will not be taken before 2026...I dont remember the month but maybe it was April or May. Astra I integration on Tejas Mk1a has again failed...I dont think the deal for F414 is signed yet. So Mk2 timings is still in jeopardy. 2029-30 onwards we will be able to see the fruits of the investments. But till then, we have to stay put and get something to ensure our Airforce remain competent. And with competent I dont mean to dominate by huffing or puffing, but rather a comprehensive decisive advantage which can be seen and heard from thousand of kilometers away. Su57 or Rafale..both deals will take their own sweet time to deliver considering the deal hasnt been signed yet. That's why I was saying why fund for Russian 6th gen?? Ghatak UCAV can be operational inside 2 years if there is good conviction. Yes Indian BVR capability and Astra series hasn't gone to plan but the other options are worse. I would rather wait couple of years rather than import missiles from Israel and kill Astra series. They are already trying to derail Rudram by larping for Air Lora... And Import Bahadurs in MoD are proper sell outs. PAF even if it gets hold of advanced range American BVR's, IAF's current doctrine is completely based on standoff strikes. Our ballistic and Air launched Missiles should be in good numbers. Throw in Pralay and LrAshm. If sh*t hits the fan we should do this in short term. Pakistan's air defence and radar capabilities are still in vulnerable state and it will take time for Americans and Chinese to upgrade them.
singhvivek141 Posted October 21, 2025 Posted October 21, 2025 3 hours ago, Lone Wolf said: That's why I was saying why fund for Russian 6th gen?? Ghatak UCAV can be operational inside 2 years if there is good conviction. Yes Indian BVR capability and Astra series hasn't gone to plan but the other options are worse. I would rather wait couple of years rather than import missiles from Israel and kill Astra series. They are already trying to derail Rudram by larping for Air Lora... And Import Bahadurs in MoD are proper sell outs. PAF even if it gets hold of advanced range American BVR's, IAF's current doctrine is completely based on standoff strikes. Our ballistic and Air launched Missiles should be in good numbers. Throw in Pralay and LrAshm. This is where we should expand madly, instead of doing pick and choose, we need to have an ability to launch barrage of missiles so that even if 40-60% of them gets interrupted using advance defence systems like THAAD or Patriot...remaining should be able to make an impact and cause brute devastation in the enemy territory. Agni is our tactical nuclear missile, AI predicts the numbers are between 80-120 across various Gen's. Even if I take a conservative estimate, it should be ideally be between 300-400. Same goes for Sagarika (Naval SLBM) and Pinaka ER which has a range of 90km+. Also, when I say to engage with Russia for Mig 41, I don't mean to fund it entirely, but to co-produce it. I know, the experience with Su-57 perhaps wasn't optimal. But as we've collaborated with them well with Brahmos and with Su-30MKI....we should definitely explore the option to co-produce Mig 41 provided it suits our needs mutually. It's just that our babus and engineers shouldn't depend on Russia but rather have a 50-50 partnership. I am not sure it will be viable, but given the way geopolitics is changing, India seems to drifting away from US. It's about time we prepare ourselves for every possible surprise.
singhvivek141 Posted October 21, 2025 Posted October 21, 2025 Not directly related to Op Sindoor. But apparently India did drone strikes against NSCN in Myanmar. https://arunachal24.in/arunachal-massive-drones-strike-hit-insurgent-camps-along-indo-myanmar-border/
Lone Wolf Posted October 21, 2025 Posted October 21, 2025 8 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: This is where we should expand madly, instead of doing pick and choose, we need to have an ability to launch barrage of missiles so that even if 40-60% of them gets interrupted using advance defence systems like THAAD or Patriot...remaining should be able to make an impact and cause brute devastation in the enemy territory. Agni is our tactical nuclear missile, AI predicts the numbers are between 80-120 across various Gen's. Even if I take a conservative estimate, it should be ideally be between 300-400. Same goes for Sagarika (Naval SLBM) and Pinaka ER which has a range of 90km+. Also, when I say to engage with Russia for Mig 41, I don't mean to fund it entirely, but to co-produce it. I know, the experience with Su-57 perhaps wasn't optimal. But as we've collaborated with them well with Brahmos and with Su-30MKI....we should definitely explore the option to co-produce Mig 41 provided it suits our needs mutually. It's just that our babus and engineers shouldn't depend on Russia but rather have a 50-50 partnership. I am not sure it will be viable, but given the way geopolitics is changing, India seems to drifting away from US. It's about time we prepare ourselves for every possible surprise. Agni series is mostly for last resort... Don't think India is in a mood to use these against Pakistan. Our war with Pakistan would be likely more tactical. There would be missile warfare for sure... It's risky buisness as well. Mostly quick strikes crippling them in a matter of hours leaving them only limited scope of retaliation other than Nuclear is our best shot. That can be achieved by using anti radiation missiles like Rudram 3 on their air bases and radar systems and Hypersonic missiles aided with a barrage of Extended Range Pinakas Guided Pinakas with 15 Brahmos per air base. Pakistan army will be out in the open and then begins the actual thrashing.
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