Virat Kohli is the solution to our vacant #4 spot

[Shunya]

All of our maharathis knows top 3 is the best position to bat...nobody is going to leave it out for Rahul or anyone else...

Middle order/lower order batting is not their cup of tea... Just like how it was when Sachin played...these players will not be as good at 4 or lower down once they have played in top 3...

 

[philcric]

52 minutes ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

I think the rationale behind that is Rahul is an opener and is comfortable facing new ball. Now since Rohit-Dhawan is doing a good job at top, the best position to extract most from Rahul is no 3. Kohli is a middle order batsman anyway and with his experience he will find it much easier to bat at 4. His ability to find gaps and keep the score board ticking with singles/doubles will work brilliantly at middle ordrer. Pushing an opener (Rahul) to no 4 will only increase his problems, like Rohit was never a successful no.4 batsman. Also, in challenging conditions, if a wicket falls early (say 0/1), Rahul will better adapted to deal with the new ball being an opener than Kohli.

 

Dhawan

Rohit

Rahul

Kohli

Dhoni

Iyer/Karthik/Raina

Pandya

 

Thats a brilliant batting line up and I would play it for world cup. After the world cup ofcourse everything changes. I expect likes of Dhoni/Rohit etc to retire and players like Gill to be ready who can take the mattle of no 4. Rahul opens the batting and kohli moves back to no 3.

 

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Batting with Dhoni might also help Kohli to get rid of his annoying habit of sometimes going for non existent singles. His judgement of 2's is terrific but that of singles is dodgy, some of them wouldn't even be half runs. Some of the younger/inexperienced batting partners sometimes respond to Kohli's dodgy calls for a single. Dhoni wouldn't.

[Ankit_sharma03]

3 hours ago, philcric said:

 

That's a very simplistic way to look at it.

 

Sometimes the best batsman scoring most runs consistently doesn't necessarily translate to the team's best cause, because of the strengths/weaknesses of the rest of the batsmen.

 

Not saying Kohli at #4 is for sure the best solution, but it's definitely worth a consideration. Ours is a top heavy batting with a fragile middle order. A better distribution of batsmen in terms of ability/experience/style might help. 

 

 

 

 

we did try that in Ind-Sa 2015 series n CB series 2014, both times it didnt work. Virat didnt score much

N the minute virat got his 3 positon he scored 100 both time 

[philcric]

56 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

we did try that in Ind-Sa 2015 series n CB series 2014, both times it didnt work. Virat didnt score much

N the minute virat got his 3 positon he scored 100 both time 

 

His stats at #3 and #4 are very similar, obviously he played many more innings at #3.

 

Personally I feel the batting lineup is better balanced with Virat at #4 and also Virat has the most suitable game for that spot compared to Rahul, Rohit, Pandey, Raina or anyone else who is supposed to bat there.

[Lannister]

7 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

The idea shud be get max out of kohli coz he is ur best n most consistent batsman n he likes that position

 

Rahul has an extra gear then kohli so he can bat down

Kohli is ur best batsman ull give him more balls or lesser batsman 

 

Whats the point when he doesnt feel happy himself, we have done the same to tendulkar to annoy him n not get the full out of him

 

So fix no.4 by giving rahul a long run , dnt change 2 positions

 

 

In-form Rahul and Rohit will get you the same runs and at a much better strike rate. What you are saying is true for T20s but in ODIs #4 spot is still very important and someone who could strike at 100 works well in that position.

 

#1 and #2 - Required SR - 100+

#3 and #4 - Required SR - (90-100)

#5, #6 and #7 - Required SR - 100+

 

With the addition of Pandya, now you can play 3 powerhitters in the lower order. 

[sandeep]

12 hours ago, SecondSlip said:

I think that Virat Kohli will be the best man to bat at #4 for Team India. 

 

We have been struggling to find a permanent #4 batsman for a really long time. We have tried countless options but none of them has clicked. 

 

I believe that Virat Kohli should take responsibility and bat at that vacant #4 spot. There are a few advantages for this as well.

 

The first advantage is that by shifting Kohli to #4, it will allow Team India to fit KL Rahul into the team in a perfect manner. Rahul is a fantastic prospect and should be able to lock down the #3 spot as his own. 

 

The second advantage is that it lengthens our batting line up by having Kohli at #4. In the past few years, all our batting strength was relied heavily on our top 3. It was either boom or bust for Team India depending on how they fared. 

 

But by having Kohli at #4, our misfiring middle order has a massive cushion now. Kohli can dominate the opposition teams while batting in the middle order and strengthening it by a long way. 

 

The third advantage is that we will get to see so many match winning partnerships between Kohli and Dhoni when they bat side-by-side. Kohli at 4 & Dhoni at 5 can win so many matches for Team India with their batting. 

 

This will allow Dhoni to play much more positively and freely which he couldn’t do before since our middle order was misfiring. But batting with Virat Kohli at the other end will help unleash MSD of old! 

 

Having Kohli batting at #4 is a win-win for everybody. Rahul gets a permanent spot in the team, our middle order gets strengthened and Dhoni gets to bat much more positively as well. 

 

A top 5 of Rohit, Dhawan, Rahul, Kohli and Dhoni is a potential World Cup winning combination! 

I've been advocating this for a year now - adding a 3rd "opener" at the top and moving VK to #4.  Its a good fit for the team, but it will reduce the century opportunities for kuptaan wrogn, and I don't think he's going to be too keen to do that.  

Edited July 2, 2018 by sandeep

[Ankit_sharma03]

7 hours ago, philcric said:

 

His stats at #3 and #4 are very similar, obviously he played many more innings at #3.

 

Personally I feel the batting lineup is better balanced with Virat at #4 and also Virat has the most suitable game for that spot compared to Rahul, Rohit, Pandey, Raina or anyone else who is supposed to bat there.

those were early days when he was trying to find a place

Now he is comfertable at that role , n when he himself says he likes to bat at 3 rather 4 means he feels and diff and we shud respect it since he is the best player of our team

3 hours ago, sandeep said:

I've been advocating this for a year now - adding a 3rd "opener" at the top and moving VK to #4.  Its a good fit for the team, but it will reduce the century opportunities for kuptaan wrogn, and I don't think he's going to be too keen to do that.  

its not about centuries, he understands his game that he doesnt have that extra gear which an ABDV has at 4 ....so with his batting he can control the game better at 3. 

[Ankit_sharma03]

4 hours ago, Lannister said:

In-form Rahul and Rohit will get you the same runs and at a much better strike rate. What you are saying is true for T20s but in ODIs #4 spot is still very important and someone who could strike at 100 works well in that position.

 

#1 and #2 - Required SR - 100+

#3 and #4 - Required SR - (90-100)

#5, #6 and #7 - Required SR - 100+

 

With the addition of Pandya, now you can play 3 powerhitters in the lower order. 

But rahul is kind of struggling it to make those score big and rohit when gets sets makes it big

Surely rahul starts faster, but rohit ends faster

[adi B]

Kohli bats at 3 and no one should alter his position ,simple!

Raul has to adjust batting at 4 and I reckon he will ,in a year or 2 rohit will decline and most likely be kicked out ,that's where Raul will get the openers slot 

[Lannister]

1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

But rahul is kind of struggling it to make those score big and rohit when gets sets makes it big

Surely rahul starts faster, but rohit ends faster

If he's struggling then why do you want him to play at #4, which is not even his batting position. Kohli will have no such problems adjusting to #4 slot.  

Besides we have a weak middle order consisting of garbage Dhoni. You need someone strong to rally around and hold them together from further collapse. 

[Temujin Khaghan]

No. The best odi batsmen in the team have to occupy the 1-3 spots, unless he is technically deficient like msd.

 

I don't want a situation where kohli comes in at 150/2 in 28.0 on a flat deck.

 

Also kohli is great chaser who plays risk free and daring cricket. But he is no master blaster like abdv who can score 80 runs in the last 30 balls he faces in the death.

 

So ideally kohli's bracket of crease occupancy is b/w 5-40 overs. He should be at no.3 or maybe even open the innings if he wants to.

[Temujin Khaghan]

If you want KLR so badly make him open and demote lord Rohit Sharma to no5.

 

Ideally shikhar, KLR, Virat, Rohit, pant, MSD, Hardik, 4 bowlers.

But situation is out of our hands. Pant won't be allowed in even as a specialist batsman until MSD retires.

[Ankit_sharma03]

30 minutes ago, Lannister said:

If he's struggling then why do you want him to play at #4, which is not even his batting position. Kohli will have no such problems adjusting to #4 slot.  

My point was regd rahul converting his scores to big ones not struggling at a position

 

Who is struggling? when did he get a proper chance at 4

hehas a 100 in t20 at 4, how many has that

 

Rahul has only played 1 innings at no.4 n u call that struggling 

 

Kohli  mentally himself doesnt like to bat 4 , ofcourse he ll have a problem. Why wud u want ur best batsman to not be happy. We did that to tendulkar n he was unhappy n it showed. Dnt make ur biggest match winner unhappy ever. 

Quote

Besides we have a weak middle order consisting of garbage Dhoni. You need someone strong to rally around and hold them together from further collapse. 

he can do that at 3, no need to change 2 positions 

 

 

Edited July 2, 2018 by Ankit_sharma03

[Ankit_sharma03]

Such theories shud be thought of when ur best option fails

Our best option is rahul at 4, had he been even given a chance- No , hell no

 

Only given one game at 4, let him fail 1st then think about this 

U dnt fix what aint broken, so dnt even touch no.3 and again u do not make ur best player unhappy 

 

Here is imran khan county captain telling the same thing when his players asked why is he pampered so much - So he says " well so he shud be coz he ll win us most games"

 

 

 

Kohli is our biggest match winner, let him bat whereever he wants to, coz he will win us maximum games

 

[Lannister]

5 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

My point was regd rahul converting his scores to big ones not struggling at a position

 

Who is struggling? when did he get a proper chance at 4

hehas a 100 in t20 at 4, how many has that

 

Rahul has only played 1 innings at no.4 n u call that struggling 

 

Kohli  mentally himself doesnt like to bat 4 , ofcourse he ll have a problem. Why wud u want ur best batsman to not be happy. We did that to tendulkar n he was unhappy n it showed. Dnt make ur biggest match winner unhappy ever. 

he can do that at 3, no need to change 2 positions 

 

 

Like I said it's not just about Kohli. If he wants the team to do well under his captaincy, then he should be ready to bat at any position and think from the team's perspective. It's a bit unfair on Rahul to ask him to play in the middle order while he opens in the Test format. Both are difficult positions to adjust. 

 

[sandeep]

8 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

its not about centuries, he understands his game that he doesnt have that extra gear which an ABDV has at 4 ....so with his batting he can control the game better at 3. 

Limited overs cricket batting order should be based more on which over the wicket falls in, rather than a static batting order.  I understand your point, and Virat's strength is controlling the game in the middle overs.  He's the guy we want to be batting a big chunk of overs in the middle.  The reason for pushing him down to #4 is to be able to continue attacking with the bat as a team in the 1st 10-12 overs, even if we lose that first wicket.  We don't want to risk Virat's wicket in the pursuit of extra 20 runs up front, but we can certainly risk a Dhawan/Rohit/ Rishabh/ etc.  And if we don't lose an early wicket and the 1st one falls after the 12th over, Virat should automatically 'promote' himself back to #3.  

[sandeep]

6 hours ago, Temujin Khaghan said:

No. The best odi batsmen in the team have to occupy the 1-3 spots, unless he is technically deficient like msd.

 

I don't want a situation where kohli comes in at 150/2 in 28.0 on a flat deck.

 

Also kohli is great chaser who plays risk free and daring cricket. But he is no master blaster like abdv who can score 80 runs in the last 30 balls he faces in the death.

 

So ideally kohli's bracket of crease occupancy is b/w 5-40 overs. He should be at no.3 or maybe even open the innings if he wants to.

See my post above - We actually don't want Virat to open or come in the 5th over - when the situation calls for the batsman to play with a bit of risk to maximize scoring with the power-play.  We want him to control the innings in the middle overs.  A

 

And if the first wicket falls after the 12th over, he should revert back to #3. 

[philcric]

8 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

those were early days when he was trying to find a place

Now he is comfertable at that role , n when he himself says he likes to bat at 3 rather 4 means he feels and diff and we shud respect it since he is the best player of our team

 

 

Not talking about Kohli's preference. Sure he'd want to bat at #3.

 

Just that India's MO atm isn't solid and Kohli at #4 IMO will most likely provide that solidity and balance. He has the game for that spot.

 

As an Indian fan, I'll be more comfortable with Rohit, Dhawan, Rahul, Virat, Dhoni as top 5 compared to Rohit, Dhawan, Virat, Rahul, Dhoni, esp. in pressure games while chasing.

[Ankit_sharma03]

3 minutes ago, philcric said:

 

Not talking about Kohli's preference. Sure he'd want to bat at #3.

 

Just that India's MO atm isn't solid and Kohli at #4 IMO will most likely provide that solidity and balance. He has the game for that spot.

 

As an Indian fan, I'll be more comfortable with Rohit, Dhawan, Rahul, Virat, Dhoni as top 5 compared to Rohit, Dhawan, Virat, Rahul, Dhoni, esp. in pressure games while chasing.

IMO, rahul can easily bat at 4, just give him time n confidence n if he fails then think about this option

Rahul has that extra gear which kohli doesnt specially he is destructive towards spinners so he is better option at 4 acc to me

[philcric]

46 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

IMO, rahul can easily bat at 4, just give him time n confidence n if he fails then think about this option

Rahul has that extra gear which kohli doesnt specially he is destructive towards spinners so he is better option at 4 acc to me

 

Yeah, it would be great if Rahul can nail the #4 spot.