Ashwin is 1/379 in NZ and South Africa across all formats

[Lord]

If Ashwin is coming round the wicket to a right-hander' date= then automatically you are removing leg before decision out of equation. Which means your mindset is negative I thought for an offspinner on non spinning tracks best way to get LBW to right hander is go round the wicket and get it straighten, if he bowl over the wicket the impact will always be outside the offstump, I dont know what hell is Prassana talking about.

its not gonna turn from round the wicket,so even if you hit the pad,most probably it is pitching outside leg.from over the wicket you can pitch it on off stump and if batsman misses it'll hit him in line

[AnkurUpadhyay]

If Ashwin is coming round the wicket to a right-hander' date= then automatically you are removing leg before decision out of equation. Which means your mindset is negative I thought for an offspinner on non spinning tracks best way to get LBW to right hander is go round the wicket and get it straighten, if he bowl over the wicket the impact will always be outside the offstump, I dont know what hell is Prassana talking about.

It's very difficult to get LBWs from round the wicket as most of the balls are pitched outside the line of leg stump. On top of that, Umpires rarely give batsmen LBW from round the stumps even if the ball has pitched in line. The only off spinner I have seen getting LBWs from round the wicket was Murali. Ashwin rarely pitches ball outside off stump from round the wickets because he doesn't turn his off spinner much. Most of the times, he pitches it into batsmen's pad to control the flow of runs. He has become a very defensive bowler.

[vvvslaxman]

It's very difficult to get LBWs from round the wicket as most of the balls are pitched outside the line of leg stump. On top of that, Umpires rarely give batsmen LBW from round the stumps even if the ball has pitched in line. The only off spinner I have seen getting LBWs from round the wicket was Murali. Ashwin rarely pitches ball outside off stump from round the wickets because he doesn't turn his off spinner much. Most of the times, he pitches it into batsmen's pad to control the flow of runs. He has become a very defensive bowler.

Not true. For an offie you don't pitch outside the leg stump. It will go further down the leg side. You pitch it on or around off stump and try to turn it back or straighten. Either will get leg before decisions. Muralitharan also uses that strategy as an attacking option. That is how Murali got Dhoni in fateful 2007 world cup. Watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_WBSNxPR3I&feature=youtu.be&t=35s

[vvvslaxman]

Ashwin looks to depend on natural variations of pitch. Bit up and down, some ball skidding on, some ball holding up. He combines well with such elements on Indian pitches. On true pitches these things are not going to be there. He will struggle. On true wickets, someone who is this tall with exaggerated flight, will always provide plenty of time for batsman to adjust.

[AnkurUpadhyay]

Not true. For an offie you don't pitch outside the leg stump. It will go further down the leg side. You pitch it on or around off stump and try to turn it back or straighten. Either will get leg before decisions. Muralitharan also uses that strategy as an attacking option. That is how Murali got Dhoni in fateful 2007 world cup. Watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_WBSNxPR3I&feature=youtu.be&t=35s

I already mentioned Murali. He was successful with this strategy because he had a Doosra that used to turn like leg spin and he used to turn his off spin square. That used to create doubts in batsman's mind. Ashwin doesn't have a doosra and he rarely turns his off spin. On top of that he rarely bowls on or outside off stump from round the wickets. Most of his balls are on middle and leg stump and are easy pickings for the batsmen. I can understand this strategy in LOIs to an extent but he often tries it in test too.

[AnkurUpadhyay]

Ashwin looks to depend on natural variations of pitch. Bit up and down' date=' some ball skidding on, some ball holding up. He combines well with such elements on Indian pitches. On true pitches these things are not going to be there. He will struggle. On true wickets, someone who is this tall with exaggerated flight, will always provide plenty of time for batsman to adjust.[/quote'] His action also doesn't use his body to give rip and revolutions to the ball. It's all wrists and arms. That's why he often doesn't get enough purchase from the wicket.

[Marut]

When a bowler is out of groove, almost everything he does looks stupid. And for a spin bowler from the SC to find himself out of sorts while playing in SA and NZ is a real nightmare. It can be confidence shattering for Ashwin right now. He should take some time off, meet players like Kumble and work on his game. Prasanna was a very good bowler in India, but even while playing in a more bowler friendly era, he was not spectacular overseas, averaging 58 in England, 125 in Pakistan and 42 in WI - he was successful in Australia though. Today it is very tough for a SC spinner to bowl outside comfort zone - Swann is the only modern bowler I consider a genuine wicket taker on all surfaces, even Ajmal requires much pitch assistance.

[alexander]

People used to moan when I backed bhaji and defended his economy rate! Not such a joke bhaji carrer now is it you ungrateful sobs

Cos you have a great track record of accurate calls. #rohitsharmaisclass #ishantistherealdeal :hysterical:

[putrevus]

Whatever he is talking, he could be right as he has 49 caps playing for India. Probably in overseas going around the wicket is pointless as the ball might slide through the off stump rather than coming back in.

It does not matter how many caps he got , it is the question of logic.

its not gonna turn from round the wicket,so even if you hit the pad,most probably it is pitching outside leg.from over the wicket you can pitch it on off stump and if batsman misses it'll hit him in line

How can it pitch outside the leg then it will be wide,for any offspinner even in tests you go around the wicket to get lbw to a right hander, other than sub continent pitches I dont know how else can any offspinner get lbws bowling over the wicket on non turning tracks.

It's very difficult to get LBWs from round the wicket as most of the balls are pitched outside the line of leg stump. On top of that, Umpires rarely give batsmen LBW from round the stumps even if the ball has pitched in line. The only off spinner I have seen getting LBWs from round the wicket was Murali. Ashwin rarely pitches ball outside off stump from round the wickets because he doesn't turn his off spinner much. Most of the times, he pitches it into batsmen's pad to control the flow of runs. He has become a very defensive bowler.

You dont pitch outside off stump from around the wicket you pitch on off and middle and get it to straighten. only other way offspinner can get lbw to right hander from over the wicket without ball turning a mile from outside the offstump is against sweep shot but then bounce will come into picture as the ball will be short. You dont need doosra for look at Swann getting lbw against Kohli and that is standard LBW for offspinner against right hander B7ACZmgrPhk

[Lord]

. How can it pitch outside the leg then it will be wide,for any offspinner even in tests you go around the wicket to get lbw to a right hander, other than sub continent pitches I dont know how else can any offspinner get lbws bowling over the wicket on non turning tracks.

I think you are confused between over and round:hmmm: It won't be wide if its pitched outside leg from round the stumps,it'll hit the pads as the ball isnt turning.

[putrevus]

I think you are confused between over and round:hmmm: It won't be wide if its pitched outside leg from round the stumps,it'll hit the pads as the ball isnt turning.

It is not me who is getting confused between over and round the wicket how will off spinner pitch outside the leg stump to the right hander and not be wide in odis even if it is not turning.That was major problem with Bhajji he was darting the ball and when they pitched outside the leg most of them were harmless wides .

[Lord]

It is not me who is getting confused between over and round the wicket how will off spinner pitch outside the leg stump to the right hander and not be wide in odis even if it is not turning.That was major problem with Bhajji he was darting the ball and when they pitched outside the leg most of them were harmless wides .

those were from over the wicket.Don't think Bhajji bowled much from round the wicket,especially in ODIs.

[vvvslaxman]

Problem with Ashwin is not over the wicket or round the wicket. Frankly it didn't matter. He sucked bowling both. He is far too slow and not enough revolutions to bother batsman. we can put up stats of others and justify his failures. But fact is this guy hardly ever beat the bat let alone pick a wicket. He looked worse than a part timer at times. Why would you waste a space for such a bowler.

[rkt.india]

If Ashwin is coming round the wicket to a right-hander' date= then automatically you are removing leg before decision out of equation. Which means your mindset is negative I thought for an offspinner on non spinning tracks best way to get LBW to right hander is go round the wicket and get it straighten, if he bowl over the wicket the impact will always be outside the offstump, I dont know what hell is Prassana talking about.

yeah, that's what I thought. Akalpit

[rkt.india]

One thing he can do is attack the stumps and mix his pace. Vettori is a great example who barely turned the ball, was 6'4" taller than Ashwin, but attacked the stumps and mixed the pace up well, deceived them with pace variation. Akalpit

[Marut]

Problem with Ashwin is not over the wicket or round the wicket. Frankly it didn't matter. He sucked bowling both. He is far too slow and not enough revolutions to bother batsman. we can put up stats of others and justify his failures. But fact is this guy hardly ever beat the bat let alone pick a wicket. He looked worse than a part timer at times. Why would you waste a space for such a bowler.

That is exactly why a spinner does not get wickets. If he has deliveries that beat the bat with some frequency then he will have some wickets, at least tailender wickets. In ODIs, Ashwin has definitely disappointed over the last 12 months. In test matches, the sample size is too low to form a judgement, as he was promptly removed after one failure. He was hardly penetrative in that test, but on a spinner's graveyard at the Wanderers at least he kept it tight and did not leak runs - giving away only 2.3 runs per over. A spin bowler who hardly looks to beat the bat (as you say) normally gets clobbered in SA, NZ and Aus and goes for over 4 an over (imagine - he was bowling to the ominous spin destroyer ABCD most of the time, and he could have been murdered if he were so easy to put off) - which was not happening with Ashwin. I think Ashwin will come back strongly in the test area with experience, we some times forget that he has just 2 years of test experience and spinners mature with age - but he needs to work on his game. Unlike some other players, Ashwin will get a longer rope and I think he will bounce back. He needs to be dropped for one full tour to give him a reality check - if he takes his place for granted, we are spoiliing him and also putting India in danger.