Ram Mandir and politics

[cowboysfan]

20 minutes ago, BlueBlood said:

 

Lol it's always 2030, 2040, 2050.

 

When reality is, India won't commit to any penalties for not reaching targets in Kyto or Paris Accord. Same as China claiming we are a poor nation that still needs coal plants for cheap power.

 

Look at pollution index. Worst in the world. If progress was being made, it wouldn't be the worst. Beijing used to be most polluted and now they aren't even in top 5. Not saying China is any better on this front but at least they are leading in electric vehicle production and batteries production by far in the world.

 

all Adani and Ambani do is buy up existing assets and infrastructure. But have zero vision to setup battery plants, electric vehicles, chip manufacturering or focus on export oriented industries. If tech and BPO sector is eliminated, India has zero foreign reserves besides remittances.

 

Platitudes and future promises mean nothing when people are suffering now in Delhi, Mumbai and Kolkata.

 

Everything is always vision 2030, 2040, 2050 when we all know political parties change in that long a horizon including priorities

 

No need for India and China to commit to anything.a Renewable energy revolution is going on in India and China.I keep track because i invest.China for example installed a mind boggling 230 GW of Renewable energy in 2023,that is more than US+ Europe combined.we are 10 years back of china but no reason why we cant follow China.If we can figure out storage problems and better batteries then everybody will be driving electric soon.all our Western states are prime wind energy real estate.Solar can be installed in vast amounts of our arid lands and we havent auctioned offshore Wind yet which will happen this year.

[coffee_rules]

2 hours ago, BlueBlood said:

Apparently genetically modified food is a "extreme leftist" agenda. Something that could eradicate hunger and malnutrition overnight. You want to land on the moon and Mars, make scientific achievements but not do the most basic common sense thing to prevent unnecessary deaths due to hunger in this day and age.

I got it wrong when you GMO food grains. There is a political agenda here where GMO food is believed to be bad for humans and agriculture that they want it to be regulated. That is the left agenda. You seem to indicate the other way around.

 

I think the India problem is not shortage of food grains, but in distribution. We waste more food  in sarkari godowns . The recently repeated farm laws would have helped ease that problem. India is self-sufficient in basic food grains, we import pulses. The diversitication from rice and wheat will also help. In the 60s, India had to import wheat to handle the growing population. The green revolution is the main reason we are making ch much better

[coffee_rules]

4 hours ago, Lannister said:

I think the decision of Congress, a liberal Hindu party, to refrain from participating in this religious ceremony is seen as a notable shift in Indian politics. It required a decade under Modi's governance for them to comprehend the true meaning of secularism.

And Congress will throw the next Iftar party and all will attend wearing skull-caps!! No political party is secular in India, even BJP or for  that matter even our constitution is not secular. Hinduism was plural and the word for secular in Hindi is dharm-nirpekshta that is government treats all religions equally , not keep out of religion as is the western want. Indian laws are anti-majority and promotes minoritarianism. . Government controls temples, taxes hundi collections and keeps out of other religions. They control what is taught in schools of the majority , no religious education, but keeps out of mosque or church run schools. Even BJP didn’t have the gumption to change these laws

Edited January 13, 2024 by coffee_rules

[Lannister]

31 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

And Congress will throw the next Iftar party and all will attend wearing skull-caps!! No political party is secular in India, even BJP or for  that matter even our constitution is not secular. Hinduism was plural and the word for secular in Hindi is dharm-nirpekshta that is government treats all religions equally , not keep out of religion as is the western want. Indian laws are anti-majority and promotes minoritarianism. . Government controls temples, taxes hundi collections and keeps out of other religions. They control what is taught in schools of the majority , no religious education, but keeps out of mosque or church run schools. Even BJP didn’t have the gumption to change these laws

The only viable alternative to the BJP's political ideology is to adopt secularism in it's true context, mirroring the decline of religious influence seen in Western countries.

[gattaca]

1 hour ago, BlueBlood said:

 

This is the mentality I am talking about.

 

On one hand you cannot claim Mars mission success and then have backward view on genetically modified food (GMO) that's banned in India. This one change could eliminate hunger to a large extent and save a lot of farmers from suicides.

 

Similarly, cattle used to be exported out of India. Now, farmers are supposed to not only farm but take care of aging cattle in the name of religion. Brain-dead lack of common sense.

 

Then you add on to this pushing Hindi medium in tier 2 and tier 3 when in reality all the richest business people in India are educated in Ivy league US/UK universities in English.

 

Or the fact that Make in India campaign has been an abject failure where there has been zero incentives to Indian entrepreneurs to build chip foundries, electric cars, or batteries.

 

The only reason India even has foreign reserves is the BPO and IT sector which is the vast majority of exports out of India. This was due to the STPI incentive made in 1991:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_Technology_Parks_of_India

 

You can talk about progress all you want but in the same 10 years, a lot of other countries including Bangladesh had more progress on a per capita income basis than India.

 

Which means the top 1% made almost ALL the wealth gains in terms of GDP growth.

 

This will continue because there is zero accountability or checks and balances as a majority of the country is busy fighting religious issues and twitter wars.

 

The GDP growth would have occurred regardless of who was PM due to digitization of everything in the last 10 years worldwide and the IT sector of India boomed because of it. But not a single industry is in India that can make it a powerhouse. Taiwan has semiconductors, China cheap manufacturing, Bangladesh with garments, Vietnam with being a mini China in terms of exports, Mexico with it's cars and other high tech manufacturing.

 

What is a single industry that India has that it exports besides IT and BPO sector? Not a single self-made entrepreneur in any of these industries. All we see is government backed cronies. Nothing has changed whether it's Congress prior or BJP now. Only difference is country has a frustrated junta riled up over movies, tweets or anything as they cannot vent their frustration on the government without their patriotism questioned.

What ? India has multiple schemes for start up companies under make in India.  Below are many schemes govt shouldn’t be in business of making things tax credits and loans are way to go.  Nothing has changed whether congress or bjp lol. Congress had license raj and ministries would get money bjp took out the whole thing out and it is much easier to get license. They are opening many regulated sectors like drones for startups or established businesses to invest. BJP also allowed companies to file bankruptcy which was very hard under previous rule. Any economic policy takes time and the deregulation benefits will take a decade to show fruits. Exports ? India has a vast population I would want startups to serve Indian population before thinking of exports. 
 

 

1. Startup India Scheme

This scheme was launched to promote and support startups in India by providing them with funding, tax benefits, and other incentives. It also provides legal and regulatory support and helps startups to network and collaborate with investors, mentors, and other entrepreneurs.

2. Mudra Yojana Scheme

This scheme provides financial assistance to small and micro enterprises, including startups, through loans of up to INR 10 lakhs. The scheme has been designed to cater to the financial requirements of startups and small businesses in the country.

3. Stand-Up India Scheme

This scheme was launched to promote entrepreneurship among women and SC/ST entrepreneurs. Under this scheme, loans of up to INR 1 crore are provided to eligible entrepreneurs to start or expand their businesses.

4. Atal Innovation Mission (AIM)

AIM is a government initiative that aims to promote innovation and entrepreneurship in the country. The mission provides funding, mentorship, and other support to startups and entrepreneurs working on innovative ideas.

5. Electronic Development Fund (EDF)

The EDF is a fund set up by the government to provide financial assistance to startups and small businesses working in the electronics and IT sectors. The fund provides equity, debt, and other forms of funding to eligible companies.

6. Pradhan Mantri Mudra Loan Yojana (PMMY)

This scheme provides loans to small and micro enterprises, including startups, for their business needs. The loans can be availed without any collateral security and can be used for various purposes such as working capital, buying machinery, and purchasing raw materials.

[gattaca]

36 minutes ago, Lannister said:

The only viable alternative to the BJP's political ideology is to adopt secularism in its true context, mirroring the decline of religious influence seen in Western countries.

We have seen secularism in India to hate Hindus and their culture and wash it using useless communists. Hopefully the western secularism dies in India. BJP is more of center left party for me they have schemes for all religions and no minority appeasement. Even in Kashmir they have medicines at low cost you know what Kashmirs call it modi ki dukaan. Ram temple is also decided by Supreme Court after arguments form KK Mahumad and other noted archaeologists. BJP hasn’t done anything post 2016.

Edited January 13, 2024 by gattaca

[Lannister]

48 minutes ago, gattaca said:

We have seen secularism in India to hate Hindus and their culture and wash it using useless communists. Hopefully the western secularism dies in India. BJP is more of center left party for me they have schemes for all religions and no minority appeasement. Even in Kashmir they have medicines at low cost you know what Kashmirs call it modi ki dukaan. Ram temple is also decided by Supreme Court after arguments form KK Mahumad and other noted archaeologists. BJP hasn’t done anything post 2016.

If you see adopting religious neutrality as being anti-Hindu, then too bad. Our focus shouldn't be on catering to the desires of the religious right.

[Singh bling]

4 hours ago, BlueBlood said:

hope Congress just dies so we can create a new movement like what Vajpayee and Advani did to defeat the monopolistic Congress party back then.

In today's environment there can hardly be any opposition. Millions of BJP supporters will hound any opposition as anti national. They will be called agents of West, islamists etc media will hound them . ED and income tax will constantly raid them. Unless they have billions of rupees to buy time on TV they can't do anything.

 

 

[MechEng]

5 hours ago, BlueBlood said:

 

This is a common tactic uses since Hitler, Stalin, Kim Jong Un etc.

 

Wrap yourself around for flag and under the guise of patriotism any criticism is challenged as anti-Hindu, terrorist etc.

 

Then, it's very easy to control the population which had zero financial or economic upliftment by brainwashing them that their issues are because someone else that does not share the same culture. Or just shut up and be happy and proud of your nation.

 

Apparently genetically modified food is a "extreme leftist" agenda. Something that could eradicate hunger and malnutrition overnight. You want to land on the moon and Mars, make scientific achievements but not do the most basic common sense thing to prevent unnecessary deaths due to hunger in this day and age.

 

It's because when you keep people hungry and poor, just offer them free rice and rations to control them. Because once they can feed themselves, they will demand better standard of living, standard of governance, education and upliftment.

 

We see that in Western nations which everyone posting here immigrated to long back where even a small level of corruption or mismanagement becomes a big issue that makes politicians act urgently to fix. Why? Because the common person isn't struggling for food, clothing, shelter, jobs and basic necessities.

 

I have no issue in criticizing prior administrations for not solving hunger or malnutrition. Which would ultimately help lower costs of Healthcare and spread of diseases.

 

Where I have serious issue is in this false sense of pride where all the lingering issues are swept aside and irrelevant issues like Maldives, Nayanathara etc. Get all the coverage.

 

This will keep the country poor and continue the braindrain. 

 

Adani and Ambani and other corporates can buy mansions in UK, roam around in 20 private jets and keep destroying small businesses with their monopolistic behavior in critical industries. But apparently they are pride of the country and we should be "proud" of them unlike TATA who actually does real charity work and does not need government assistance or state bank loans to grow. 

 

Recent elections are proof, where still money and liquor is openly distributed to win votes of poor people. If country is making so much progress and people are so proud as mentioned by media why do politicians need to openly distribute money to people to win votes?

 

Just mark my words: it will be the middle class that will be hurt the most with all these ass backwards policies in the end. Just look at GST implementation or demonetization it was morphed into a patriotic thing where rich will pay a fair share but in reality middle class gets hurt the most with these consumption taxes and cash is even more prevelant than ever before.

 

Should have banned cash like in most parts of China if real digitization was needed. But they never will as they need cash for elections and cash for corruption.

 

Yet no media showed issues about it because they are bought and paid for. In western nations even a 1% tax increase gets public to demand accountability.

 

A perfect example of this is Idiocracy movie. That's exactly what's happening with Hindi medium and lack of English in tier 2 and tier 3 cities where the next generation will have zero skills to thrive in a global environment.

 

Except for some tier 2 or 3 cities, most of modern India is ugly to look at and I honestly don't see it getting any better with the way things are moving towards.

[Lone Wolf]

3 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

And Congress will throw the next Iftar party and all will attend wearing skull-caps!! No political party is secular in India, even BJP or for  that matter even our constitution is not secular. Hinduism was plural and the word for secular in Hindi is dharm-nirpekshta that is government treats all religions equally , not keep out of religion as is the western want. Indian laws are anti-majority and promotes minoritarianism. . Government controls temples, taxes hundi collections and keeps out of other religions. They control what is taught in schools of the majority , no religious education, but keeps out of mosque or church run schools. Even BJP didn’t have the gumption to change these laws

You can wonder if those secular ideas or secularism works right now or not but after at least 20-30 after Independence to keep Indian Union intact such anti majority practices were much needed. 

Nehru used Force in Nagaland & results were nearly fatal...  As such art 370 was also the need as local Hindus as well Muslims were in favour of special status or wanted land laws like HP as state is actually most diverse in entire India or in the North at least. 

 

Indian Union is a experiment for a reason as a country of such diversity & landmass surrounded by hostile nations would have been filled with unrest in a normal scenario. 

It's a miracle how everything worked out smoothly.  The idea of single nation & nationalism was force fed by Gandhi to masses & his successors found a way to keep the process going & India went well past its formative years as Independent united country despite being a nightmare to govern.  Even British would be surprised how the heck we did all this as they themselves needed so much local support & concession to regional allies including autonomy to keep it under control 

[coffee_rules]

14 minutes ago, MechEng said:

 

Except for some tier 2 or 3 cities, most of modern India is ugly to look at and I honestly don't see it getting any better with the way things are moving towards.

You remind of the dialogue by Aamir khan in Andaz Apna Apna. “Mujhe India kabhi pasand hai nahin tha. Mere dost bhi kahate the Tu India ke liye bana hi nahin. Tujhe to kahin aur hona chahiye tha!” 

[coffee_rules]

53 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said:

You can wonder if those secular ideas or secularism works right now or not but after at least 20-30 after Independence to keep Indian Union intact such anti majority practices were much needed. 

Nehru used Force in Nagaland & results were nearly fatal...  As such art 370 was also the need as local Hindus as well Muslims were in favour of special status or wanted land laws like HP as state is actually most diverse in entire India or in the North at least. 

 

Indian Union is a experiment for a reason as a country of such diversity & landmass surrounded by hostile nations would have been filled with unrest in a normal scenario. 

It's a miracle how everything worked out smoothly.  The idea of single nation & nationalism was force fed by Gandhi to masses & his successors found a way to keep the process going & India went well past its formative years as Independent united country despite being a nightmare to govern.  Even British would be surprised how the heck we did all this as they themselves needed so much local support & concession to regional allies including autonomy to keep it under control 

What has Nagaland got with archaic laws governing temples? This was a British era policy of temple administration by Government that Congress continued and now BJP.

 

Congress was founded by British to give Indians a semblance of self-rule, after WWIi they had to leave. Indian (Hindu) civilization was unified culturally for 1000s of years, because of Hindus and belief in plurality  rhe country unified. We chose a pseudo-secular system because of Hindus. Congress left no space for any opposition because of Gandhi Nehru. They made sure none of the revolutionaries, garam dal succeeded (maybe to help British . You know how Bose was brought down by Gandhi and how Nehru was selected as PM ;not elected).  People had lost trust in the Raj rule and hence the Rajas and Sultans/Nizams fell in line. That part , we have to give credit to Congress and the British themselves! 

 

 

[gattaca]

21 hours ago, Lannister said:

If you see adopting religious neutrality as being anti-Hindu, then too bad. Our focus shouldn't be on catering to the desires of the religious right.

Religious neutrality shouldn’t be abusing Hindu religion. Nehru hated Hindu religion and so did congress for 60 years and still do. So does all the left secular parties in India. I clearly stated what bjp did. They did nothing for Hindus but they didn’t bad mouth Hindu religion and culture. In fact they did more for Muslims by banning triple talaq which congress should have done in 90s but for appeasement they did nothing. Congress is about appeasing Muslims bjp is about respecting all religions not hard choice to choose from.

Edited January 14, 2024 by gattaca

[coffee_rules]

Karnataka Congress general secy tweeting this photo. They all are BJP decoys in Congress 

 

 

 

[ravishingravi]

As things stand, for me the most important person or atleast one of the most important persons is KK Mohammed. I hope he is called and recognized for his work. 

[coffee_rules]

58 minutes ago, ravishingravi said:

As things stand, for me the most important person or atleast one of the most important persons is KK Mohammed. I hope he is called and recognized for his work. 

Even before KK, it was Prof BB Lal who had  done the excavation before 1992 when the Masjid-e-janma sthan was standing. and had provided  the first proof of the temple. See Meenakisgi Jain’s videos on Ayodhya about how the leftist historians tried to sabotage his archeological findings. BB Lal was recommended by them as a hey thought he was also a leftist as he had written a book on IVC. But, like Justice Chandrachud,  he turned against the leftists towards Dharma. Really, Dharmo rakshite rakshitaha! 

[cowboysfan]

1 hour ago, ravishingravi said:

As things stand, for me the most important person or atleast one of the most important persons is KK Mohammed. I hope he is called and recognized for his work. 

he hates BJP for the right reasons.he has rightly said the last 10 years have been the worst for ASI.BJP seems to have no interest in further temple excavations anywhere.

[Singh bling]

 

Even shankaracharya's are not spared  by online trolls of BJP.  Shankaracharya's are new entry in club of anti Hindu and anti nationals. 

[ravishingravi]

2 hours ago, cowboysfan said:

he hates BJP for the right reasons.he has rightly said the last 10 years have been the worst for ASI.BJP seems to have no interest in further temple excavations anywhere.

 

Yeah but this is not about BJP. Ram mandir is above partisan groups or even religion. And I have seen his videos. He doesn't hate. He has some grouses with both BJP and the left. 

[someone]

On 1/13/2024 at 10:16 PM, BlueBlood said:

 

This is the mentality I am talking about.

 

That's the coward mentality. Like those office people who themselves don't do anything, yet be critical and put obstacles to those other people who are doing some work.

 

India is a unique position and has to deal with first, second  & third world problems same time. So be it from building toilets to MARS mission, all are important and has to celebrated with the work done. And this Ramjanmabhoomi represents a India where a major pre-existing problem is resolved, so it has to well-appreciated. Next, India can't do D immediately, without ABC. Like that Raghuram Rajan who keeps lamenting about how India isn't in high value automation, yet India can't jumpstart and has to start with lower level manufacturing now. The reason is India has missed many first mover advantages during the UPA era, and thus, is only doing catchup. So growth isn't inevitable,  it takes both hard work and vision. Remember how this former UPA finance minister was laughing at the idea of digitization in "poor" India in Rajya Sabha., but turned out he was so wrong. So let's not forget the precarious health of India economics,banks, major projects given by UPA 2014.

 

You can keep cherry picking things, but where are the solutions? And precisely whom can do?  Today, both sides have their track record, and clearly Modi has pro-voters for his work. Whereas Rahul Gandhi has zero achievements, zero stories, zero success. Many things can been resolved and completed in last decade, and many more has to be done, and clearly, one side is better placed to solve them...