What was more difficult task in WC finals ?

[Raghav_12]

Comparing these two only makes sense when we the result were the same in both cases. Given that we totally choked chasing 350+, 2003 shouldn't even be discussed on par with the 1983 performance, it was a shameful display, period, falling short by 125+ runs. It is a different matter if we did indeed chase 350+ or at a minimum came close, then one can ask if it was more difficult. A better comparison would be between the 1983 defense of a low score vs the 275 chase of 2011, cause in both those cases, something was achieved. That 03 team would have probably failed to chase even the 275 target.

Agree with this. Chasing 275 and defending 183 were somehow at par. Chasing 360 something from different planet altogether. There have been enough occassions where 180 and 190's have been defended successfully. But 360+ chases are still very few.

[yoda]

Agree with this. Chasing 275 and defending 183 were somehow at par. Chasing 360 something from different planet altogether. There have been enough occassions where 180 and 190's have been defended successfully. But 360+ chases are still very few.

Yea, but only if we did. Fact that we scored 225 chasing 360 means, we did diddly squat with that chase and it shouldn't even be mentioned along with the 183 defense. It is insulting to the 83 team. Only reason why 183 and 275 are comparable is not because they were par, cause they were accomplished or at least came close.

[Sehwag1830]

So defending 183 against WI is at par with chasing 275 against SL in 2011 in difficulty level. :hysterical:

[yoda]

So defending 183 against WI is at par with chasing 275 against SL in 2011 in difficulty level. :hysterical:

No, but they are comparable and one can draw conclusions. WI ofc the better the opponent, also playing away from home, defending a low score with one specialist bowler, etc. The ones in your OP are not comparable, cause we didn't even come close with 360. It is more like comparing scoring 225 (chasing 360) vs defending 183. What is there to compare here? :winky:

[Sehwag1830]

^^^ Did you forget to read halfway stage in OP ?

[daryl1985]

Agreed. But with a slight clarification. Anybody who considers Mcgrath is the greatest LOI bowler would need a reality check. I wont consider Mcgrath amongst top 3 greatest LOI bowler, heck I wont see him in top 5 either. So all this nonsense of chasing a large total against a great bowling attack is just that. On the other hand Richards IS the greatest LOI batsman, or atleast amongst top 2 alongside Sachin. To defend a low score against him, that too by a team who had 1:66 odds is terrific. Is this even a question? Kidding me.

They also had Brett Lee in the attack. 2 top class LOI bowlers. India have always struggled against McGrath.

[Lurker]

They also had Brett Lee in the attack. 2 top class LOI bowlers. India have always struggled against McGrath.

True. How would that attack compare against Marshall, Garner Roberts & Holding on a green top in swinging conditions though. Batting wise would a team of Greenidge Haynes Richards Lloyd perform any worse than Indians on a batting wicket??

[vvvslaxman]

But conditions were aiding medium fast swing bowlers then and that was not a patta wicket in 2003. Indian bowlers made that look patta. it was a green track but Indian bowlers started bowling short where they had to bowl fuller and were carted around.

nope.> it was a patta wicket. They shaved off all the grass. The tactic of Gilchrist was very obvious from the get go. Ganguly just didn't react. Gilly was standing almost two feet outside the crease forcing Srinath to bowl short. But it was sheer talent of Gilly to pull the short balls from there. After the start given by Gilly, wheels started coming off for Indian bowlers. They simply hit through the line. Pitch was easy. Ground was small. Even Ganguly and Viru smacked Mcgrath for six over cover.

[Clarke]

We needed a world record chase to win the 2003 final. The biggest chase ever against the defending champions that were unbeaten in the tournament. In comparison, West Indies had been beaten once by India in the league stages while Australia massacred us. There were atleast 5 successful defenses of sub-175 totals pre-83 and some more after that. When it comes to chasing 350+, we know that particular match and that's about it. http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/story/253079.html

[Laaloo]

23 BHAKTS :hmmm:

[Lurker]

23 BHAKTS :hmmm:

22 actually. You are maha-bhakt. :bumsmack:

[Number]

We needed a world record chase to win the 2003 final. The biggest chase ever against the defending champions that were unbeaten in the tournament. In comparison, West Indies had been beaten once by India in the league stages while Australia massacred us. There were atleast 5 successful defenses of sub-175 totals pre-83 and some more after that. When it comes to chasing 350+, we know that particular match and that's about it. http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/story/253079.html

Against Australia no team while batting second could cross 300 , before the famous 438 run chase. :hatsoff:

[CSK Fan]

Agreed. But with a slight clarification. Anybody who considers Mcgrath is the greatest LOI bowler would need a reality check. I wont consider Mcgrath amongst top 3 greatest LOI bowler, heck I wont see him in top 5 either. So all this nonsense of chasing a large total against a great bowling attack is just that. On the other hand Richards IS the greatest LOI batsman, or atleast amongst top 2 alongside Sachin. To defend a low score against him, that too by a team who had 1:66 odds is terrific. Is this even a question? Kidding me.

So please tell me. How many times was a score of 250 crossed by 1983? How low a score was 183 when the average scores used to be 220?? We are comparing it with today's standards

[maniac]

Ok here is the question.......Was it more difficult to contain an aussie line up or restricting a WI line up in a chase of 183 Do a comparison of the bowling attacks and you will get your answer. chasing 360 was due to our own doing.1983 was allround a more difficult task which was acheived.

[Lurker]

So please tell me. How many times was a score of 250 crossed by 1983? How low a score was 183 when the average scores used to be 220?? We are comparing it with today's standards

Really? Thats how comparison are gonna go now? By today's standards lol. In that case why even bother for anything aside from today?? Back to your question though, you will have to do the legwork here MTC but if my childhood memory serves me right the first 3 games in 1983 WC saw teams score 300 plus. So what now?

[vvvslaxman]

You gotta take into account those were 60 overs matches

[Lurker]

You gotta take into account those were 60 overs matches

60 overs game was a relic of MCC past. You have to keep in mind that till 1983, WC was held in England and since England had long summers games could be played for 60 overs each. Games in other countries were often shorter. India winning 1983 played a key role in the awakening if you will and 1987 WC coming our way and before you knew it was 45 and 50 overs. By the way going back to 250 plus scores in 1983, didnt we score 250 plus runs against West Indies in league game as well, which we won?? So there you go MTC, 4 scores of 250 in 1983 WC itself..all top of mind. :cantstop:

[Lurker]

One more and then I will keep quiet...:cantstop: A week before India played West Indies in finals, Australia had scored 273/6 and West Indies had chased down the score with 4 wickets down. Admittedly this was an Aussie side on the way down but an attack that has Lillee, Thomson , Rodney Hogg is certainly not 2nd best to that of Madan Lals and Sandhus. Considering the game was played on the same ground, Lords, it should show all that needs to be said about the bowling display of India in finals. http://www.espncricinfo.com/wc1983/engine/match/65082.html There you go MTC, 1 more game of 250 plus. You must be a happy man now :fishing::fishing: Thanks for making me dig these scorecards though, they are always fun

[Zelig]

Didn't we beat the Windies in a league match prior to the finals in '83? :hmmm: At least, Kapil's team would have had some belief going into the break. OTOH chasing 360 runs against McGrath, Gillespie (tormented us in the league match), Lee & Hogg is next to impossible.

[Yoda-esque]

India had defeated WI earlier in the WC in '83 while they were schooled by Aussies in the league match in '03. Chasing 350 odd against Aussies was near next to impossible.