10 years of MS Dhoni - Debate thread

[diga]

Genius. If you are winning matches while chasing and hitting the winning runs of course you will be notout.

and even when you lose ... moron

[bulbul]

he had enough in test matches' date=' like in second innings of last test match in Australia :winky:[/quote'] Even fanatics know they cannot defend Dhoni in tests so they solely concentrating on ODI...next target is IPL :giggle:

[Sidhoni]

he had enough in test matches' date=' like in second innings of last test match in Australia :winky:[/quote'] I thought we were talking about being best ODI finisher. But how can I expect Sachin fans to stay on topic. While we are at it, Sachin also had chances in 2 WC finals didn't he?

[Raghav_12]

I thought we were talking about being best ODI finisher. But how can I expect Sachin fans to stay on topic. While we are at it' date=' Sachin also had chances in 2 WC finals didn't he?[/quote'] Sachin isn't claimed as Greatest Finisher, Dhoni IS. and topic is Dhoni not Sachin. Thanks for staying on topic :giggle:

[jalebi_bhai]

So if he has highest average while chasing doesn't that count for anything? Also while you are at it look at other players' examples to look at how many they have.

No it doesn't count for anything........because averages are personal milestones........stop shifting the goal posts.......I asked a very simple question....... And regarding contemporaries.........half of the centuries Kohli has scored have resulted in India wins........he has even remained not out in a good number of those matches........lol........vice captain is already statistically a better finisher than captain :giggle:........ Check out De Villiers' stats guru http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/44936.html?class=2;orderby=innings_number;template=results;type=batting;view=innings

[gattaca]

Fair enough...3rd there as well but credit where due as he is a lower order player.... but then again the great destroyer of bowling attacks and finisher has a mammoth S/R of 73.98

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[Sidhoni]

Sachin isn't claimed as Greatest Finisher' date=' Dhoni IS. and topic is Dhoni not Sachin. Thanks for staying on topic :giggle:[/quote'] I just followed you in going off topic.

[gattaca]

No Matter how much we bash dhoni we will not find another one like him who will finish matches in odis. Also how many indian keepers have double century in a test match. The only thing I dont like is is captaincy in tests. It will great reality check for us once dhoni retries and we will struggle to find finishers like him. Enjoy while we can.

[bulbul]

No Matter how much we bash dhoni we will not find another one like him who will finish matches in odis. Also how many indian keepers have double century in a test match. The only thing I dont like is is captaincy in tests. It will great reality check for us once dhoni retries and we will struggle to find finishers like him. Enjoy while we can.

Even Kohli??

[jalebi_bhai]

No Matter how much we bash dhoni we will not find another one like him who will finish matches in odis. Also how many indian keepers have double century in a test match. The only thing I dont like is is captaincy in tests. It will great reality check for us once dhoni retries and we will struggle to find finishers like him. Enjoy while we can.

Kohli is statistically a better finisher already........when it comes to the second innings especially...... A lot of the angst towards Dhoni is largely to do with the petty politics he plays........

[gattaca]

Kohli is statistically a better finisher already........when it comes to the second innings especially...... A lot of the angst towards Dhoni is largely to do with the petty politics he plays........

Dhoni has finished lot of matches with tailenders at other end.Virat had proper batsman. finsihing with tailenders is tough.

[bulbul]

Dhoni has finished lot of matches with tailenders at other end.Virat had proper batsman. finsihing with tailenders is tough.

But Virat made sure that tailenedrs doesn't required by taking care of chase very early :giggle:

[jalebi_bhai]

Dhoni has finished lot of matches with tailenders at other end.Virat had proper batsman. finsihing with tailenders is tough.

Tell me what is easier....... Finishing a match from 30/1 against a fairly well-rested bowling attack with a new ball........or finishing a match from 210/4 against a tired bowling attack with a fairly new ball.......

[gattaca]

Tell me what is easier....... Finishing a match from 30/1 against a fairly well-rested bowling attack with a new ball........or finishing a match from 210/4 against a tired bowling attack with a fairly new ball.......

30/1 you will have time to build innings and pace innings. Dhoni comes after 5 th wicket so 210/5 . he will not have much time to settle down or pace innings like virat has. I would say 210/5 is difficult.The amount of runs to be scored will be more for virat but the rate at which you score is more for dhoni and that too with tailenders. Also in virats case he will be helped by proper batsman in dhoni case its survival and maintain scoring rates.

[jalebi_bhai]

30/1 you will have time to build innings and pace innings. Dhoni comes after 5 th wicket so 210/5 . he will not have much time to settle down or pace innings like virat has. I would say 210/5 is difficult.The amount of runs to be scored will be more for virat but the rate at which you score is more for dhoni and that too with tailenders.

:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical: Dhoni comes in at 5/6........no longer at 7........that is unless Dale Steyn or Johnson is bowling.......then Jaddu will come in at 5......Ashwin at 6......:haha: You also fail to consider the condition of the opposition.......when Kohli comes in to bat........they will have more energy.......bowlers and fielders.......which means they are likely to be more efficient.......why are you discounting this?

[jalebi_bhai]

Also consider fielding restrictions........on most occassions, Kohli comes in to bat during the first power play..........hence he needs to score more in boundaries.......Dhoni comes in when the field is spread........easier to score singles and get ticking..........this also counts right?

[Austin 3:!6]

Celebration thread - 24 posts Debate thread - 135 posts :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:

[vvvslaxman]

Yes, Dhoni isn't tactically sound. I believe I explained this in another post. In the modern game, all the teams are scoring about 0.5 runs per over more than they did in the 90s, and 1rpo more than they did in the 70s and 80s. If we compared with the 90s, the 0.5rpo translates to 450 X 0.5 = 225 runs for every game. That is an additional fifth innings! The possibility of draw is consequently dramatically reduced in the modern game. You have to win, or you have to lose. Draw as an option has been relegated to a corner. Ever saw an Aussie team getting hammered 4-0 in India before? Ever seen so many white washes as we have seen in the past four years? Not just India, even other teams are getting hammered when they play outside their comfort zones. But India looks worse on paper, we are continually touring nations where our prospects are the lowest. No other team has done two English tours, two Aussie tours, a SA tour in 3 years - without any easier tours in the middle of it. Our board does not seem to care for the psychological impact these defeats can have on the players. They need those easy tours once in a while to boost their confidence. When playing away, even if you are tactically a bit short, you get exposed big time now. In the past, you could bat out a draw because the players had the patience and the game for that. But because are scoring at 3.5rpo today and some times at 4rpo, playing out a draw isn't easy. The defeat margins are bigger because we score more runs these days.

There are only so many nations playing cricket. If we consider NZ,SA,England, AUstralia tours are toughest.. then we shouldn't be playing cricket. We will be left with trouble ridden Windies, Bangladesh, Srilanka and Pakistan. 3 subcontinent sides. If you want easy tours you will have to keep touring Windies and Bangladesh. Even Lungan tour is not easy. We haven't won a series there in a while.

[bulbul]

Celebration thread - 24 posts Debate thread - 135 posts :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:

Based on popularity its a fact that Dhoni greatness is debatable :cantstop:

[maniac]

Here is how i seriously classify Indian cricket greats Post 80'S Tier 1 Sachin,Sunny,Kapil Tier 1.5 Kumble,Dravid Tier 2 Laxman,Sehwag,Ganguly,Harbhajan Tier 3 Zaheer,Srinath,Vengasrkar,Azharuddin(if Matchfixing is not accounted for),Vishwanath Tier 3.5 Yuvraj,Dhoni Tier 4 Sir Aggy,Gambhir,Ravi Shastri,K.Srikkanth etc.