Adamant Posted February 4, 2024 Share Posted February 4, 2024 People who call him choker should stop, he has already turned so many test matches in our favour. express bowling, rollingstoned, Vijy and 1 other 1 3 Link to comment
NameGoesHere Posted February 4, 2024 Share Posted February 4, 2024 What a ride for someone like me who vaguely remembers Sunny Gavaskar opening the bowling, with the idea of roughing up the cherry for he spinners to come on quickly. jazzprit and singhvivek141 2 Link to comment
Majestic Posted February 4, 2024 Share Posted February 4, 2024 18 hours ago, sensible-indian said: ATG - GOAT material. The world has never seen such a complete pacer like Bummy. Can bowl in tests, odis and t20s. Great at both conventional and reverse swing. More so with reverse swing. Can get the ball to jag around after pitching at every stage of the game. Incredible slower delivery that's lethal in all formats. A mean yorker to boot. Can open the bowling, bowl in the middle overs and then go on to york batsmen at the death. Can turn the game around by delivering a Steyneque knockout spell on a dead or batting friendly track (Oval, Vizag). The only bowler who had it all like him was Wasim Akram. I don't know the cricviz swing and seam stats, but from my memory, Bummy gets more seam while Akram gets more swing. Glenn McGrath was the most scary and clutch bowler I have ever seen in my life...but I am not sure he would have the same aura he had playing ODIs and T20s in the modern era. But he would totally destroy modern test bats for sure with DRS in play. Coming back to Bummy, he has the potential to retire as the greatest all format, all conditions, all situation bowler the world has ever seen. His only weakness is being injury prone, that will affect his longevity. But otherwise, he is one of the most complete bowler of all-time. sensible-indian and Kron 2 Link to comment
Lord Posted February 4, 2024 Share Posted February 4, 2024 10 hours ago, Adamant said: People who call him choker should stop, he has already turned so many test matches in our favour. That's exactly why he's called a choker. The KO performance are very bad for bowler of his calibre Sandz 1 Link to comment
randomGuy Posted June 13, 2024 Share Posted June 13, 2024 This so much reminds me of me and my brother growing up raki05, cricspirit and Kron 3 Link to comment
Kron Posted June 13, 2024 Share Posted June 13, 2024 On 2/4/2024 at 2:43 PM, Adamant said: People who call him choker should stop, he has already turned so many test matches in our favour. Plus he only did bad in wtc final case he was injured in the fi al Him an pant had they played along with ash etc we would have won the wtc final vs Aussies last time Link to comment
Kron Posted June 13, 2024 Share Posted June 13, 2024 On 2/5/2024 at 1:06 AM, Majestic said: His only weakness is being injury prone, that will affect his longevity. But otherwise, he is one of the most complete bowler of all-time. He is better than steyn for me in his prime. That test vs england on dead wickets where he averaged 10 sealed it. Bazzball was in form and we had to win too. express bowling 1 Link to comment
Kron Posted June 13, 2024 Share Posted June 13, 2024 On 2/5/2024 at 1:14 AM, Lord said: That's exactly why he's called a choker. The KO performance are very bad for bowler of his calibre Steyn is also a choker. He choked in wc in t20 and odi Both are great in tests though Link to comment
New guy Posted June 13, 2024 Share Posted June 13, 2024 (edited) On 2/4/2024 at 8:44 PM, Lord said: That's exactly why he's called a choker. The KO performance are very bad for bowler of his calibre Even great players have only 1 or 2 great KO performances in their entire career. Dhoni had only 1, Ponting had 1 in 6 world cup finals and many more semis. Players like Gambhir and Head are exception. So if he has even 1 great KO performance that is enough. Edited June 13, 2024 by New guy Number, express bowling and Ultimate_Game 3 Link to comment
Majestic Posted June 13, 2024 Share Posted June 13, 2024 4 hours ago, Kron said: He is better than steyn for me in his prime. That test vs england on dead wickets where he averaged 10 sealed it. Bazzball was in form and we had to win too. Which one? He failed atrociously in the final test where he captained the side. Need to pass the longevity test to be rated better than below names :- Marshall, Ambrose McGrath, Cummins, Lillee Hadlee Steyn, Donald Imran, Wasim Kron 1 Link to comment
Kron Posted June 13, 2024 Share Posted June 13, 2024 5 hours ago, Majestic said: Which one? He failed atrociously in the final test where he captained the side. Need to pass the longevity test to be rated better than below names :- Marshall, Ambrose McGrath, Cummins, Lillee Hadlee Steyn, Donald Imran, Wasim In India where he averaged 16 for thr series on dead tracks. Unreal bowler. He only needs to improve performances in one off wtc finals. He only played one though and played injured. Sandz and BacktoCricaddict 2 Link to comment
Kron Posted June 13, 2024 Share Posted June 13, 2024 7 hours ago, Majestic said: Which one? He failed atrociously in the final test where he captained the side. Need to pass the longevity test to be rated better than below names :- Marshall, Ambrose McGrath, Cummins, Lillee Hadlee Steyn, Donald Imran, Wasim no offense to any pakistani fans or old school indian fans, i truly believe bumrah is better than imran and also wasim. in terms of sheer ability, skill and fear factor. Link to comment
Muloghonto Posted June 14, 2024 Share Posted June 14, 2024 On 2/3/2024 at 1:11 PM, sensible-indian said: ATG - GOAT material. The world has never seen such a complete pacer like Bummy. Can bowl in tests, odis and t20s. Great at both conventional and reverse swing. More so with reverse swing. Can get the ball to jag around after pitching at every stage of the game. Incredible slower delivery that's lethal in all formats. A mean yorker to boot. Can open the bowling, bowl in the middle overs and then go on to york batsmen at the death. Can turn the game around by delivering a Steyneque knockout spell on a dead or batting friendly track (Oval, Vizag). The only bowler who had it all like him was Wasim Akram. I don't know the cricviz swing and seam stats, but from my memory, Bummy gets more seam while Akram gets more swing. Glenn McGrath was the most scary and clutch bowler I have ever seen in my life...but I am not sure he would have the same aura he had playing ODIs and T20s in the modern era. But he would totally destroy modern test bats for sure with DRS in play. Coming back to Bummy, he has the potential to retire as the greatest all format, all conditions, all situation bowler the world has ever seen. Best bowler i've ever seen was Marshall. The only thing he didn't have is reverse swing, till very late in his career but he didn't need it, because he replicated reverse swing's effects by using the crease better than any bowler i've ever seen. After Marshall, i'd say the best bowler is Ambrose because he was by far the most clutch pacer i've ever seen. After that, is McGrath & Garner for being basically a '99% of Ambrose' guy in every respect. Then is Holding in my books, for being the most consistent extreme pace bowler i've ever seen. I'd put Bumrah in the next group of bowlers, alongside Wasim, Imran, Steyn, Donald, Roberts & Cummins. Then will be bowlers like Pollock, Rabada, Waqar, Walsh. I don't rate Lillee as he was basically a total favourable track bully and a big fat zero in Asia. sensible-indian, Kron, BacktoCricaddict and 2 others 1 4 Link to comment
Kron Posted June 14, 2024 Share Posted June 14, 2024 2 hours ago, Muloghonto said: Best bowler i've ever seen was Marshall. The only thing he didn't have is reverse swing, till very late in his career but he didn't need it, because he replicated reverse swing's effects by using the crease better than any bowler i've ever seen. After Marshall, i'd say the best bowler is Ambrose because he was by far the most clutch pacer i've ever seen. After that, is McGrath & Garner for being basically a '99% of Ambrose' guy in every respect. Then is Holding in my books, for being the most consistent extreme pace bowler i've ever seen. I'd put Bumrah in the next group of bowlers, alongside Wasim, Imran, Steyn, Donald, Roberts & Cummins. Then will be bowlers like Pollock, Rabada, Waqar, Walsh. I don't rate Lillee as he was basically a total favourable track bully and a big fat zero in Asia. Can't argue with that. Marshall Ambrose were simply on another level. My opinion I would add mcg as well to the top tier list on par with marshall Link to comment
Muloghonto Posted June 14, 2024 Share Posted June 14, 2024 10 minutes ago, Kron said: Can't argue with that. Marshall Ambrose were simply on another level. My opinion I would add mcg as well to the top tier list on par with marshall i rate Ambrose higher than McGrath for a couple of reasons: 1. he was slightly faster at his peak, with more bounce and even more stingy L&L bowling 2. Unlike McGrath, he didnt have an ATG batting lineup to put up 300+ every single time practically as final target, he had a very weak & inconsistent WI batting lineup and had to defend 120-200 run scores all the time and still won several matches from that position & made it helluva close in others. Marshall is simply matchless. he had top end pace ( the 150+ category), a lot of seam for someone at that pace, some swing, excellent control of L&L and one of the sharpest minds to ever play cricket, with his near unique ability to work the crease - that man didnt come from the same angular runp or the same runup every bowler has, he came literally from all over the place, sometimes angling in past mid on, sometimes angling in past midoff, sometimes coming in straight as a rod, etc. The only thing he didnt have, is reverse swing, till the last 2-3 years of his career. He is one of the extremely rare sportsmen who are not just elite in physical skills but also in the elite IQ range for how smart he was. Kron 1 Link to comment
BacktoCricaddict Posted June 14, 2024 Share Posted June 14, 2024 10 hours ago, Muloghonto said: Marshall is simply matchless. The truest statement ever spoken. Link to comment
Lord Posted June 14, 2024 Share Posted June 14, 2024 On 6/13/2024 at 7:30 PM, New guy said: Even great players have only 1 or 2 great KO performances in their entire career. Dhoni had only 1, Ponting had 1 in 6 world cup finals and many more semis. Players like Gambhir and Head are exception. So if he has even 1 great KO performance that is enough. Yes one knockout match winning performance will be good for a start Ultimate_Game and Kron 2 Link to comment
rkt.india Posted June 14, 2024 Share Posted June 14, 2024 11 hours ago, Muloghonto said: i rate Ambrose higher than McGrath for a couple of reasons: 1. he was slightly faster at his peak, with more bounce and even more stingy L&L bowling 2. Unlike McGrath, he didnt have an ATG batting lineup to put up 300+ every single time practically as final target, he had a very weak & inconsistent WI batting lineup and had to defend 120-200 run scores all the time and still won several matches from that position & made it helluva close in others. Marshall is simply matchless. he had top end pace ( the 150+ category), a lot of seam for someone at that pace, some swing, excellent control of L&L and one of the sharpest minds to ever play cricket, with his near unique ability to work the crease - that man didnt come from the same angular runp or the same runup every bowler has, he came literally from all over the place, sometimes angling in past mid on, sometimes angling in past midoff, sometimes coming in straight as a rod, etc. The only thing he didnt have, is reverse swing, till the last 2-3 years of his career. He is one of the extremely rare sportsmen who are not just elite in physical skills but also in the elite IQ range for how smart he was. Marshall was not 150 by any means Link to comment
BacktoCricaddict Posted June 14, 2024 Share Posted June 14, 2024 17 minutes ago, rkt.india said: Marshall was not 150 by any means I don't believe any of them consistently hit 145+. Maybe Patrick Patterson, but he was a bit of a flash in the pan. The others were more menacing because it was an era of less protection for batsmen plus more bowler-friendly pitches. express bowling 1 Link to comment
BacktoCricaddict Posted June 14, 2024 Share Posted June 14, 2024 21 minutes ago, Lord said: Yes one knockout match winning performance will be good for a start I'd go even further to say - in the final of an ICC tournament. It is here that India has fallen short many times, most agonizingly in the recent ODIWC. Kohli has performed in a QF/SF, but unless the pinnacle is reached, it will not be remembered. Fair or not, it comes with the territory of being a superstar and they must embrace it. Ultimate_Game 1 Link to comment
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