sandeep Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 (edited) How many of you folks here would "support Modi ji" by putting your own kids in a regional language school? This is a terrible idea that has been legitimized by 'heritage' activists run amok. This administration and its dadhi waala baba simply can't resist the temptation to score own goals. Edited July 30, 2020 by sandeep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 I studied in a Kannada medium school till 7th. Highschool - 8th was in English medium. But, this is a problem for drifters and movers. I think thie NEP is only fot Govt schools and not private, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandeep Posted July 30, 2020 Author Share Posted July 30, 2020 29 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: I studied in a Kannada medium school till 7th. Highschool - 8th was in English medium. But, this is a problem for drifters and movers. I think thie NEP is only fot Govt schools and not private, I suppose. This is not to denigrate or put down those who learnt in regional languages. But if you had to do it all over again, would you choose that? Would you choose it for your kids? The answers are obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 8 minutes ago, sandeep said: This is not to denigrate or put down those who learnt in regional languages. But if you had to do it all over again, would you choose that? Would you choose it for your kids? The answers are obvious. Not in my case, and for people like me who are not settled. But for local people, yes, I would recommend that. Literacy is not education. We need to get basic education in our language that we identify with. That is why Japanese, Koreans and even Chinese are doing much better than us. British colonised our minds and all future generations. We are stuck with English. I wish more Indians populate UK and shove it in their faces. I think in my MT, I even do math in my MT. I translate each time. raki05 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BacktoCricaddict Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 (edited) 18 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: Not in my case, and for people like me who are not settled. But for local people, yes, I would recommend that. Literacy is not education. We need to get basic education in our language that we identify with. That is why Japanese, Koreans and even Chinese are doing much better than us. British colonised our minds and all future generations. We are stuck with English. I wish more Indians populate UK and shove it in their faces. I think in my MT, I even do math in my MT. I translate each time. If it had to work for me, I would have had to move to Palakkad where I would've been taught in my MT (Palakkad Tamizh). What would the children of Matunga Mamis do in Mumbai? In Bengaluru back then, all Jayanagar, Malleshwaram schools would have been Kannada medium, Ulsoor schools would've been street Tamizh medium and Gandhinagar schools would've been Marwari/Rajasthani medium China, Japan etc have language homogeneity which we don't. Unless we send people back to the states where their MT is the regional language, it won't work. Might as well do English. The other option is to give each kid a translator headphone like they do at the UN :-). Edited July 30, 2020 by BacktoCricaddict sandeep 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarke Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 16 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: Not in my case, and for people like me who are not settled. But for local people, yes, I would recommend that. Literacy is not education. We need to get basic education in our language that we identify with. That is why Japanese, Koreans and even Chinese are doing much better than us. British colonised our minds and all future generations. We are stuck with English. I wish more Indians populate UK and shove it in their faces. I think in my MT, I even do math in my MT. I translate each time. What aspect r u referring to that is powered by local language Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Clarke said: What aspect r u referring to that is powered by local language From Science and Technology, Medical research and SM, they use their local language. India is slave to English, can't do zilch in Indian languages other than Maa-Ben. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_Youyou First Chinese Nobel Laurette , schooled and researched in China. Can we boast of one non-western educated Nobel prize winner who studied in India and researched in India (even in English medium). There is no harm in admitting that our Education Policy sucked. Edited July 30, 2020 by coffee_rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 (edited) I think we can all calm our tits. It says "Wherever possible"! Quote Also, there will be no hard separation among ‘curricular’, ‘extracurricular’, or ‘co-curricular’, among ‘arts’, ‘humanities’, and ‘sciences’, or between ‘vocational’ or ‘academic’ streams. Wherever possible, the medium of instruction until at least Grade 5, but preferably till Grade 8 and beyond, will be the mother tongue or local language, says the new policy which replaces the earlier policy adopted in 1986 and modified in 1992. The NEP also says that textbooks will include knowledge from ancient India to modern India as well as future aspirations and Indian Knowledge Systems, including tribal knowledge and indigenous and traditional ways of learning, will be covered. Also, all students will take school examinations in grades 3, 5, and 8 also, which will test the achievement of basic learning outcomes and application of knowledge in real-life situations. Board exams for grades 10 and 12, on the other hand, will be made “easier”, as they will test primarily core capacities or competencies rather than months of coaching or memorization. In the higher education sector, UGC, AICTE and the National Council for Teacher’s Education will be merged into a single higher education commission. Coding by Class VI. Edited July 30, 2020 by coffee_rules raki05 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandeep Posted July 30, 2020 Author Share Posted July 30, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, coffee_rules said: Literacy is not education. We need to get basic education in our language that we identify with. That is why Japanese, Koreans and even Chinese are doing much better than us. British colonised our minds and all future generations. This is such utter tripe, disappointed to hear it from someone like you. Silly comparisons with Japan/Korea/China don't hold water, because they are very different countries with their own set of geographic, political and economic circumstances. Japan and Korea were willing to host American army bases in exchange for market access and economic aid - that's the primary reason why they were able to industrialize and become export driven economies, not some infantile obsession with native language education. The Chinese were offered a similar deal without military access, because the US wanted to break the Sino-Soviet Communist bloc. India could and would have been able to do something similar, but Nehru and his successors had their heads, brains and other body parts stuck in the clouds of 'non-alignment'. Of course Literacy is not education, but the fact of the matter is that in India, acquiring an English education is far more accessible, and cheaper, than in JP/Kr/Cn. And for anybody who wishes to study beyond 10th grade, are far more likely to find their success in education and beyond, if they already have acquired proficiency in English at a young age. In fact, this obsession and hostility towards English, is more of a symptom of a "colonized" mind, willing to cut off the branch that he's sitting on, in the name of inane "indigenousness", rather than being practical and ruthlessly trying to empower, educate and economically liberate our nation's citizens. For whatever historical reason, English is a 'mainstream' language in India. There is no need to 'fight' it. Of course, I am a strong believer in protecting our 'home' languages and allocating resources so that they flourish into the future. To the extent that even in the US, I am making sure that my 5 year old is able to read and write in Gujarati. But I wouldn't want any of my family members in India, any of their kids, to begin their education in "regional" language. Would you? Edited July 30, 2020 by sandeep Norman and raki05 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandeep Posted July 30, 2020 Author Share Posted July 30, 2020 1 hour ago, coffee_rules said: Not in my case, and for people like me who are not settled. But for local people, yes, I would recommend that. "native" education for thee, but not for me. Q1. Do you have any relatives living in your home state? Q2. Would you advocate them sending their children for education in "regional" language since they are "local people"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarke Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 (edited) 45 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: From Science and Technology, Medical research and SM, they use their local language. India is slave to English, can't do zilch in Indian languages other than Maa-Ben. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_Youyou First Chinese Nobel Laurette , schooled and researched in China. Can we boast of one non-western educated Nobel prize winner who studied in India and researched in India (even in English medium). There is no harm in admitting that our Education Policy sucked. The tech & other progress doesn't have anything to do with language. There's plenty of local language schools already in India. Adding to them in some way won't make us any superior technologically. A nobel laureate, at least a meritorious one, will be one in a million type of individual and won't be held back by language of instruction. Edited July 30, 2020 by Clarke sandeep 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandeep Posted July 30, 2020 Author Share Posted July 30, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Clarke said: The tech & other progress doesn't have anything to do with language. There's plenty of local language schools already in India. Adding to them in some way won't make us any superior technologically. You are mistaken. The idea to solve, innovate and bring new ideas will come more easily, if you have learnt stuff in your MT. You can't go to Russia, learn Russian and get a Nobel prize for Literature in Russian. The same with attaining education. There is no innovation in India, all we do is rote, get 99.9% marks and become code-monkeys. Quote A nobel laureate, at least a meritorious one, will be one in a million type of individual and won't be held back by language of instruction. That is to how the epitome of excellence. Not all will get Nobel prizes, but at least we can prepare employable workforce which is smarter. These are some western sources which recommend early instruction in mother tongue. The babies in wombs listen to moms in MT. They do have some memory imprint of that. It is the same science where babies are made to listen to Mozart to make them future Einsteins. If ee believe that can be done, there is some little truth in this research as well. https://www.globalpartnership.org/blog/children-learn-better-their-mother-tongue Edited July 30, 2020 by coffee_rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 1 hour ago, sandeep said: "native" education for thee, but not for me. Q1. Do you have any relatives living in your home state? Don't make the debate personal. Let's look at facts. Yes, but education is so commercial, everybody is in the same bandwagon. Now there are schools (private) where they are autonomous and they dont have exams till 10th. I have some relatives who have sent their kids to such schools. 1 hour ago, sandeep said: Q2. Would you advocate them sending their children for education in "regional" language since they are "local people"? Yes, I would , as I explained. But, no parent is bold enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarke Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 28 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: You are mistaken. The idea to solve, innovate and bring new ideas will come more easily, if you have learnt stuff in your MT. You can't go to Russia, learn Russian and get a Nobel prize for Literature in Russian. The same with attaining education. There is no innovation in India, all we do is rote, get 99.9% marks and become code-monkeys. That is to how the epitome of excellence. Not all will get Nobel prizes, but at least we can prepare employable workforce which is smarter. These are some western sources which recommend early instruction in mother tongue. The babies in wombs listen to moms in MT. They do have some memory imprint of that. It is the same science where babies are made to listen to Mozart to make them future Einsteins. If ee believe that can be done, there is some little truth in this research as well. https://www.globalpartnership.org/blog/children-learn-better-their-mother-tongue English isn't Russian, and you're again skipping the point that we already have a lot of schooling in Indian languages. I doubt there is any finding in India that schooling in Hindi, Tamil, Telugu, Marathi etc has produced innovators beyond English schools. Even if hypothetically there was one, don't we have the space for all to exist ? What you've done is picked the strengths of East Asia which were actually achieved by working their fingers to the bone, highlighted our systemic deficiencies such as rote learning and blamed it on English education with local language being the savior. That sounds like manipulation rather than causality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandeep Posted July 30, 2020 Author Share Posted July 30, 2020 45 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: Don't make the debate personal. This isn't making it "personal", do not get defensive. 46 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: Yes, but education is so commercial, everybody is in the same bandwagon. Now there are schools (private) where they are autonomous and they dont have exams till 10th. I have some relatives who have sent their kids to such schools. That is a very different issue than the question of changing the medium of instruction away from English. 46 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: Yes, I would , as I explained. But, no parent is bold enough. yeah, I'm sorry, I do not buy that claim, hypothetical or otherwise. coffee_rules 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 31 minutes ago, sandeep said: This isn't making it "personal", do not get defensive. That is a very different issue than the question of changing the medium of instruction away from English. yeah, I'm sorry, I do not buy that claim, hypothetical or otherwise. Np, fair enough. these schools that I told about , the medium of instruction is not English sandeep 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 He is a CS professor in OKU and has written many books on consciousness. A KP as well. And a Padma Shri as well Is English essential from pre-school as it is sold in India now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zen Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 I have studied in English schools including one of the best boarding schools. But regret not learning Sanskrit, which was offered as an option in my school Unless you are from one of the metros, people in other places prefer to interact in local languages from what I have observed. The spoken English in India is also not spot on in general. It is referred to as Hinglish. coffee_rules 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
someone Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 I think its a good move. It provides a level-playing field, particular those poor families whose children can get intimidated by English at a very early age, and give up their studies. And long term, India needs to learn its own native vocabs and use its own terms to lead the world. coffee_rules 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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