Ganguly taught us how to win outside India: Harbhajan Singh

[Austin 3:!6]

No he was not. More controversies erupted under Ganguly than others. Besides as a batsman he should not have been in the squad let alone captain. He was neither tactically sound nor a great man manager. He openly fought with Srinath on the field in West Indies. An otherwise Srinath yelled back at Ganguly. Then his spat with Dravid. Then his comment about Dravid declaring innings when Tendulkar was on 194. Just look at the comments he is spitting these days. Look at the guys he promotes these days. Does he talk anything sense?

He was the best ODI batsman for India from 97 - 01. Scored more runs/centuries than Tendulkar at that time. He was batting like a bomb in the 2000 ICC champions trophy when he was the skipper.He had a slug in form for few years but every great players go through that. He was back to his supreme best when he made his return to the tour of SA in 06. You sure he don't deserve to be in the team as a batsman? I followed a different cricket then in early 2000's. When you lead a team, specially a team like India where regionalism at its peak when he took over and our cricket was hanging in match fixing cloud, you need to be strict. He did exactly that and in the process came few (very minor) controversies. As a skipper he has all the right to yell at Srinath if you can't bend down to stop a ball. If he didn't ask Dravid to declare the innings when Sachin was at 194 we would not beaten Pakistan in Pakistan 1st time in the history. Dravid never had had the guts to ask Sachin to come out when he was so close to double century. Its always team 1st and individual next...thats exactly what ganguly did. That is why even today players like Sehwag, Bhajji, Zak, Yuvi praise Ganguly as a leader.

[Crookbond]

He was the best ODI batsman for India from 97 - 01. Scored more runs/centuries than Tendulkar at that time. He was batting like a bomb in the 2000 ICC champions trophy when he was the skipper.He had a slug in form for few years but every great players go through that. He was back to his supreme best when he made his return to the tour of SA in 06. You sure he don't deserve to be in the team as a batsman? I followed a different cricket then in early 2000's. When you lead a team, specially a team like India where regionalism at its peak when he took over and our cricket was hanging in match fixing cloud, you need to be strict. He did exactly that and in the process came few (very minor) controversies. As a skipper he has all the right to yell at Srinath if you can't bend down to stop a ball. If he didn't ask Dravid to declare the innings when Sachin was at 194 we would not beaten Pakistan in Pakistan 1st time in the history. Dravid never had had the guts to ask Sachin to come out when he was so close to double century. Its always team 1st and individual next...thats exactly what ganguly did. That is why even today players like Sehwag, Bhajji, Zak, Yuvi praise Ganguly as a leader.

This is exactly what Ganguly-mania is all about. Mixing fiction with facts to make Ganguly "aggressive", "great leader" etc.

[Austin 3:!6]

This is exactly what Ganguly-mania is all about. Mixing fiction with facts to make Ganguly "aggressive"' date=' "great leader" etc.[/quote'] Ungrateful souls who only prefers yes man like Dravid :headshake:

[Crookbond]

Ungrateful souls who only prefers yes man like Dravid :headshake:

If you attribute the declaration of Tendulkar on 194* to Ganguly, you indeed were watching a different game.

[Lord]

He was the best ODI batsman for India from 97 - 01. Scored more runs/centuries than Tendulkar at that time. He was batting like a bomb in the 2000 ICC champions trophy when he was the skipper.He had a slug in form for few years but every great players go through that. He was back to his supreme best when he made his return to the tour of SA in 06. You sure he don't deserve to be in the team as a batsman? I followed a different cricket then in early 2000's. When you lead a team, specially a team like India where regionalism at its peak when he took over and our cricket was hanging in match fixing cloud, you need to be strict. He did exactly that and in the process came few (very minor) controversies. As a skipper he has all the right to yell at Srinath if you can't bend down to stop a ball. If he didn't ask Dravid to declare the innings when Sachin was at 194 we would not beaten Pakistan in Pakistan 1st time in the history. Dravid never had had the guts to ask Sachin to come out when he was so close to double century. Its always team 1st and individual next...thats exactly what ganguly did. That is why even today players like Sehwag, Bhajji, Zak, Yuvi praise Ganguly as a leader.

that decision was made by Dravid.I think he himself admitted it regardless was a pathetic decision,not gutsy aggresive etc.

[Crookbond]

that decision was made by Dravid.I think he himself admitted it regardless was a pathetic decision,not gutsy aggresive etc.

Aggressive Ganguly, Dada, Babu Moshoi etc. forced Dravid to make that decision. There's no way a "YES-man" like Dravid can make such a decision.

[adi B]

True that. Both are bad.. We just forgot . That's it. We just hype Ganguly to the hilt because Dhoni has hit the nadir. India was roundly thrashed. in 8 tests. India did not cross 300 even once in 8 tests. If that was what Ganguly going to have from his batsmen he would have produced similar results as well.

but the thing is many people would have respected dhoni if he stepped down from captaincy after the 8-0 debacle,forget that,he was unfazed even after the home loss to england(still cant believe we lost to them)..he does not even care anymore and is way past his captaincy sell out date

[vvvslaxman]

He was the best ODI batsman for India from 97 - 01. Scored more runs/centuries than Tendulkar at that time. He was batting like a bomb in the 2000 ICC champions trophy when he was the skipper.He had a slug in form for few years but every great players go through that. He was back to his supreme best when he made his return to the tour of SA in 06. You sure he don't deserve to be in the team as a batsman? I followed a different cricket then in early 2000's. When you lead a team, specially a team like India where regionalism at its peak when he took over and our cricket was hanging in match fixing cloud, you need to be strict. He did exactly that and in the process came few (very minor) controversies. As a skipper he has all the right to yell at Srinath if you can't bend down to stop a ball. If he didn't ask Dravid to declare the innings when Sachin was at 194 we would not beaten Pakistan in Pakistan 1st time in the history. Dravid never had had the guts to ask Sachin to come out when he was so close to double century. Its always team 1st and individual next...thats exactly what ganguly did. That is why even today players like Sehwag, Bhajji, Zak, Yuvi praise Ganguly as a leader.

On the contrary Ganguly said he would not have declared. http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cricket/Dravid-was-wrong-to-declare-Ganguly/articleshow/595702.cms Ganguly declared when Dravid was on 91 in the previous test

[vvvslaxman]

but the thing is many people would have respected dhoni if he stepped down from captaincy after the 8-0 debacle' date='forget that,he was unfazed even after the home loss to england(still cant believe we lost to them)..he does not even care anymore and is way past his captaincy sell out date[/quote'] yea.. i am also frustrated with his callousness. He should make way for someone else in Tests.

[adi B]

Ganguly & Dhoni extremely underrated and Dravid & Kumble extremely overated in this forum for some strange reason.

in tests,i rate ganguly and dravid as a good leader and captain but not dhoni and i dont think kumble was good tbh

[vvvslaxman]

Ungrateful souls who only prefers yes man like Dravid :headshake:

Dravid is tactically much smarter, he reads the game much better than Ganguly ever did in his life. Most of the suggestions by him in the commentary box is nothing but BS lol. I remember the Bangalore test when series was on the line. Pakistan came into bat for some quick runs. What did Gangu do. He asked Kumble and Tendu to bowl wide down the leg side . Younis Khan just feasted on our negative bowling and made faster runs than they would have scored otherwise. Ganguly is arrogant. We perceived it as aggression because of results that came under him.

[adi B]

No he was not. More controversies erupted under Ganguly than others. Besides as a batsman he should not have been in the squad let alone captain. He was neither tactically sound nor a great man manager. He openly fought with Srinath on the field in West Indies. An otherwise Srinath yelled back at Ganguly. Then his spat with Dravid. Then his comment about Dravid declaring innings when Tendulkar was on 194. Just look at the comments he is spitting these days. Look at the guys he promotes these days. Does he talk anything sense?

i so wish dhoni does that with one of his bowlers on-field.he looks so uninterested nowadays and hardly ever talks with his bowlers

[vvvslaxman]

Let us start fresh. Build a nucleus and appoint the right person among them. Most likely Kohli is giong to be the next to take over. He should have a clear vision with the team. He does not need to copy anyone.

[maniac]

Dravid's success as a captain has to go to Chappell......Chapell was not a Kirsten or a Fletcher kind of a coach ,yes the guy was an arrogant jerk but show me one person here who can deny that he wasn't a hands-on coach who took the initiative.He had a lot more say than any coach in recent times and Dravid was the perfect foil for this. People highlight the Ganguly spat and Irfan Pathan debacle but from a future point of view alot of credit goes to Chapeell and Dravid was the direct beneficiary of this. As much as I am a Dadafan,I will say Chappell was right when he asked him to resign but the had personality clashes and ego problems because Ganguly was very much like Guru Greg in nature,A guy who believed in the aggressive,initiative taking approach.

[putrevus]

The thing which works in favor of Ganguly after his captaincy was gone he did well again as a batsman and was only one batsmen of modern Indian batting stars (not by his own design) who left with something still in the tank. Sachin took his batting to a level where his gas tank not even running on empty. Dravid other than England series was done long time back so was Laxman.

[putrevus]

Dravid's success as a captain has to go to Chappell......Chapell was not a Kirsten or a Fletcher kind of a coach ,yes the guy was an arrogant jerkbut show me one person here who can deny that he wasn't a hands-on coach who took the initiative.He had a lot more say than any coach in recent times and Dravid was the perfect foli for this. People highlight the Ganguly spat and Irfan Pathan debacle but from a futurepoint of view alot of credit goes to Chapeell and Dravid was the beneficiary. As much as I am a Dadafan,I will say Chappell was right when he asked him to resign but the had personality clashes and ego problems because Ganguly was very much like Guru Greg in nature,A guy who beleived in the aggressive,initiative taking approach.

But thing which works against Greg is his own team in Australia did not want him anywhere near them when he was selector and now they are wining everything after he was let go. Greg never succeeded anywhere with his methods. Dada wins that battle because he was successful with john wright.

[adi B]

Dravid is tactically much smarter' date=' he reads the game much better than Ganguly ever did in his life. Most of the suggestions by him in the commentary box is nothing but BS lol. I remember the Bangalore test when series was on the line. Pakistan came into bat for some quick runs. What did Gangu do. He asked Kumble and Tendu to bowl wide down the leg side . Younis Khan just feasted on our negative bowling and made faster runs than they would have scored otherwise. Ganguly is arrogant. We perceived it as aggression because of results that came under him.[/quote'] ganguly too was defensive at times and he too played the safety 1st option quite a lot of times..but he will always be remembered for his record outside SC,we were literally minnow abroad.u can say that he had dravid,kumble,tendu who were in beast mode in those tours but what mattered was that we were competent,began winning matches there.. for years we didnt win a test match in windies,australia,england,pakistan and at last we won under him(like it or not) ,that wc run in 2003 was amazing(almost all his moves worked after the initial jitters especially in that match against nzl) ,we did extremely well in the CTs .. tbh his away odi records are not that bad as well,we won fair no.of odis in saf,nzl,aus,england,windies .looking at our situation today,u cant blame people who recall those days as "golden period or glory days"

[maniac]

ganguly too was defensive at times and he too played the safety 1st option quite a lot of times..but he will always be remembered for his record outside SC,we were literally minnow abroad.u can say that he had dravid,kumble,tendu who were in beast mode in those tours but what mattered was that we were competent,began winning matches there.. for years we didnt win a test match in windies,australia,england,pakistan and at last we won under him(like it or not) ,that wc run in 2003 was amazing(almost all his moves worked after the initial jitters especially in that match against nzl) ,we did extremely well in the CTs .. tbh his away odi records are not that bad as well,we won fair no.of odis in saf,nzl,aus,england,windies .looking at our situation today,u cant blame people who recall those days as "golden period or glory days"

The difference here is Ganguly inherited a team in crisis and took it to some great highs,his lowest point was due to personal performance not team performnce. Dhoni on the other hand inherited a super star team,accomplished a lot very quickly thanks to his star studded team was at it's peak and then took the team to great depths as well.

[Lord]

Dravid's success as a captain has to go to Chappell......Chapell was not a Kirsten or a Fletcher kind of a coach ,yes the guy was an arrogant jerk but show me one person here who can deny that he wasn't a hands-on coach who took the initiative.He had a lot more say than any coach in recent times and Dravid was the perfect foil for this. People highlight the Ganguly spat and Irfan Pathan debacle but from a future point of view alot of credit goes to Chapeell and Dravid was the direct beneficiary of this. As much as I am a Dadafan,I will say Chappell was right when he asked him to resign but the had personality clashes and ego problems because Ganguly was very much like Guru Greg in nature,A guy who believed in the aggressive,initiative taking approach.

:blink: our biggest victory,that in England 2007,came after he was sacked. What good did Chappell do except creating a insecure and infighting dressing room?

[vvvslaxman]

ganguly too was defensive at times and he too played the safety 1st option quite a lot of times..but he will always be remembered for his record outside SC,we were literally minnow abroad.u can say that he had dravid,kumble,tendu who were in beast mode in those tours but what mattered was that we were competent,began winning matches there.. for years we didnt win a test match in windies,australia,england,pakistan and at last we won under him(like it or not) ,that wc run in 2003 was amazing(almost all his moves worked after the initial jitters especially in that match against nzl) ,we did extremely well in the CTs .. tbh his away odi records are not that bad as well,we won fair no.of odis in saf,nzl,aus,england,windies .looking at our situation today,u cant blame people who recall those days as "golden period or glory days"

Under Ganguly the same team that lost 0-8 would have lost 0-8 guarantee with that kind of batting performance. In SA it was rather a rookie side. But proper team selection should have helped us surprise SA. That is where he missed everything. In NZ he should have pushed for win. Sadly team selection again was poor. But our fielding also was abysmal. Also Dhoni is also defensive like Ganguly. I want someone who is tactically very very good . Someone who can buy wickets with a bit of strategy in unhelpful conditions. Dhoni's problem was he never made an attempt to build a bowling UNIT. India has never produced a fast bowler that can run through sides since Kapil dev. Even he was not in the mould of West Indian fast bowlers. We always depended on 2 or 3 fast bowlers clicking together. Kumble was a fantastic overseas spinner for us post 2000. India lacks dependable bowlers these days. But onus is on Dhoni to identify them.