Why doesn't Test cricket have real No.3s anymore? How Test cricket's most iconic spot changed

[vvvslaxman]

 

[Lord]

flat pitches? Pujara was the last typical no. 3

[vvvslaxman]

5 minutes ago, Lord said:

flat pitches? Pujara was the last typical no. 3

yes. But i think India has enough players to experiment to find the right no.3 . I guess Yash Dhull or Raghuvanshi will take that spot eventually.

[cricspirit]

May be try Sai Sudharsan for a bit longer. He is young.

 

I feel if we can find a different opener KL Rahul may be suitable for No.3 

[tapandrun]

Its the result of t20 cricket, no cricketer wants to be tagged or be restricted as test match player, if that happens to some1 they loses a lot of mny.

No t20 league contract , and once they retire there is no coaching future as they have not played the t20s and t20 league. 

 

Think Cook openly said dont be like him.

 

Cricket as a game has moved v.quickly in recent 5-6 yrs. specially how eng adopted the fast moving game. 1st they did it in white-ball then in test.

 

Not jst number 3, openers role have been changed now, tests are seeing fast scoring openers, if openers are fast scoring then no.3 has to be fast scoring. 

No.4 still remains the easiest spot to score big runs and is reserved fr the star player of the team.

 

Leaving out pujara's record in Aus he has been criticized a lot of time for his slow scoring eating up balls and not scoring resulting in team not scoring a lot of runs or post a big total because they were just playing dots and not scoring.

 

Top test teams are trying to bridge the gap between t20 and test to keep their pool of players intersted in test and not to leave test for white-ball or more specifically t20 cricket where most of the mny is. The other way is rest of the boards or team who have totally given up on test cricket like Pak and WI.

 

Fab4 all playing at no.3 in white-ball for their respective teams have recently retired so teams are just trying various batters in that slot and if no.3 slot opens up in test match too then they have no option but to try some of those player from white-ball cricket.

 

Right now not much of odi cricket is happening and what ever they are playing all the teams are trying to play a different players trying out their A/B/C

level sides and plus some teams are also trying to rotate the positions to see how they can fit certain player at certain roles if needed.

 

 

Its just that the game has changed, now as a player if they are not improving their game or not updating their skill set then they are regressing. Do not think it happened to cricket since it started getting tvised , there have been changes but it was slow and gradual.

 

Ind cricket fan may be noticing it now because they are seeing such changes after the retirements of big 3-4 players.

 

Nothing to do with flat pitches, its still the most testing time for batters in test. Only Eng has moved to flat tracks in tests rest are still making tough pitched for test 

 

Flat pitches are prepared for white-ball not for tests. 

 

 

Edited September 6, 2025 by tapandrun

[Gollum]

I feel Jaiswal will do better as number 3. He can be an improved version of Ponting. He has crazy extremes as opener because of his aggressive style, if he comes after 10-15 overs, that stat will change. Despite what these vidoes say, opening is still much tougher than number 3. 

[New guy]

4 hours ago, tapandrun said:

 

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Nothing to do with flat pitches, its still the most testing time for batters in test. Only Eng has moved to flat tracks in tests rest are still making tough pitched for test 

 

Flat pitches are prepared for white-ball not for tests. 

 

 

In tests it's more technique deteriorating than pitches. I simply don't see batsmen able to even leave 2 balls in a row without trying to hit out and try to feel bat on ball.

 

The rare ones who can actually defend and leave ball after ball, like Root and Smith, do well.

Edited September 6, 2025 by New guy

[cricspirit]

5 hours ago, Gollum said:

I feel Jaiswal will do better as number 3. He can be an improved version of Ponting. He has crazy extremes as opener because of his aggressive style, if he comes after 10-15 overs, that stat will change. Despite what these vidoes say, opening is still much tougher than number 3. 

 

I was thinking about Jaiswal at 3 too. But I do not suggest as we dont have a test opener like him. So if he moves down we have KL Rahul and another no Idea who. 

 

 

[vvvslaxman]

1 hour ago, cricspirit said:

 

I was thinking about Jaiswal at 3 too. But I do not suggest as we dont have a test opener like him. So if he moves down we have KL Rahul and another no Idea who. 

 

 

Jaiswal needs to stay where he is. He is a game breaker like Sehwag. Before even bowler settles down he can throw them off their plans

[tapandrun]

6 hours ago, New guy said:

In tests it's more technique deteriorating than pitches. I simply don't see batsmen able to even leave 2 balls in a row without trying to hit out and try to feel bat on ball.

 

The rare ones who can actually defend and leave ball after ball, like Root and Smith, do well.

As mentioned game has changed, previously batters use to train to defend and play closer to the body and deflect the ball in the gaps.

 

As draws are not acceptable results and t20 is emerging as favoured format for player too , the batters' training and technique has changed need to create some room to be able to swing the bat more freely and impart more momentum while hitting. This is the part of power/range hitting or daily drills they do.

 

Hence playing away from body, sometime getting sucked into playing a shot (due to subconscious) are creeping in their technique. This is all the part of new batting style.

 

Look at old pics or videos technique was differnt back then because of bats used and the protective equipments, game was changing gradually.

But now its changing more rapidly.

 

Yes defensive technique/mindset is going away and more and more fluent scorers are emerging and then add to new modern day shots.

They now train for faster bat speed, stable core and power positions etc.

 

Its similar to how wk role has changed, previously it was an specialist job. it never mattered if they can bat or not they had to be v.good keeper. And team would say they have 5 batters 1 keeper and 5 bowlers.

 

These days keeper has to be a batter or in some cases teams will take some1 who is a better batter than a wk.  

 

Edited September 6, 2025 by tapandrun

[Gollum]

2 hours ago, cricspirit said:

 

I was thinking about Jaiswal at 3 too. But I do not suggest as we dont have a test opener like him. So if he moves down we have KL Rahul and another no Idea who. 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

Jaiswal needs to stay where he is. He is a game breaker like Sehwag. Before even bowler settles down he can throw them off their plans

Opening is tough, that is why historically the best players come at 3 and 4. You won't find 50+ averaging openers, Gavaskar was barely over 50 and he benefited from playing for 3 years against weakened sides due to Packer. 

 

I consider Graeme Smith the best batsman of 2000s, but even he averaged only 48. Langer 44, Cook 45, Sehwag 49, Warner 45 etc. Hayden a touch over 50. 

 

Once Jaiswal hits a rough patch, difficult to bounce back because we barely play weak teams like SL, WI, BD.....avoid Pak. We can sacrifice a lesser batsman as opener, and stack 3 and 4 wth Jaiswal-Gill combo. 

 

Next year we will play on paddy fields of NZ, don't want our best batsmen against brand new cherry (and Henry, Rourke, Jamieson) there.

[Gollum]

Sai can do better as an opener especially overseas, his 25(70) will be much more valuable there. Next NZ tour, we must plan very carefully, because new ball does crazy things there....we need our best strokeplayers (Jaiswal, Gill, Pant) coming against the 40-50 over old balls. Sai-KL-Sundar-Jaddu in top 4 can do a much better job at countering their opening bursts. 

Edited September 6, 2025 by Gollum

[vvvslaxman]

6 minutes ago, Gollum said:

 

Opening is tough, that is why historically the best players come at 3 and 4. You won't find 50+ averaging openers, Gavaskar was barely over 50 and he benefited from playing for 3 years against weakened sides due to Packer. 

 

I consider Graeme Smith the best batsman of 2000s, but even he averaged only 48. Langer 44, Cook 45, Sehwag 49, Warner 45 etc. Hayden a touch over 50. 

 

Once Jaiswal hits a rough patch, difficult to bounce back because we barely play weak teams like SL, WI, BD.....avoid Pak. We can sacrifice a lesser batsman as opener, and stack 3 and 4 wth Jaiswal-Gill combo. 

 

Next year we will play on paddy fields of NZ, don't want our best batsmen against brand new cherry (and Henry, Rourke, Jamieson) there.

The thing is Jaiswal is not going to change his appraoch at no.3 If he comes in early and goes after bowling and loses his wicket he will have far more criticism than when he fails as opener. No.3 is as good as opener  as the opening batsman can get out first ball. India needs someone to bridge the gap between no.4 and opener. Basically new ball should be seen off. That was all India needed at Lords. But Jaiswal's early exit followed by Sai's exit exposed Gill to new ball. India just needed them to bat for 25 overs. Batting got easier.

[Chaos]

Its good we getting aggressive batting. It would be such borefest to watch 300ball 100. I personally dont have time for it unless its green mamba or square turner then its acceptable.