Ultimate_Game Posted March 27, 2016 Author Posted March 27, 2016 I said that on an overtly spinning track, the side batting first has an advantage .... not that which team (Ind or WI) has a better chance on a particular track. Per your theory, Ind would have won vs NZ too as Ind bats and bowl spin better And I said I want a spin friendly track where hitting boundaries is not that easy. Again, you keep on bringing just one match - NZ - which was more an aberration than a rule. For the last time, if you think India has a better chance of beating WI on a flattish track, be my guest. My opinion is a spin friendly track gives us the best chance. I'm sure if you have your way India will never play another match on a turning track because "India lost to NZ" once.
zen Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) And I said I want a spin friendly track where hitting boundaries is not that easy. Again, you keep on bringing just one match - NZ - which was more an aberration than a rule. For the last time, if you think India has a better chance of beating WI on a flattish track, be my guest. My opinion is a spin friendly track gives us the best chance. I'm sure if you have your way India will never play another match on a turning track because "India lost to NZ" once.You are entitled to your opinion .... I only cleared my position. Once again:I don't worry about tracks. I rather prefer to play the best team as per the conditions I like sporting tracks in LOIs, which support both good batting and bowling On overtly spinning tracks such as square turners, side batting 1st has an unfair advantage so would not prefer it .... So if Ind is batting 2nd, it has chances of losing vs Afg too even though in theory it is better equipped to handle those conditions I have not said that I prefer a flat surface as it can take bowling out of equation at times. But I would prefer that to a rank turner in LOIs Edited March 27, 2016 by rett express bowling 1
zen Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 In 2012, SL discovered too what happens if it does not prepare sporting pitches: Link - Does not matter in theory which team can do well on overt turners. Side batting first usually has the advantage: ICC World Twenty20 - FinalSri Lanka v West IndiesWest Indies won by 36 runsT20I no. 289 | 2012/13 seasonPlayed at R Premadasa Stadium, Colombo7 October 2012 - night match (20-over match) West Indies innings (20 overs maximum)RMB4s6sSRJ Charlesc Kulasekara b Mathews035000.00CH Gaylelbw b BAW Mendis326160018.75MN Samuelsc BMAJ Mendis b Dananjaya78705636139.28DJ Bravolbw b BAW Mendis19291901100.00KA Pollardc Dananjaya b BAW Mendis2640050.00AD Russelllbw b BAW Mendis021000.00 DJG Sammy*not out26231530173.33 D Ramdin†not out413400100.00 Extras(lb 2, w 3)5 Total(6 wickets; 20 overs; 88 mins)137(6.85 runs per over)Did not batSP Narine, R Rampaul, S BadreeFall of wickets 1-0 (Charles, 0.5 ov), 2-14 (Gayle, 5.5 ov), 3-73 (Bravo, 13.6 ov), 4-87 (Pollard, 15.2 ov), 5-87 (Russell, 15.3 ov),6-108 (Samuels, 17.1 ov) BowlingOMRWEcon0s4s6s AD Mathews411112.751600(1w) KMDN Kulasekara302207.33930(1w) SL Malinga4054013.50225 BAW Mendis401243.001400(1w)A Dananjaya301615.33801 BMAJ Mendis2020010.00211 Sri Lanka innings (target: 138 runs from 20 overs)RMB4s6sSRDPMD Jayawardene*c Sammy b Narine3352362091.66TM Dilshanb Rampaul033000.00KC Sangakkara†c Pollard b Badree2233262084.61AD Mathewsb Sammy1550020.00BMAJ Mendisrun out (Bravo/Narine)310300100.00NLTC Pererarun out (†Ramdin)3650060.00HDRL Thirimannec Charles b Sammy4970057.14KMDN Kulasekarac Badree b Narine26161331200.00SL Malingac Bravo b Narine522130038.46BAW Mendisc Bravo b Samuels1520050.00 A Dananjayanot out03000- Extras(lb 2, nb 1)3 Total(all out; 18.4 overs; 84 mins)101(5.41 runs per over)Fall of wickets 1-6 (Dilshan, 1.1 ov), 2-48 (Sangakkara, 9.3 ov), 3-51 (Mathews, 10.4 ov), 4-60 (Jayawardene, 12.1 ov), 5-61 (BMAJ Mendis, 12.3 ov), 6-64 (Perera, 13.1 ov), 7-69 (Thirimanne, 14.3 ov), 8-96 (Kulasekara, 16.3 ov), 9-100 (BAW Mendis, 17.5 ov), 10-101 (Malinga, 18.4 ov) BowlingOMRWEcon0s4s6s S Badree402416.001120 R Rampaul3031110.33641(1nb)MN Samuels401513.751100 CH Gayle201407.00210 SP Narine3.40932.451400 DJG Sammy20623.00700
Ultimate_Game Posted March 27, 2016 Author Posted March 27, 2016 In 2012, SL discovered too what happens if it does not prepare sporting pitches: Link - Does not matter in theory which team can do well on overt turners. Side batting first usually has the advantage: ICC World Twenty20 - FinalSri Lanka v West IndiesWest Indies won by 36 runsT20I no. 289 | 2012/13 seasonPlayed at R Premadasa Stadium, Colombo7 October 2012 - night match (20-over match) West Indies innings (20 overs maximum)RMB4s6sSRJ Charlesc Kulasekara b Mathews035000.00CH Gaylelbw b BAW Mendis326160018.75MN Samuelsc BMAJ Mendis b Dananjaya78705636139.28DJ Bravolbw b BAW Mendis19291901100.00KA Pollardc Dananjaya b BAW Mendis2640050.00AD Russelllbw b BAW Mendis021000.00 DJG Sammy*not out26231530173.33 D Ramdin†not out413400100.00 Extras(lb 2, w 3)5 Total(6 wickets; 20 overs; 88 mins)137(6.85 runs per over)Did not batSP Narine, R Rampaul, S BadreeFall of wickets 1-0 (Charles, 0.5 ov), 2-14 (Gayle, 5.5 ov), 3-73 (Bravo, 13.6 ov), 4-87 (Pollard, 15.2 ov), 5-87 (Russell, 15.3 ov),6-108 (Samuels, 17.1 ov) BowlingOMRWEcon0s4s6s AD Mathews411112.751600(1w) KMDN Kulasekara302207.33930(1w) SL Malinga4054013.50225 BAW Mendis401243.001400(1w)A Dananjaya301615.33801 BMAJ Mendis2020010.00211 Sri Lanka innings (target: 138 runs from 20 overs)RMB4s6sSRDPMD Jayawardene*c Sammy b Narine3352362091.66TM Dilshanb Rampaul033000.00KC Sangakkara†c Pollard b Badree2233262084.61AD Mathewsb Sammy1550020.00BMAJ Mendisrun out (Bravo/Narine)310300100.00NLTC Pererarun out (†Ramdin)3650060.00HDRL Thirimannec Charles b Sammy4970057.14KMDN Kulasekarac Badree b Narine26161331200.00SL Malingac Bravo b Narine522130038.46BAW Mendisc Bravo b Samuels1520050.00 A Dananjayanot out03000- Extras(lb 2, nb 1)3 Total(all out; 18.4 overs; 84 mins)101(5.41 runs per over)Fall of wickets 1-6 (Dilshan, 1.1 ov), 2-48 (Sangakkara, 9.3 ov), 3-51 (Mathews, 10.4 ov), 4-60 (Jayawardene, 12.1 ov), 5-61 (BMAJ Mendis, 12.3 ov), 6-64 (Perera, 13.1 ov), 7-69 (Thirimanne, 14.3 ov), 8-96 (Kulasekara, 16.3 ov), 9-100 (BAW Mendis, 17.5 ov), 10-101 (Malinga, 18.4 ov) BowlingOMRWEcon0s4s6s S Badree402416.001120 R Rampaul3031110.33641(1nb)MN Samuels401513.751100 CH Gayle201407.00210 SP Narine3.40932.451400 DJG Sammy20623.00700 It took a very very special knock from Samuels to get the job done. In fact it's the best knock played in WT20 along with Hussey's knock in 2010 and Kohli's innings today. You can't really do much if someone plays the innings of their life. In fact I can turn around and show you numerous scorecards where Gayle or Bravo or Russell or Sammy played a blinder and beat their opponent on a flattish/sporting track.
zen Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 It took a very very special knock from Samuels to get the job done. In fact it's the best knock played in WT20 along with Hussey's knock in 2010 and Kohli's innings today. You can't really do much if someone plays the innings of their life. In fact I can turn around and show you numerous scorecards where Gayle or Bravo or Russell or Sammy played a blinder and beat their opponent on a flattish/sporting track.True, but then there would be matching examples of Ind batsmen going the same Please give me an example of when Ind won on a rank turner batting 2nd in a major tourney in India?
Ultimate_Game Posted March 27, 2016 Author Posted March 27, 2016 True, but then there would be matching examples of Ind batsmen going the same Please give me an example of when Ind won on a rank turner batting 2nd in a major tourney in India? I can give you the most relevant example of Ind-WI WT20 match in 2014...http://www.espncricinfo.com/world-t20/engine/current/match/682929.htmlThe WI players couldn't do much against Indian spinners and were comfortably beaten. WI's match against Afghanistan today has shown they haven't improved much on sluggish surfaces. If you still think India doesn't have a better chance of beating WI on a spin friendly track, so be it. Maybe you can have a poll where you can ask majority what they feel would give India a better chance to beat WI...a) Spin friendly trackb) Flattish track
zen Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) I can give you the most relevant example of Ind-WI WT20 match in 2014...http://www.espncricinfo.com/world-t20/engine/current/match/682929.htmlThe WI players couldn't do much against Indian spinners and were comfortably beaten. WI's match against Afghanistan today has shown they haven't improved much on sluggish surfaces. If you still think India doesn't have a better chance of beating WI on a spin friendly track, so be it. Maybe you can have a poll where you can ask majority what they feel would give India a better chance to beat WI...a) Spin friendly trackb) Flattish track a) Lol so you don't have an example of what I asked! Thank you .... anyways, in that game: BowlingOMRWEcon0s4s6s B Kumar30301.001600(1w) Mohammed Shami302709.001131(5w)R Ashwin402416.001030(1w)A Mishra401824.501301(1w) SK Raina20804.00600(2w)RA Jadeja4048312.001034(1nb, 2w)Look at the figures for Bhuvi and compare them with Jadeja and Ashwin's. A good leg spinner does well irrespective of most surfaces .... So how much did it support spin? b) Also spinners doing well and the surface being a rank turners are two different things .... Spinners can do well on sporting wkts tooc) If WI batsmen couldn't do much then, Ind's batting hasn't done much either in this competition .... and in fact lost vs NZ Again, I have not said on what surface Ind will do well. Just that the side batting first has an advantage on rank turners. Since I am not sure if Ind would be batting first, I would prefer a track that gives Ind a better chance EVEN WHEN it is chasing (and with Kohli's form, it is a strength) Edited March 27, 2016 by rett
cowboysfan Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 Windies have no shot here irrespective of the pitch..kiwis are in for some revenge in the final.
adi B Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 How can you change the nature of the wankhede wkt overnight? It cant be done just like it wasn't in case of mohali .It'll be a flat wkt as it has always been and we have to outbat and outsmart windies ,probably have to beat them in their own game,simple!!
bulbul Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 How can you change the nature of the wankhede wkt overnight? It cant be done just like it wasn't in case of mohali .It'll be a flat wkt as it has always been and we have to outbat and outsmart windies ,probably have to beat them in their own game,simple!!Hire Lahori logicians
Forever Indian Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 No matter what the pitch, India is going to rout WI...Ashwin will take care of Gayle and Rozilla & Kohli will show who the boss is to the so called allrounder bowlers... WC2011INDIA 1
Ultimate_Game Posted March 28, 2016 Author Posted March 28, 2016 5 hours ago, adi B said: How can you change the nature of the wankhede wkt overnight? It cant be done just like it wasn't in case of mohali . It'll be a flat wkt as it has always been and we have to outbat and outsmart windies ,probably have to beat them in their own game,simple!! Back in my school days we had a cricket camp during summer vacation and occasionally the school got a few people to come over to talk to us for an hour or so. Once they got a groundsman/curator coz they probably couldn't find any ex-cricketers. But that guy was the best of all the folks that were invited over the duration of the camp. He basically explained the process of preparing the pitch and how they make it seam friendly or spin friendly. He said that making a spin friendly pitch was about shaving off the grass and sweeping the pitch (similar to sweeping with a broom) which ages the surface artificially. He explained how depending on the preference of the team, he would sweep the pitch an extra number of times to fast-track what usually happens when you play cricket on the pitch. Don't really know if it's as simple as he made it sound as I've never really done it myself but he did say that you can create any sort of pitch you want given the direction from the team/board. Nova 1
adi B Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 12 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said: Back in my school days we had a cricket camp during summer vacation and occasionally the school got a few people to come over to talk to us for an hour or so. Once they got a groundsman/curator coz they probably couldn't find any ex-cricketers. But that guy was the best of all the folks that were invited over the duration of the camp. He basically explained the process of preparing the pitch and how they make it seam friendly or spin friendly. He said that making a spin friendly pitch was about shaving off the grass and sweeping the pitch (similar to sweeping with a broom) which ages the surface artificially. He explained how depending on the preference of the team, he would sweep the pitch an extra number of times to fast-track what usually happens when you play cricket on the pitch. Don't really know if it's as simple as he made it sound as I've never really done it myself but he did say that you can create any sort of pitch you want given the direction from the team/board. That guy was talking in 'relative' terms probably,I mean it won't change the nature of the pitch drastically,just kaam chalao for a game.the mumbai pitch during this time of the year is prepared flat and bare without an iota of graas on it due to the arrival of ipl season,it uses hard clay I think whose nature aint changing that much and it doesn't break much under heat of the sun. Its most likely gonna remain a flat placid wkt
Ultimate_Game Posted March 28, 2016 Author Posted March 28, 2016 Just now, adi B said: That guy was talking in 'relative' terms probably,I mean it won't change the nature of the pitch drastically,just kaam chalao for a game.the mumbai pitch during this time of the year is prepared flat and bare without an iota of graas on it due to the arrival of ipl season,it uses hard clay I think whose nature aint changing that much and it doesn't break much under heat of the sun. Its most likely gonna remain a flat placid wkt Yup it was in relative terms. You can't turn Mumbai wkt into a Nagpur one but what you can do is maybe make it a Day 4 Mumbai pitch instead of Day 1 Mumbai pitch, i.e. fast track the deterioration of the pitch.
Nash Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 don't make a pitch turning like a bitch. Make a sporting pitch please.
horizonspeaks Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 Kolkata pitch won't be a turner. ICC is taking steps already - http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/sports/icc-world-t20-2016/top-stories/World-T20-ICC-identifies-fresh-pitch-for-final/articleshow/51609539.cms
bowl_out Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 7 minutes ago, Viper said: Does he go check WC 2015 pitches as well ? Double standards much Green tracks are ok but not Turners To be fair, WC 2015 had really flat pitches.. Don't remember one match that had a green wicket... Two 200+ individual scores, some really high scoring matches... diehardpacer 1
bowl_out Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 12 minutes ago, Viper said: So its a batsmen game ha ? Nothing for bowlers This T20 has bit of both which is way better than BATSMENS GAME in 2015 WC and people wonder why there aren't enough bowlers in the country.. Bowlers never get same amount of respect Batsmens gets.. Never said that.. You referred to WC 2015 pitches as green tracks, which I refuted.. Simple as that. diehardpacer 1
horizonspeaks Posted March 30, 2016 Posted March 30, 2016 28 minutes ago, Viper said: Does he go check WC 2015 pitches as well ? Double standards much Green tracks are ok but not Turners Yes he does. You can read the cricinfo match preview of India-Aus Semi final in 2015.
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