Jaddu as ODI all rounder

[Lord]

Just now, vvvslaxman said:

 

On Indian pitches he knows how to produce economical spell. But that is not what we want. We need wickets from him as well. Also strike well with bat.  No excuse to fail on Indian pitches as these guys know every ground.

If he's economical, it'll automatically produce wickets. He's 5th bowler so expectation has to be based on that.

 

More expectations in batting though not suited to the spot but improving lately.

[vvvslaxman]

3 minutes ago, Lord said:

 

and because there are no undeniably better options. Both not his fault.

 

These kind of TINA based selections happen because we don't select players based on roles. Even if there is some potential they should be given an opportunity and see how they go. Sindhu, Parag, Abhishek sharma and see if they take their game to next level. I still don't rule out Sundar. He still has a lot of room for improvement.  We should also see how Tilak goes.  Yusuf pathan kind of players would be ideal. 

[vvvslaxman]

6 minutes ago, Lord said:

If he's economical, it'll automatically produce wickets. He's 5th bowler so expectation has to be based on that.

 

More expectations in batting though not suited to the spot but improving lately.

 

None of our spin bowling all rounders are capable of smashing pace bowlers consistently at will.Occasionlly they smash length balls. Deepak Chahar looks a better striker than these guys. 

[Lord]

3 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

These kind of TINA based selections happen because we don't select players based on roles. Even if there is some potential they should be given an opportunity and see how they go. Sindhu, Parag, Abhishek sharma and see if they take their game to next level. I still don't rule out Sundar. He still has a lot of room for improvement.  We should also see how Tilak goes.  Yusuf pathan kind of players would be ideal. 

Yes they will be given chances after WC. Tilak and Jaiswal will bowl more too.

 

Even Venky should be given more chances to have an alternative to Pandu.

[Norman]

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

 

India has to pick batsmen who can bowl rather than other way around.

 

Yes I definitely agree. I have been advocating for that a lot recently. We cannot afford to have Pandya and Jadeja in the top 7 with our pathetic tail. 

 

DeepaK Hooda is probably the only guy we tried who fits that criteria in the recent times and he was a colossal failure. Tilak and Jaiswal are our only options as of now unless Sundar works more on his batting. 

[vvvslaxman]

4 minutes ago, Lord said:

Yes they will be given chances after WC. Tilak and Jaiswal will bowl more too.

 

Even Venky should be given more chances to have an alternative to Pandu.

 

Definitely. Venky bowls 5 overs on an average in List A. Pandya often times doesn't bowl at all. Pandya came into side for his six hitting prowess 76 innings 74 sixes in List A. 

Venkatesh Iyer 34 innings 43 sixes. yes not like for like.  Pandya  has a bit more pace with bowling. problem is we don't know when he will bowl. when he won't. 

[Norman]

80% of the problems in the Indian team will be solved if we produce bowlers (especially fast bowlers) who can hold the bat and also occasionally give it a tonk when needed. Ala Cummins, Starc, Shaheen, Southee, Wood, Rabada etc etc... 

 

The only reason we play the likes of Jadeja or Axar is to "provide the right balance" which is just the other way of saying "our bowlers are crap with the bat so we need to eek out as much batting as possible by playing bowling all rounders in the top 7". 

 

 

Also stops us from having agressive impact players at 6 and 7 because they want solidity there as our batting ends pretty much at 7...amazing how the overpaid "coaches" and "analysts" still don't realise this simple thing.

[vvvslaxman]

2 minutes ago, Norman said:

80% of the problems in the Indian team will be solved if we produce bowlers (especially fast bowlers) who can hold the bat and also occasionally give it a tonk when needed. Ala Cummins, Starc, Shaheen, Southee, Wood, Rabada etc etc... 

 

The only reason we play the likes of Jadeja or Axar is to "provide the right balance" which is just the other way of saying "our bowlers are crap with the bat so we need to eek out as much batting as possible by playing bowling all rounders in the top 7". 

 

 

Also stops us from having agressive impact players at 6 and 7 because they want solidity there as our batting ends pretty much at 7...amazing how the overpaid "coaches" and "analysts" still don't realise this simple thing.

 

Batting at 8 CoulterNile made 92 in 60 balls in wolrd cup 2019 when they were in deep trouble. Among this lot Chahar and Thakur are the only one that fit the bill. These malnourished finger spinning all rounders are going to do jack sh**.

[Lord]

8 minutes ago, Norman said:

80% of the problems in the Indian team will be solved if we produce bowlers (especially fast bowlers) who can hold the bat and also occasionally give it a tonk when needed. Ala Cummins, Starc, Shaheen, Southee, Wood, Rabada etc etc... 

 

The only reason we play the likes of Jadeja or Axar is to "provide the right balance" which is just the other way of saying "our bowlers are crap with the bat so we need to eek out as much batting as possible by playing bowling all rounders in the top 7". 

 

 

Also stops us from having agressive impact players at 6 and 7 because they want solidity there as our batting ends pretty much at 7...amazing how the overpaid "coaches" and "analysts" still don't realise this simple thing.

 

Similarly our batsman dont bowl at all. Earlier Sachin,Sehwag,Dada used to make up for 5th bowler by themselves. Even now other teams have likes of Markram,Root,Livi etc.

 

Balance is needed and we have to play bits and pieces for that.

[Lord]

8 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

Batting at 8 CoulterNile made 92 in 60 balls in wolrd cup 2019 when they were in deep trouble. Among this lot Chahar and Thakur are the only one that fit the bill. These malnourished finger spinning all rounders are going to do jack sh**.

 

Thakur's bowling is too crap to compensate and Chahar is forever in hospital.

[vvvslaxman]

2 minutes ago, Lord said:

 

Similarly our batsman dont bowl at all. Earlier Sachin,Sehwag,Dada used to make up for 5th bowler by themselves. Even now other teams have likes of Markram,Root,Livi etc.

 

Balance is needed and we have to play bits and pieces for that.

 

MSD converted Jadhav into a bowler out of thin air.  Rohit after all these years is telling  "We had to exclude Chahal becanse we wanted a batsman at no.8" lol  

[Lord]

19 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

Definitely. Venky bowls 5 overs on an average in List A. Pandya often times doesn't bowl at all. Pandya came into side for his six hitting prowess 76 innings 74 sixes in List A. 

Venkatesh Iyer 34 innings 43 sixes. yes not like for like.  Pandya  has a bit more pace with bowling. problem is we don't know when he will bowl. when he won't. 

 

Venky might not have pace but is tall. Definitely worth a shot as batting AR.

[vvvslaxman]

2 minutes ago, Lord said:

 

Thakur's bowling is too crap to compensate and Chahar is forever in hospital.

 

He can be used in Middle overs. Should never bowl in death. At the end of the day they will go for him because he has an excellent strike rate in middle overs.  25. Often the two wicket over.

 

His ER in power play 6.16

           in middle overs 5.62

          in death overs 8.84

[Lord]

10 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

He can be used in Middle overs. Should never bowl in death. At the end of the day they will go for him because he has an excellent strike rate in middle overs.  25. Often the two wicket over.

 

His ER in power play 6.16

           in middle overs 5.62

          in death overs 8.84

nah no. 8 should be a 10 over bowler first. I'd rather trust Shami to tonk some at 8 given he'll bowl much better and we'd be chasing smaller scores anyway.

[Majestic]

1 hour ago, Lord said:

only in ODIs. Already has opposing legacy in Tests and T20s

He has great legacy in Tests. If he can have a good one in ODIs, T20s won't hold much importance.

[Majestic]

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

 Given that he has played through 3 decades in multi formats and leagues one more average performance will leave him with no legacy to speak of in this format. He is in the side mainly because of one-dimensional nature of our side more than anything else.

World Cup will remain key especially the ODI World Cup and he enjoyed benefits of playing IPL for CSK which includes performances this year in winning cause. So, if he can come up good this WC, he will end with a fairly memorable ODI career. If he doesn't come good, it will be outright mediocre ending to his career in ODIs.

[singhvivek141]

2 hours ago, Majestic said:

 

This IPL he found success with bowl and delivered in final with bat. This World Cup can be defining moment for his LOI career.

Courtesy of Chepauk pitches, where he is able to get rip off the pitch.

He is very much a pitch dependent bowler, non threatening elsewhere. Doesn't have any other trick in his bowling arsenal.

[singhvivek141]

1 hour ago, Norman said:

80% of the problems in the Indian team will be solved if we produce bowlers (especially fast bowlers) who can hold the bat and also occasionally give it a tonk when needed. Ala Cummins, Starc, Shaheen, Southee, Wood, Rabada etc etc... 

 

The only reason we play the likes of Jadeja or Axar is to "provide the right balance" which is just the other way of saying "our bowlers are crap with the bat so we need to eek out as much batting as possible by playing bowling all rounders in the top 7". 

 

We will only get bowling allrounders if BCCI go serious and tell the state teams to promote them up the ladder.

Harshit, Hangargekar, Yudhvir, Gurnoor are your bowlers who can use long handle at 8/9...plus are proper bowlers.

 

Raj Bawa is a proper allrounder who is balanced at both disciplines.

 

Abhishek Sharma, Riyan Parag, Abdul Samad, Venkatesh Iyer are your batters who can roll their arm if needed. Tilak and Jaiswal can bowl so they should practice atleast 3-4 overs in nets like Sachin, Viru, Ganguly, Yuvi, Raina etc

 

 

[Serpico]

Thakur is expensive but his strike rate is 28 with 1.8 wpm. For comparison, Bhuvi's SR is 41 and he was our front line bowler for so many years. Being economical means doesn't mean much in modern games when even a number 8 can have 2-3 big overs on his day.

 

We need wicket taking options in middle overs to apply any kind of pressure at death. Even bumrah will go for plenty if there's a set top order batsman at crease in 43rd over 

[Nikhil_cric]

5 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

He can be used in Middle overs. Should never bowl in death. At the end of the day they will go for him because he has an excellent strike rate in middle overs.  25. Often the two wicket over.

 

His ER in power play 6.16

           in middle overs 5.62

          in death overs 8.84

Yep. Nailed it. He actually takes wickets in the middle and is not just economical. But that's where his utility ends.