surajmal Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 "Extremism is worse in India. Pakistan is a secular society in a religious state; whereas India is a religious society in a secular state." Jehangir contended. http://tribune.com.pk/story/508856/karachi-literature-festival-are-we-secular-enough/ Yeah, they are that screwed up in the head. And Asma Jehangir is one of the saner voices in that circus land, so baki logon ka to allah hi malik hai.
surajmal Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 :hysterical::hysterical: A Dhimmi has got to do what a Dhimmi has got to do.
urbestfriend Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 The day we stop generalizing on the lines of Indian Muslims are blah blah , Indian Hindus are blah blah..Paki sunnis are blah blah, US jews are blah blah world will be a better place.
NareshK Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 There is probably a economic angle to the genocide of Baloch shias, it's probably backed by the Pak army to scare them off into refugee camps so the Sunni Punjabi dominated Pak army can exploit the massive natural resources of the Balochistan for their own greed and paranoia to keep their army sustainable. The Gwador port has just come online, so expect more mass murdering of ethnic Balochis in Balochistan. This.
Sean Bradley Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 The new generation of Indian Muslims are vastly secular in their views and education has played a pivotol role in their development, especially the ones emerging from metropolitans, posters who claim that the muslims in india are theocratic are either non residentials or baseing their claims on hear say or a personal bad experience. The change in Indian Muslims transpired majorly because of the failing state of pakistan and a beleif that their ancestors made the right choice by staying put in India. It hasnt been an overnight development, acts like babri masjid, godhra, 1993 bomb blast and 2008 attack on Mumbai is what we can refer to as the sacrifices made to reach the state of secularism in 65 years of independence. Bombs and Bullets have no Religion, we have learnt this the hard way.
Muloghonto Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 For starters how many radicalized, fundoo Indian Muslims have you seen on ICF? Care to name them? As for the counter question I've seen plenty here starting from BossBhai, sandtest, Dada_Rocks, you etc. etc. I think you are making a strawman argument here, since i do not see any correlation with representation in ICF having any basis to representation in India. There could be host of social as well as preference reasons for having a skewed demographic here ( in terms of fundoo vs non-fundoo perspective), not to mention, the entire membership of ICF does not qualify for any sort of sample space for India and Indians by any practical measure. If you disagree, i would urge you to point out any example, outside of fuzzy logic acadeima involving marketing & human psychological assertions ( some of which i do not agree with BTW) that equates a sample size of 1 in 500,000 to be actually correlative. I undestand that you are a man of science and since you have made scientific demands of me in the past,perhaps you would like to point out any practice in pure sciences/engineering that qualifies 1 in 500,000 to be an effective control test barometer for correlations ??
Muloghonto Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 Do you condemn this bombing of Balochis? Well now that you are forcing him to pay lip-service to ethnic cleansing and dirty laundry of sunni islamists, he will do so. But make no mistakes, muslims by and large, especially Sunnis, are not interested in protesting against Muslim-Muslim genocides, terrorism, brutalities, etc. Not once will you see a mob of Sunnis voicing their protest about blowing up Shias, nowhere in the muslim world. But if Israel so much as farts in the direction of Palestine, India builds a new road in Kashmir or Europe condemns fundamentalist islamic killers, you will see Muslims out in droves, protesting the ill-treatment of muslims by the kaffirs. That really, is their Modus Operandi. They simply pretend that intra-Islamic violence does not exist or it is justified, the only violence that will get them hot and bothered, is when a non-muslim does it against muslims. Thank heavens there are people like Sooda, who i think are humans first and muslims second, which gives me faint hope about the followers of that arbitary belieif system.
Ram Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 Well now that you are forcing him to pay lip-service to ethnic cleansing and dirty laundry of sunni islamists, he will do so. But make no mistakes, muslims by and large, especially Sunnis, are not interested in protesting against Muslim-Muslim genocides, terrorism, brutalities, etc. Not once will you see a mob of Sunnis voicing their protest about blowing up Shias, nowhere in the muslim world. But if Israel so much as farts in the direction of Palestine, India builds a new road in Kashmir or Europe condemns fundamentalist islamic killers, you will see Muslims out in droves, protesting the ill-treatment of muslims by the kaffirs. That really, is their Modus Operandi. They simply pretend that intra-Islamic violence does not exist or it is justified, the only violence that will get them hot and bothered, is when a non-muslim does it against muslims. Wait, did you just type that, in the very same thread about Pakistani Shiites protesting over killings perpetrated by Pakistani Sunnis? :hysterical:
Muloghonto Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 Wait' date=' did you just type that, in the very same thread about Pakistani Shiites protesting over killings perpetrated by Pakistani Sunnis? :hysterical:[/quote'] Read more carefully. Obviously the party that is targetted are going to go shout from their rooftops. I mean, where are the protests by Sunnis against this brutal genocide against the Shias ? Or hell, when Shias go beserk on Sunnis in Iran, do we see any Shias getting together and disassociating themselves from it ?
King Tendulkar Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 For starters how many radicalized, fundoo Indian Muslims have you seen on ICF? Care to name them? As for the counter question I've seen plenty here starting from BossBhai, sandtest, Dada_Rocks, you etc. etc. A ridiculous post on so many different levels:hysterical:
panther Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 Do you condemn this bombing of Balochis? Yes
Texy Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 I find it ironic that many Pakistanis living abroad are more concerned with the safety of Muslims in India. They refuse to believe the ongoing conflict, bloodshed, genocide, target killing and tries to focus on Muslim safety issues in India particularly in Kashmir as in their mind it gives them reassurance and reaffirms legitimacy in the formation of Pakistan.
Tiger80 Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 I find it ironic that many Pakistanis living abroad are more concerned with the safety of Muslims in India. They refuse to believe the ongoing conflict' date=' bloodshed, genocide, target killing and tries to focus on Muslim safety issues in India particularly in Kashmir as in their mind it gives them reassurance and reaffirms legitimacy in the formation of Pakistan.[/quote'] Bhai bahar jaa kee Insaan kaa dimaag thoda satak jaata hai
NareshK Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 I find it ironic that many Pakistanis living abroad are more concerned with the safety of Muslims in India. They refuse to believe the ongoing conflict' date=' bloodshed, genocide, target killing and tries to focus on Muslim safety issues in India particularly in Kashmir as in their mind it gives them reassurance and reaffirms legitimacy in the formation of Pakistan.[/quote'] Why do we care about every tom, dick and harry's opinions about our country in the first place ? Ignore those losers. Its similar to new channels bringing Musharaff on their shows. How do you expect these people to talk anything but negative about India ? Its our fault we give them the opportunity.
panther Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 Welcome to nutbaristan. When people are hellbent to kill each other based on some book that is supposedly holy, without a single shred of divine evidence, this is the result. Actually that holy book you talk about does not mention the word sunni or shia and even warns Muslims to not create division between themselves.
Swing_n_Speed Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 Baloch is not a sect it is a ethnic group. shia-sunni difference is basically on who should have succeded the Prophet (pbuh) after his death sunnis accept Abubaker,Umar,Uthman and Ali as the caliph of the muslims in that order shia reject this and believe ali should have been first as he was related to the prophet. Ahmadiya is a relatively new sect who believe that the prophet(pbuh) was not the last messenger of Allah and their leader Mirza ghulam ahmed was the last prophet of Allah as well as the second coming of Christ and the mahdi. Whoaa fascinating. Thanks a lot for for the reply. I could've probably googled it, but I guess if ur on a forum why not pose the question? One more question, since they are in the news a lot...who are Alawi's/Alawaites?
Clarke Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 I'm sure the padosis will eagerly support creation of a new state to safeguard the rights of hazaras. That conclusion has no factual basis. If Pakistan were part of India it's very possible that the Muslims there would have become secular and liberal like the vast majority of Indian Muslims are. In fact Frontier Gandhi was leading a majority of such group in what today is NWFP and very radicalized where he is looked down upon as a traitor. That's possible only if the Muslim league never had any intentions of partition. Once the poisonous seeds are sown in our part of the world, they continue to create the poisonous weeds for some time. http://tribune.com.pk/story/508856/karachi-literature-festival-are-we-secular-enough/ Ye achha hai :haha: Was Rushdie invited to the fest :P
panther Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 Whoaa fascinating. Thanks a lot for for the reply. I could've probably googled it, but I guess if ur on a forum why not pose the question? One more question, since they are in the news a lot...who are Alawi's/Alawaites? Alawites are a branch of shia islam based mainly in syria. They make the news a lot because Basher-al-asad is an alawite shia and the alawite shia control syria despite being a minority.
The Outsider Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 :facepalm: How many Hindu's you have seen on ICF who believe in caste system in .So by your logic there should be no caste based discrimination in India Point is Online forums give you some of worst examples .Infact I believe real world of India is exactly opposite what you see on forums. ICF is a perfect sample to make that assertion. Having said that, I do agree that Indian muslims are more open and less fundoo than their counterparts in some of the other countries. I think you are making a strawman argument here, since i do not see any correlation with representation in ICF having any basis to representation in India. There could be host of social as well as preference reasons for having a skewed demographic here ( in terms of fundoo vs non-fundoo perspective), not to mention, the entire membership of ICF does not qualify for any sort of sample space for India and Indians by any practical measure. If you disagree, i would urge you to point out any example, outside of fuzzy logic acadeima involving marketing & human psychological assertions ( some of which i do not agree with BTW) that equates a sample size of 1 in 500,000 to be actually correlative. I undestand that you are a man of science and since you have made scientific demands of me in the past,perhaps you would like to point out any practice in pure sciences/engineering that qualifies 1 in 500,000 to be an effective control test barometer for correlations ?? A ridiculous post on so many different levels:hysterical: Not sure what gave you guys the idea that I meant it as some scientific poll, but if seedhi's assertion of smilies is correct India should have lots of radicalized and fundoo Muslims. Now if I had said I have never met one in real life despite living in a city with one of the largest Muslim populations you would dismiss it as hearsay, so I asked seedhi to point out a few Indian Muslims with which we share a common acquaintance and he considers radicalized and fundoo. And the only such common ground for us is ICF, an imperfect scientific lab. As a counter example I presented him with a list of radicalized and fundoo Hindus on ICF to establish the baseline of vitriol against the other community we are talking about.
The Outsider Posted February 19, 2013 Posted February 19, 2013 That's possible only if the Muslim league never had any intentions of partition. Once the poisonous seeds are sown in our part of the world, they continue to create the poisonous weeds for some time. Yeah, agree on that. After 1940 violence and partition were the only options. However things could have turned out very different in the absence of a demand for a separate Muslim state by the Muslim league. It's naive to assume that India would have trained Jihadis to take on the Soviet Union's foray into Afghanistan with CIA help for starters or even to assume that the Soviet Union would even have invaded Afghanistan or even that the present boundaries of Afghanistan would have been the same given India's and Frontier Gandhi's support for a separate Pukhtoon state. Radicalization and terrorism in Pakistan is a product of circumstances and not geography.
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