What is MS Dhoni's biggest achievement as captain?

[saneindian]

Not main' date=' I think it's pretty clear that Dhoni is the only reason India won the World Cup.[/quote'] Look at this way, if there was no Dhoni, Srini wouldn't have bought the WC for us.. *runs away*

[The Outsider]

Hmm? Is this the match you are talking about? http://www.espncricinfo.com/england-v-india-2011/engine/match/474473.html If yes, then the lunch was taken on the 26th over and England were 68/2 with Strauss and KP batting.

No, talking about the 2nd innings of the Lords test.

Again, he is not a tail ender by any means on those conditions. England literally had no tail enders in that match apart from Anderson. Broad hit 10 runs of 7 balls of Harbhajjan and his wicket was picked by Harbhajjan as well. Wonder how you could blame that move which got us a wicket of that partnership between Broad and Swann & costed us only 10 runs (as far Broad's innings was concerned). Wicket of Bell costed us 32 runs and the rest were scored by Morgan who was going at a good pace post lunch. Even though there was a collapse after that 180 lead, they would have managed 50-80 runs with that line up and we were bowled out under 160. So again, it doesn't make any difference at the end of it.

Sorry, but cricket does not work like that. If we were bowled out for 160 chasing 450 does not mean we would have been bowled out for 160 chasing 300. The entire dynamics of the game can change based on these situations.

That goes the other way as well. When you claim on every thread that Dhoni is the sole reason to all these oversees debacles then its pretty obvious people will counter it with our poor batting & bowling oversees.

Please give me one quote, just one quote where I've said Dhoni is the sole reason for the overseas debacles. In fact even in this thread it's pretty clear that is not the case because I identified 3 tests out of 8 in which I feel Dhoni's captaincy could have changed the result. Isn't it obvious that I am laying the blame on the rest of the team as well? Wasn't I clamoring last year for Dravid, Laxman, and Tendulkar to be shown the door? Why do you think I was doing that? Because I feel we lost overseas tests solely due to Dhoni?

When our bowlers give away over 5 per over in a match and you are supposed to have 1-2 fielders outside the circle with a bunch of slips and few close in fielders then its utter stupidity. Bad bowling forces you to change fields. Poor batting and bowling does come in the radar when you argue about captaincy.

I have given examples in this and other threads where crap and defensive fielding and tactics were used even when the opposition was under pressure and the bowling was good. If you choose to ignore them and continue to throw red herrings, please go ahead.

[DarthSimian]

In hindsight, everything works. Most of the argument here are based on hindsight views based on the instinctive decisions that Dhoni takes. His moves are high risk, high reward. Which is why he has been able to achieve so much in his captaincy. Lets take an example. Most of the people arguing here would never have taken Vijay, Jadeja or Dhawan in the Playing X1, dismissing them as always. Yet, they have been the ones instrumental in the Aussie 4-0 whitewash. Would that make Dhoni's the "expert" decision or the ones arguing here?

[ravishingravi]

In hindsight, everything works. Most of the argument here are based on hindsight views based on the instinctive decisions that Dhoni takes. His moves are high risk, high reward. Which is why he has been able to achieve so much in his captaincy. Lets take an example. Most of the people arguing here would have taken Vijay, Jadeja or Dhawan in the Playing X1, dismissing them as always. Yet, they have been the ones instrumental in the Aussie 4-0 whitewash. Would that make Dhoni's the "expert" decision or the ones arguing here?

India had to be battered home and away unlike ever before and the seniors failing for more than a year had to be thrown out. So, his hands was forced by the defeat and humiliation of his team and his inability to get the right people earlier.

[Sidhoni]

Oh how about restricting Aussies to 260 on a flat pitch in QF and defending 260 in Mohali which was again a flat beauty? You make it sound like India was gonna win the World cup with/without Dhoni's captaincy.

Pretty much.

[diga]

Its like Ricky Ponting's captaincy.. even though he has the most wins in tests/odi's , 2 world cups steve waugh/mark taylor are rated higher.

[Crookbond]

Its like Ricky Ponting's captaincy.. even though he has the most wins in tests/odi's ' date=' 2 world cups steve waugh/mark taylor are rated higher.[/quote'] Ponting is not rated "the worst" either.

[diga]

Ponting is not rated "the worst" either.

Who is saying MSD is the 'worst'?

[Sidhoni]

Who is saying MSD is the 'worst'?

Most ICFers

[SLICKR392]

Sorry, but cricket does not work like that. If we were bowled out for 160 chasing 450 does not mean we would have been bowled out for 160 chasing 300. The entire dynamics of the game can change based on these situations.

300? We couldn't chase 280-290 odds runs in Australia and we had much worse side in England.

Please give me one quote' date=' just one quote where I've said Dhoni is the sole reason for the overseas debacles. In fact even in this thread it's pretty clear that is not the case because I identified 3 tests out of 8 in which I feel Dhoni's captaincy could have changed the result. Isn't it obvious that I am laying the blame on the rest of the team as well? Wasn't I clamoring last year for Dravid, Laxman, and Tendulkar to be shown the door? Why do you think I was doing that? Because I feel we lost overseas tests solely due to Dhoni?[/quote'] Because our bowling and batting out there needed more bashing than his captaincy. And I agree with most of your posts. Losing 8 series away and losing a series at home and still letting him lead the side is an absolute blunder. No country would ever do that. I would have sacked him blind folder after the Aus tour.

[diga]

Who is saying MSD is the 'worst'?

Most ICFers

He is not the 'best' either as the other ICFers are claiming to be

[Laaloo]

Most ICFers

Name the ICFers

[Raghav_12]

Name the ICFers

would there be some action against them?

[philcric]

In hindsight' date=' everything works. Most of the argument here are based on hindsight views based on the instinctive decisions that Dhoni takes. [b']His moves are high risk, high reward. Which is why he has been able to achieve so much in his captaincy. Lets take an example. Most of the people arguing here would never have taken Vijay, Jadeja or Dhawan in the Playing X1, dismissing them as always. Yet, they have been the ones instrumental in the Aussie 4-0 whitewash. Would that make Dhoni's the "expert" decision or the ones arguing here?

Haha. Good one. :giggle: I'd give him credit for Jadeja's selection (irrespective of his performance). Why? Shows the mindset that you are thinking how to get 20 wickets. His was a reasonably pro-active selection as he did not just replace (an out of form) someone by default who was doing a similar job. Sehwag and Gambhir have been so terrible for years even their families would be embarrassed to pick them in the team. Vijay and Dhawan selections are mere happenstance.

[vayuu1]

What ever he achieve ,but 8-0 whitewash is some thing no body will ever forget.

[Texan]

would there be some action against them?

They will all be asked to write "CSK rocks" 10 times :nervous: Mind it :orderorder:

[Texan]

What ever he achieve ' date='but 8-0 whitewash is some thing no body will ever forget.[/quote'] Somebody put it very aptly. His highs are very high and his lows are very low. Nothing in between. Dhoni seems to be a man of extremes.

[Texan]

Most of the people arguing here would never have taken Vijay' date=' Jadeja or Dhawan in the Playing X1, dismissing them as always. [/quote'] You cannot give him credit for picking Dhawan. The selectors had to drop Sehwag from the team so that Dhawan could get a chance. Dhoni had no option. Vijay too was not much of an option, he was the only other opener available. Jadeja is a good selection. I always wanted Jadeja in the test team and Dhoni picked him right away.

[Number]

What ever he achieve ' date='but [b']8-0 whitewash is some thing no body will ever forget.

Ain't they already forgotten ? Anyway if he wins a test series in England or Aus or SA( though looks impossible) I'll forget 8-0.

[ravishingravi]

Ain't they already forgotten ? Anyway if he wins a test series in England or Aus or SA( though looks impossible) I'll forget 8-0.

I don't think Dhoni even aims that high. Practical as he is, I wont be surprised if he says that given our "young" team we should be happy if we can win one or two sessions.