Do India Need To Replace Dhawan in the T20 Format?

[Trichromatic]

What has he done in T20s at any level to be opener of our team? Our selectors just can't distinguish formats, it seems. At least T20s and ODI slots should remain open for all players.

Edited January 27, 2016 by Vibhash

[Gunner]

Pandey / Shreyas need to replace the mucchad

[sourab10forever]

Will go with Rahane. Maybe try Pandey & Iyer against SL but Rahane is the man.Pandey/Iyer can act as back-up for the WT20.

Having Rahane opening will set up the perfect combination for us down the order.You don't want to be playing without Rahane. Best spot for him in T20's looks to be opening.Opened well during Bangalesh T20WC and also for Rajasthan.

But don't think dhawan will be droped.he will score a OK-ish innings just when the selectors want to drop him and then will continue destroying Indias chances for another 2-3 series.

[India-KXIP fan]

Rahane had bad ODI average and was supposed to fail.

Kohli had bad average in Aus ODI's and was supposed to fail.

 

Lmao just lmao. Stop looking at averages and look at potential. No point getting started on Rohit early in career. I always lol when people come up with a long list of stats and then can't work out how a guy has not performed to their expectations.

If such people were selectors Manoj Tiwary, Badrinath the 60 averaging players from Ranji would be playing for India and not Vijay, Dhawan, Mishra etc. 

He hasn't played enough T20's. He has been good in IPL. And he was good in warm up T20 earlier. Most importantly with a few risks coming off he has the ability to do well in T20's. Should get all 3 games.

Edited January 27, 2016 by India-KXIP fan

[India-KXIP fan]

Are you talking about the highest Indian scorer of IPL 2015?

This.

Statsguru's when will they learn.

[rkt.india]

Rahane had bad ODI average and was supposed to fail.

Kohli had bad average in Aus ODI's and was supposed to fail.

 

Lmao just lmao. Stop looking at averages and look at potential. No point getting started on Rohit early in career. I always lol when people come up with a long list of stats and then can't work out how a guy has not performed to their expectations.

If such people were selectors Manoj Tiwary, Badrinath the 60 averaging players from Ranji would be playing for India and not Vijay, Dhawan, Mishra etc. 

He hasn't played enough T20's. He has been good in IPL. And he was good in warm up T20 earlier. Most importantly with a few risks coming off he has the ability to do well in T20's. Should get all 3 games.

Dhawan hasn't been good in IPL apart from one season when he was in purple patch. Rahane also might have been good in IPL but his SR is substandard.

[rkt.india]

This.

Statsguru's when will they learn.

Can you check the SR please? 130 should be minimum SR for T20.

[India-KXIP fan]

Dhawan hasn't been good in IPL apart from one season when he was in purple patch. Rahane also might have been good in IPL but his SR is substandard.

Fair point if true. I can't remember go on...

[India-KXIP fan]

Can you check the SR please? 130 should be minimum SR for T20.

What was it?

Firstly 115-120 is good for an opener if he is consistent and has a fast player at the other end (Rohit takes risks early unlike ODI's). What more can you want than a consistent performer going at a good rate while other guy is fast and wickets are not lost? He should be in squad as a reserve.

Secondly he is improving. That is what stats don't show. Wouldn't statistics have suggested Rahane would struggle batting at 4? Did he not used to struggle to rotate strike? Well guess what, he probably took more singles than Kohli, Rohit (as a ratio to balls played) in his knocks this last ODI series. He is even playing alot better in death overs without powerhitting ability (that 87, if others had matched his rate at the end would have been good result).

Stats don't show rate of improvement. He is a fast improving cricketer checking off weaknesses one by one. He is very consistent recently in T20's. Good stability, solid opening partnership sets the platform.

Edited January 28, 2016 by India-KXIP fan

[India-KXIP fan]

Hang on a minute. Where is all this Rahane disliking coming from?

IPL is obviously the best way to select a WT20 team when it's in India. Even Rahane's numbers support him. 13 innings 540 runs at an SR of 130 with 13 sixes.

[rkt.india]

116 SR for an opener is abysmal. You have 6 overs of pp to make use of.

[rkt.india]

Hang on a minute. Where is all this Rahane disliking coming from?

IPL is obviously the best way to select a WT20 team when it's in India. Even Rahane's numbers support him. 13 innings 540 runs at an SR of 130 with 13 sixes.

It's nothing disliking. He just doesn't have the big shots.

His SR in international t20 is 116. Overall in t20 is 117.

[express bowling]

Rahane had bad ODI average and was supposed to fail.

Kohli had bad average in Aus ODI's and was supposed to fail.

 

Lmao just lmao. Stop looking at averages and look at potential. No point getting started on Rohit early in career. I always lol when people come up with a long list of stats and then can't work out how a guy has not performed to their expectations.

If such people were selectors Manoj Tiwary, Badrinath the 60 averaging players from Ranji would be playing for India and not Vijay, Dhawan, Mishra etc. 

He hasn't played enough T20's. He has been good in IPL. And he was good in warm up T20 earlier. Most importantly with a few risks coming off he has the ability to do well in T20's. Should get all 3 games.

I agree about a lot of what you say but not all of it . First and foremost the potential and ability of a player should be checked.

In case of a batsman, the ability to play pace, bounce, seam, swing, stroke-making ability, ability to play in tough situations, etc.

In case of a pacer...pace, bounce, accuracy, wicket-taking ability, movement, height, ability to bowl good bouncers, yorkers, slower deliveries etc.

For spinners ..spinning ability, bounce, accuracy, wicket taking ability, flippers, " doosra including googlies for wrist spinners " etc.

Most importantly...temperament to play in international matches under pressure.

Only these types of players should be chosen for international matches...not every domestic bully.

Stats come in after we choose a player based on potential and ability. If there are more than one player  for the same slot  .....or a player is under-performing for a long time despite having potential  ..... or a player with potential failing for some time but is making a turnaround in recent times but very few people seem to understand, ......or a player has great potential but  poor domestic stats before debut. 

 

Edited January 28, 2016 by express bowling

[express bowling]

 

Secondly he is improving. That is what stats don't show. Wouldn't statistics have suggested Rahane would struggle batting at 4? Did he not used to struggle to rotate strike? Well guess what, he probably took more singles than Kohli, Rohit (as a ratio to balls played) in his knocks this last ODI series. He is even playing alot better in death overs without powerhitting ability (that 87, if others had matched his rate at the end would have been good result).

Stats don't show rate of improvement. He is a fast improving cricketer checking off weaknesses one by one. He is very consistent recently in T20's. Good stability, solid opening partnership sets the platform.

Recent improvement can be displayed by recent stats...like Rahane has Average of 48.5 and SR of 96 in his last 2 ODI series.

[express bowling]

SR of our top batsmen in both overall T20s ( which includes IPL and Internationals ) and just T20Is

Raina       140    and  133

Rohit        131   and  129

Yuvraj      132   and   144

Kohli        129   and   134

Dhoni       135  and   117

Dhawan   119   and  100 

Rahane    117  and   116

( overall T20s listed first )

Every batsman in this list has played more than 120 games of T20s overall and so, the sample size is not small

 

While stats are not be all and end all...the question arises..... why much lower SR for Dhawan and Rahane who have played 130 and 122 games respectively  ?

There are six PP overs and we cannot afford slow openers.

 

 

[rkt.india]

SR of our top batsmen in both overall T20s ( which includes IPL and Internationals ) and just T20Is

Raina       140    and  133

Rohit        131   and  129

Yuvraj      132   and   144

Kohli        129   and   134

Dhoni       135  and   117

Dhawan   119   and  100 

Rahane    117  and   116

( overall T20s listed first )

Every batsman in this list has played more than 120 games of T20s overall and so, the sample size is not small

 

While stats are not be all and end all...the question arises..... why much lower SR for Dhawan and Rahane who have played 130 and 122 games respectively  ?

There are six PP overs and we cannot afford slow openers.

 

 

yes. we do not have any one 150 plus SR. so we need guys who can all bat at an SR at least 125-130 or even more if not 150.

[express bowling]

yes. we do not have any one 150 plus SR. so we need guys who can all bat at an SR at least 125-130 or even more if not 150.

Yes, we need both openers with atleast 130 SR and one or two 150 SR middle order hitters.

[India-KXIP fan]

SR of our top batsmen in both overall T20s ( which includes IPL and Internationals ) and just T20Is

Raina       140    and  133

Rohit        131   and  129

Yuvraj      132   and   144

Kohli        129   and   134

Dhoni       135  and   117

Dhawan   119   and  100 

Rahane    117  and   116

( overall T20s listed first )

Every batsman in this list has played more than 120 games of T20s overall and so, the sample size is not small

 

While stats are not be all and end all...the question arises..... why much lower SR for Dhawan and Rahane who have played 130 and 122 games respectively  ?

There are six PP overs and we cannot afford slow openers.

 

 

Each to his own but that is not how I would select my team. Especially if you look at what Rahane did in the most recent IPL even numbers wise. I genuinely believe Rahane would be an excellent selection and we would not be with Dhawan. It would be either Rahane or Dhawan with Rohit. Consistency at a 130 strike rate is what he offered in IPL 2015. Even though I feel one opener can have 120 if he is consistent and other partner is fast.

With this approach going into too much numbers Aus would have left out Steve Smith in Tests and ODI's before his form picked up. I feel Rahane is one player who has the ability to transform like him. He already improved in T20's in IPL 2015. He already improved strike rotation in ODI's. What's the point of including statistics from careers beginning if that player is improving at an exceptional rate to influence selection. And in that case like you said recent stats show why he should be picked. But just watching him improve his ability to easily rotate strike and take a few risks like charging a fast bowler to go with his timing show he has potential to open T20 innings.

And I would predict Steve Smith to adapt and do well in T20's. I think it is going to happen. But statistics will suggest it won't and he would never be picked. Same goes for Dhawan. Let's see how that goes...

 

Edited January 28, 2016 by India-KXIP fan

[India-KXIP fan]

There's other examples of getting it wrong by going into too many numbers. Murali Vijay is one. He had a highest score of 45 in 5 overseas tests. Not done much in A tours. Statistics would suggest he was a FTB and should not be taken on SA tour. And maybe for the old Vijay it was true. Statistics suggested his recent hundred at the time vs Aus was just bullying on patta. He also struggled in all ODI's and T20's played overseas til then.

But players improve. Good players can be completly transformed. Rahane is checking off weaknesses one by one. Steve Smith transformed and so on...

And we all know what Vijay did in that SA tour. Had people looking so much into statistics been picking him they would probably had left him out. Whereas those watching him leave the ball decisively vs Aus and dropping wrists nicely for short balls would have felt hmmm this guy can do it.

Seeing Rahane it feels like he can be in control vs the best bowlers in the world. He is now very busy and easily rotating strike. And he can be the highly consistent anchor others can hit around. And he proved that he can play quite fast in IPL 2015 as well. He has checked off so many weaknesses already. Proven he can adapt and improve. No reason not to pick him.

 

Edited January 28, 2016 by India-KXIP fan

[India-KXIP fan]

To top off the above example he had had a poor Ranji season before test selection if I recall correctly and his overall career average was lower than a few openers in domestic FC....so there you go