ICF WORLD XI ICF ALL TIME TEST WORLD XI : OPENERS

[BeautifulGame]

 

Its obviously very hard to compare players across generations and it becomes even more complex when we have to consider those played in 30s or 40s where most sports were in the Amateur Era.So as a general principle I have only considered cricketers who have at least played a test after 1960.So Bradman may or may not be the greatest cricketer ever but he wont be considered .Same with the likes of Jack Hoobs or Sydney Barnes .

 

 

And now moving on to the composition of the team, Ideally I would break up the  team into 5 Batsmen ,All Rounder ,Wicket Keeper ,3 fast bowlers and Spinner. So I will create separate threads for each one  and we can have discussions and vote.And then we can conclude the polls before Australia tests and see how would the All time test XI picked by ICFers will look.

 

So I will start with openers first.Have picked statistically the best 11 openers (min runs 5000) for the poll.Pick the 2 best openers you consider the best .

 

Cricinfo stats link

 

Discuss and Vote 

 

 

 

[sourab10forever]

Going for two recent players since I have watched them play.

Viru (It was between him and warner for me)

Cook (walks in given the number of runs he has scored.)

[BeautifulGame]

Personally I would pick Gavaskar and Smith .

Gavaskar an obvious pick for me but after him Smith was the best opener .Sehwag and Hayden may dominate attacks greatly neither were  all conditions opener like Smith.Also an incredible batsman in  second innings batsman as well.

[tweaker]

Mathew Hayden

From the openers I have watched.

Edited January 24, 2017 by tweaker

[BCCI]

Gavaskar & Veeru 

 

[sandeep]

6 minutes ago, BeautifulGame said:

Personally I would pick Gavaskar and Smith .

Gavaskar an obvious pick for me but after him Smith was the best opener .Sehwag and Hayden may dominate attacks greatly neither were  all conditions opener like Smith.Also an incredible batsman in  second innings batsman as well.

Gavaskar is a lock.  ATG opener without any asterisks, disclaimers, doubts.  

 

I hear you on Smith, but very tempted to go with my favorite test batsman of all time - yes, even more so than Tendy - the one and only Virender Sehwag.  Sure you can argue that Smith was a fighter, but you could also argue that quality left-arm pace would send him packing quickly.  

 

 

[Trichromatic]

5 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Gavaskar is a lock.  ATG opener without any asterisks, disclaimers, doubts.  

 

I hear you on Smith, but very tempted to go with my favorite test batsman of all time - yes, even more so than Tendy - the one and only Virender Sehwag.  Sure you can argue that Smith was a fighter, but you could also argue that quality left-arm pace would send him packing quickly.  

 

 

Any quality pacer will send Viru back quickly and most of the conditions offer that much help early on.

 

Smith has been a proven performer in all types of conditions.

 

He averages 41 in home conditions where he played most of his matches, outside he averages 55 which is way too high for a opener.

[BeautifulGame]

Gavaskar is a lock.  ATG opener without any asterisks, disclaimers, doubts.  

 

I hear you on Smith, but very tempted to go with my favorite test batsman of all time - yes, even more so than Tendy - the one and only Virender Sehwag.  Sure you can argue that Smith was a fighter, but you could also argue that quality left-arm pace would send him packing quickly.  

 

 

Yeah the thing is Smith averaged 40+ against left arm seamers .It may have been a weakness (he definitely struggled vs Zak) but overall the record was pretty decent .

What really made Smith special for me was his ability in the second innings and 4th innings in particular.Not just a fighter but an incredible batsman under pressure and particularly in 4th innings .

[kira]

Gavaskar and Sehwag (Although smith has a better case than sehwag but sehwag's strike rate is just too good to ignore, maybe sehwag in asia and smith everywhere else)

 

I used to think Hayden was better sehwag but recently found out that hayden flopped in 4 countries just like sehwag, with sehwag being the greatest of all time in ASIA and having a strike rate of 80+ in tests, he easily beats hayden for me.

[sandeep]

Fair enough with the logical arguments in favor of Smith - but watching Veeru bat in tests was pure magic.  Screw you logical lavdoos, I'm voting with my heart.  

[Trichromatic]

Overall figures
Player			   Span		Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	100	50	0
GC Smith (ICC/SA)	2003-2013	56	100	6	5253	277	55.88	17	19	5
SM Gavaskar (INDIA)	1971-1986	56	100	8	4869	221	52.92	18	20	5
HH Gibbs (SA)		1999-2007	32	55	2	2568	211*	48.45	5	13	4
G Boycott (ENG)		1964-1982	50	91	13	3735	142*	47.88	8	27	4
AN Cook (ENG)		2006-2016	65	123	8	5505	263	47.86	17	25	5
Saeed Anwar (PAK)	1994-2001	28	48	1	2188	188*	46.55	7	11	3
V Sehwag (INDIA)	2002-2012	50	85	3	3711	309	45.25	9	13	10
MS Atapattu (SL)	1997-2007	35	64	5	2667	249	45.20	8	10	7
JL Langer (AUS)		2001-2006	29	52	6	2066	166	44.91	5	10	3
G Kirsten (SA)		1993-2002	40	71	5	2922	220	44.27	9	13	7
CH Gayle (WI)		2000-2013	49	88	4	3705	333	44.10	8	17	8
MA Taylor (AUS)		1989-1998	49	86	5	3532	334*	43.60	8	18	4
ML Hayden (AUS)		1994-2008	47	86	6	3415	203	42.68	9	13	9
CG Greenidge (WI)	1974-1990	62	109	7	4339	223	42.53	11	19	7
AJ Strauss (ENG)	2004-2012	36	67	3	2718	169	42.46	10	8	8
AJ Stewart (ENG)	1990-1999	28	50	1	2026	148	41.34	5	10	3
RC Fredericks (WI)	1968-1976	30	56	2	2163	169	40.05	6	10	5
Md Hafeez(PAK)		2006-2016	41	78	6	2856	224	39.66	7	9	7
WM Lawry (AUS)		1961-1970	37	69	8	2416	210	39.60	5	12	3
GA Gooch (ENG)		1978-1995	39	74	3	2694	153	37.94	5	18	2
ST Jayasuriya (SL)	1996-2007	37	65	4	2303	253	37.75	5	9	6
Taufeeq Umar (PAK)	2002-2014	35	66	4	2269	236	36.59	5	10	6
ME Trescothick(ENG)	2000-2005	34	67	2	2352	193	36.18	5	10	8
MA Atherton (ENG)	1990-2001	47	85	3	2961	185*	36.10	7	15	11
MJ Slater (AUS)		1993-2001	41	74	4	2470	152	35.28	5	9	5
JG Wright (NZ)		1978-1992	36	66	1	2193	119	33.73	2	12	4
DL Haynes (WI)		1979-1993	67	118	10	3619	184	33.50	8	17	5

 

[ravishingravi]

Gavaskar and Greenidge. Rest are not even close. 

[Trichromatic]

11 minutes ago, kira said:

Gavaskar and Sehwag (Although smith has a better case than sehwag but sehwag's strike rate is just too good to ignore, maybe sehwag in asia and smith everywhere else)

 

I used to think Hayden was better sehwag but recently found out that hayden flopped in 4 countries just like sehwag, with sehwag being the greatest of all time in ASIA and having a strike rate of 80+ in tests, he easily beats hayden for me.

Most of the aussies batsmen (even of great team) were HTB in some sense. Hayden, Ponting, Langer all averaged in low 40s to mid 40s away and 55-60 at home.

 

However they had no common failure countries. For ex -  if some had poor record in Asia, then Martyn, Lehman, Hayden did well. Similary some struggled in SA then Ponting blasted saffers and so on. This was unlike Indian team in which except SRT everyone struggled in SA. 

[kira]

4 minutes ago, ravishingravi said:

Gavaskar and Greenidge. Rest are not even close. 

Greenidge with an average of 30 in australia and 17 in pakistan, didn't even play against his own bowlers,nah don't think so 

[kira]

2 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

Most of the aussies batsmen (even of great team) were HTB in some sense. Hayden, Ponting, Langer all averaged in low 40s to mid 40s away and 55-60 at home.

 

However they had no common failure countries. For ex -  if some had poor record in Asia, then Martyn, Lehman, Hayden did well. Similary some struggled in SA then Ponting blasted saffers and so on. This was unlike Indian team in which except SRT everyone struggled in SA. 

Yes, I have noticed that, Aussie players not put under the same scrutiny as asian players, if sachin had a record like ponting everyone would have labelled him a Home track bully 

[Trichromatic]

3 minutes ago, kira said:

Yes, I have noticed that, Aussie players not put under the same scrutiny as asian players, if sachin had a record like ponting everyone would have labelled him a Home track bully 

SRT and Ponting are outliers. Otherwise aussie batsmens are rated properly unlike their English counterparts.

 

Langer was a very good opener, but you won't see him being rated as an ATG player. If he was repesenting England then case would have been different.

[kira]

Just now, Trichromatic said:

SRT and Ponting are outliers. Otherwise aussie batsmens are rated properly unlike their English counterparts.

England has rarely produced any ATG players in recent years, apart from the english media nobody overrates them, Ponting was an ATG no doubt but if you swap the records of ponting and sachin then sachin wouldn't have been mentioned in the same sentence as ponting like ponting is currently rated alongside lara and sachin.

[BeautifulGame]

25 minutes ago, kira said:

England has rarely produced any ATG players in recent years, apart from the english media nobody overrates them, Ponting was an ATG no doubt but if you swap the records of ponting and sachin then sachin wouldn't have been mentioned in the same sentence as ponting like ponting is currently rated alongside lara and sachin.

The thing not even Aussies rate Ponting alongside Sachin and Lara.Infact he is rarely even picked in their all time XIs with Creg Chappell and Border preferred to him.

Edited January 24, 2017 by BeautifulGame

[Sidhoni]

Gavaskar and Smith for me.

 

Interesting stat : Smith averages above 50 when his team lost the toss and were sent in to bat.

Edit : Here is the list. Hayden and Langer have insane stats.

[Sidhoni]

Poll is not public