Iyer and Dube needs to be given Promotion in 1-1 games at 3 in upcoming t20 series

[Ankit_sharma03]

Credit where its due dube's promotion was a good move so we shud continue doing this in upcoming t20 series. Kohli can play at 3 in one game but in other 2 give dube n iyer promotion. Players develop with confidence n confidence comes with big score which can only happen when u bat up the order. Pant on most days get promotion ahead of Iyer in t20 but iyer also needs to be given timely promotion so his confidence stays up. When dhoni came chappell n dravid use to give him regular promotion which helped him in long term, even promotion helped guys like kohli, raina, irfan. This will help kohli also to have plan-B for his own game at no.4 which shud be there on some occasions. Kohli batting at 3 in all games will not help the team much .

This team prime goal shud be to give youngsters as much exposure before WC

[sandeep]

Doobi needs to be discarded until he improves around 200%.

[Ankit_sharma03]

2 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Doobi needs to be discarded until he improves around 200%.

doobi ?

 

[putrevus]

No, they don't have do it.They already did that with Dube, it has proved nothing.They have to replicate crunch match situation first .Can Dubey or Iyer replicate what Sammy did or Russell does for WI.

 

Scoring 200 to 250 plus SR in atleast in one match is primary goal then worry about giving them longer innings.

[Ankit_sharma03]

13 minutes ago, putrevus said:

No, they don't have do it.They already did that with Dube, it has proved nothing.They have to replicate crunch match situation first .Can Dubey or Iyer replicate what Sammy did or Russell does for WI.

 

Scoring 200 to 250 plus SR in atleast in one match is primary goal then worry about giving them longer innings.

And russell gets promotion for his franchise and his impact have been phenomenal and russell was promoted ahead of ramdin n bravo in t20 Wc 2016

 

Also sammy is a poor xample....he kept his place due to captaincy only

 

Iyer is not a similar batsman to those 2, hardik n dube fall in that category.

 

If crunch match situation has to be replicate that top 3 has to get out cheaply most days like on crunch days . 

 

Its not to prove something , crickter grow in confidence with achievement. Thats why they say if someone is getting a 4 wkt haul let him take 5, or let someone complete a milestone before declare. 

 

Raina, dhoni, yuvi, kohli even pandya im recent times all benefited from timely promotions. Kohli himself did that with rayudu before 2015 wc 

 

Edited January 2, 2020 by Ankit_sharma03

[putrevus]

5 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

And russell gets promotion for his franchise and his impact have been phenomenal

 

Also sammy is a poor xample....he kept his place due to captaincy only

 

Iyer is not a similar batsman to those 2, hardik n dube fall in that category.

 

If crunch match situation has to be replicate that top 3 has to get out cheaply most days like on crunch days . 

 

Its not to prove something , crickter grow in confidence with achievement. Thats why they say if someone is getting a 4 wkt haul let him take 5, or let someone complete a milestone before declare. 

 

Raina, dhoni, yuvi, kohli even pandya im recent times all benefited from timely promotions. Kohli himself did that with rayudu before 2015 wc 

 

 Sammy did for few games and he is only captain to win multiple T20s world cup. If Dubey can do with ball and bat what Sammy did we will be okay.

It is T20 not odis, top three have not failed in any match except one against NZ.India does not need another set of compilers who start slow and then can pick up scoring.

 

They need batsmen who can tonk from ball one. That is what we need to see first.Who cares if Dubey score 50 in facing some spinners, they need to find out if this guy can score in death overs.

[Ankit_sharma03]

Just now, putrevus said:

 

They need batsmen who can tonk from ball one. That is what we need to see first.Who cares if Dubey score 50 in facing some spinners, they need to find out if this guy can score in death overs.

coz thats how u make youngster

u think dhoni wud have lasted had he not been send at no.3 by ganguly 

u think kohli, rohit wud have become what they are had dhoni not promoted them

 

These promotion puts a score on their name which gives them confidence or else ppl like u question where is the 50 without even understanding at their position u cant achieve milestone most days and neither will any one be consistent. Its 1 game promotion in 9-10 other games they will bat n their slot. Batting at 6-7 will always put small scores n then it affects confidence. u think teams around the world dont promote russell, maxwell, neesham. A 50 in career is always a saviour then 10-20 which is what a 6-7 number player can get most days which when media, ppl like u question - he hasnt scored a 50 in long time 

 

Building youngster is the most important and no better example then how ganguly and then dravid-chappell handled dhoni giving him timely promotions again n again

4 minutes ago, putrevus said:

 

It is T20 not odis, top three have not failed in any match except one against NZ.India does not need another set of compilers who start slow and then can pick up scoring.

its only kohli who has made runs in t20 ...and all it takes one ball for any batsman to get out be it kohli or bradman so no guarntee they ll score every time. Rohit n dhawan have been failure in last 2 t20 WC

[putrevus]

11 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

coz thats how u make youngster

u think dhoni wud have lasted had he not been send at no.3 by ganguly 

u think kohli, rohit wud have become what they are had dhoni not promoted them

 

These promotion puts a score on their name which gives them confidence or else ppl like u question where is the 50 without even understanding at their position u cant achieve milestone most days and neither will any one be consistent. Its 1 game promotion in 9-10 other games they will bat n their slot. Batting at 6-7 will always put small scores n then it affects confidence. u think teams around the world dont promote russell, maxwell, neesham. A 50 in career is always a saviour then 10-20 which is what a 6-7 number player can get most days which when media, ppl like u question - he hasnt scored a 50 in long time 

 

Building youngster is the most important and no better example then how ganguly and then dravid-chappell handled dhoni giving him timely promotions again n again

its only kohli who has made runs in t20 ...and all it takes one ball for any batsman to get out be it kohli or bradman so no guarntee they ll score every time. Rohit n dhawan have been failure in last 2 t20 WC

First you need to find out if he is capable of doing his primary job.India is not expecting a 50 from Dubey in crunch match from no 3 or no 4, they are expecting quick 20 or 25 of less than 10 balls.You don't have tell them they need to promote youngsters, they are doing it already.They did with Dubey and Pant in last series.

 

It is you who has no understanding of the game.Stop it with you nonsensical arguments, nobody is expecting a 50 from no 6 or no7 in a t20 match.

 

In odis, yes you expect a 50 from no 6 or no 7.

[Khota]

Iyer yes Doobay no.

[Ankit_sharma03]

56 minutes ago, putrevus said:

First you need to find out if he is capable of doing his primary job.

No 1st u need to find out can he play at international level and give him confidence so he can be 100% of his true nature

about his death batting skills he came in team showing that only , if he is good at international level he ll replicate it in death which is the 1st point - is he good at international level or not ?

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India is not expecting a 50 from Dubey in crunch match from no 3 or no 4, they are expecting quick 20 or 25 of less than 10 balls.

Its not as easy n simple

youngsters are build n groomed which primary involves confidence building and  rhythem 

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You don't have tell them they need to promote youngsters, they are doing it already.They did with Dubey and Pant in last series.

 

so do again

10-20  doesnt build players confidence in long run 

and their skill will also be tested in 9-10 games when they bat at 6,7 but timely promotion doesnt mean kohli going down permanently 

 

Who said make them permanent no.3 ?? I only said 1-1 game promotion

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It is you who has no understanding of the game.Stop it with you nonsensical arguments, nobody is expecting a 50 from no 6 or no7 in a t20 match.

but isnt it u who have been eating humble pies about his wrong opinons .....

not long ago u defended dhawan as better t20 batsman then rahul 

Or who thought dube bowling is better then pandya

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In odis, yes you expect a 50 from no 6 or no 7.

u do but s/r for no .7 is more important & u cant expect 50s also with consistency 

Edited January 2, 2020 by Ankit_sharma03

[ShoonyaSifar]

Kohli should be ashamed of himself if he bats at anywhere above number 5 in this series. He's already robbed the chance of a younger player by picking his buddy Dhawan, should not block Iyer and Dube now, in his lust for some useless and cheap runs 

[bowl_out]

Pant too should play up the order. 

Kohli should bat down the order and help crisis management if necessary.. else, just let the younger guys prove their mettle.

 

If anything, Dhawan should be benched too and Samson should open at least for 1-2 games.

[Ankit_sharma03]

3 minutes ago, bowl_out said:

.

If anything, Dhawan should be benched too and Samson should open at least for 1-2 games.

As much as we want that aint happening for sure, even if dhawan gets out on 0 in 1st 2 games that wont happen

[putrevus]

1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

No 1st u need to find out can he play at international level and give him confidence so he can be 100% of his true nature

about his death batting skills he came in team showing that only , if he is good at international level he ll replicate it in death which is the 1st point - is he good at international level or not ?

Its not as easy n simple

youngsters are build n groomed which primary involves confidence building and  rhythem 

 

so do again

10-20  doesnt build players confidence in long run 

and their skill will also be tested in 9-10 games when they bat at 6,7 but timely promotion doesnt mean kohli going down permanently 

 

Who said make them permanent no.3 ?? I only said 1-1 game promotion

but isnt it u who have been eating humble pies about his wrong opinons .....

not long ago u defended dhawan as better t20 batsman then rahul 

Or who thought dube bowling is better then pandya

u do but s/r for no .7 is more important & u cant expect 50s also with consistency 

Are you insane,Do you think bhangra is going on there where people are given chances will nilly at top of order. No you don't give chances at the expense of team losing matches to promote a young guy who has no pedigree. Scoring 50 from no 3 and scoring 25 from 10 balls at death are totally different skills.

 

Scoring no3 does not prove anything about his other skills. Now you understand why these guys need to have primary skill to justify their place in the team. 

 

 

[ShoonyaSifar]

4 minutes ago, putrevus said:

Are you insane,Do you think bhangra is going on there where people are given chances will nilly at top of order. No you don't give chances at the expense of team losing matches to promote a young guy who has no pedigree. Scoring 50 from no 3 and scoring 25 from 10 balls at death are totally different skills.

 

Scoring no3 does not prove anything about his other skills. Now you understand why these guys need to have primary skill to justify their place in the team. 

 

 

BTW anther piece of stats for you, In the last 4-5 years

When Kohli plays, we win ~60% of our T20I matches

Without Kohli, we win ~80% of our T20I matches

 

If no Kohli means us winning more, why not Kohli be the non-playing captain. or not be in the T20 team at all. After all, its all about winning matches for the country, correct?

 

No wonder, Kohli's inspiring leadership (with his unabated faith in his buddy Dhawan), has seen us reach a wonderful ranking of no. 5 in ICC T20I rankings. Kohli must be striving hard to take us to no. 7 or 8. 

[Ankit_sharma03]

33 minutes ago, putrevus said:

Are you insane,Do you think bhangra is going on there where people are given chances will nilly at top of order.

Have u ever seen cricket u think these guys wud have grown - dhoni, kohli, rohit, raina, yuvi, pandya without promotion 

 

Dhoni was bought as hitter in team and was struggling in initial games when promotion n security gave him confidence n assurance. u do understand their is a mental side of the game.

Pandya 1st ODI game  given new ball won MOM.....imagine what an MOM in 1st game can do to a youngsters confidence 

 

The first thing any youngster needs on international level is to feel that he belongs there and what makes him beileve  that is chances to perform

 

And the next time kohli give someone promotion i will use this line for sure

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No you don't give chances at the expense of team losing matches to promote a young guy who has no pedigree.

yes u do, winning cheap games boosting stats and not giving youngsters exposure in last 4 yrs costed us Wc

thats how all great teams are build 

Quote

Scoring 50 from no 3 and scoring 25 from 10 balls at death are totally different skills.

having 50 in ur record always gives u confidence the 1st most important for any job

also in t20 u have to be flexible coz not every day batsman till 7 will get bat 

 

to smack from ball 1 u need confidence n fearless attitude which is always helped if u have runs at back knowing ur place is secure

 

N batting at 3 for 1-2 games how does that affect team, if i remember he batted pretty well last time at 3

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Scoring no3 does not prove anything about his other skills.

it gives confidence most important thing 

Quote

Now you understand why these guys need to have primary skill to justify their place in the team. 

n who here doesnt have a primary skill remind me ?

Edited January 2, 2020 by Ankit_sharma03

[putrevus]

1 hour ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

BTW anther piece of stats for you, In the last 4-5 years

When Kohli plays, we win ~60% of our T20I matches

Without Kohli, we win ~80% of our T20I matches

 

If no Kohli means us winning more, why not Kohli be the non-playing captain. or not be in the T20 team at all. After all, its all about winning matches for the country, correct?

 

No wonder, Kohli's inspiring leadership (with his unabated faith in his buddy Dhawan), has seen us reach a wonderful ranking of no. 5 in ICC T20I rankings. Kohli must be striving hard to take us to no. 7 or 8. 

Do you wonder why that stat is like that?

[putrevus]

1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Have u ever seen cricket u think these guys wud have grown - dhoni, kohli, rohit, raina, yuvi, pandya without promotion 

 

Dhoni was bought as hitter in team and was struggling in initial games when promotion n security gave him confidence n assurance. u do understand their is a mental side of the game.

Pandya 1st ODI game  given new ball won MOM.....imagine what an MOM in 1st game can do to a youngsters confidence 

 

The first thing any youngster needs on international level is to feel that he belongs there and what makes him beileve  that is chances to perform

 

And the next time kohli give someone promotion i will use this line for sure

yes u do, winning cheap games boosting stats and not giving youngsters exposure in last 4 yrs costed us Wc

thats how all great teams are build 

having 50 in ur record always gives u confidence the 1st most important for any job

also in t20 u have to be flexible coz not every day batsman till 7 will get bat 

 

to smack from ball 1 u need confidence n fearless attitude which is always helped if u have runs at back knowing ur place is secure

 

N batting at 3 for 1-2 games how does that affect team, if i remember he batted pretty well last time at 3

it gives confidence most important thing 

n who here doesnt have a primary skill remind me ?

Most bits and pieces players like Dube/Pandya don't have any primary skill.Thats why they are called bits and pieces players,.

 

.Their primary skill is hitting the ball from ball one.If they cannot do that job they don't have any place in this team.If they are good enough to bat at top order they would not be batting lower down the order.

 

They are flexible thats why they promoted Pant and Dube in last series. There is a reason why guy like Kohli who made his debut later than Raina became top order batsman where as Raina remained in lower middle order.This is not IPL where guy like Raina can get away with all his weaknesses.

 

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

1 hour ago, putrevus said:

Most bits and pieces players like Dube/Pandya don't have any primary skill.Thats why they are called bits and pieces players,.

Power hitting is a specialist job

Go see how kohli did in odi n ipl when he was made to bat at 6,7

Infact bat rohit n dhawan ill see what they do...ohh wait rohit also failed in middle.

 

Also hardik isnt bits n pieces anymore he gives 8-10 overs now regulalry and his bowling has been pretty good in many matches in some has turned the game also 

Quote

 

.Their primary skill is hitting the ball from ball one.If they cannot do that job they don't have any place in this team.If they are good enough to bat at top order they would not be batting lower down the order.

hitting from ball 1 is  a specialist job in LOI

Pandya has MOS batting at 4, he is good enough to bat at 5 problem but who will bat at 7- kohli, dhawan, rohit, jadeja , rahane... 

Find me a guy who can bat at 7 coz pandya is good to bat at 5 for long now

 

U think dhoni wasnt good enough to bat up.... problem was who wud have batted below then 

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They are flexible thats why they promoted Pant and Dube in last series.

So they shud do again....its lanka not even half as good as Wi in t20

Who is saying send them up in NZ tour

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There is a reason why guy like Kohli who made his debut later than Raina became top order batsman where as Raina remained in lower middle order.

No raina use to bat at 3 and did well....he has a 100 against Sa in WC at 3 but then kohli rose and We needed players who cud bat down the order......guys like dhoni , raina had to go down coz others cudnt 

 

 

 

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This is not IPL where guy like Raina can get away with all his weaknesses.

 

There is a reason raina played so fearlessly coz he had runs in top order that allowed him to play that way in lower order coz that aggresive games comes with lot of failures n low scores is mostly what u get at that position....so those scores up keep ur place safe.

Edited January 2, 2020 by Ankit_sharma03

[bowl_out]

3 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

As much as we want that aint happening for sure, even if dhawan gets out on 0 in 1st 2 games that wont happen

Yeah, agree.. I only wish they win the first two T20s and play the third one with a team like below... but it isn't happening.

 

rahul
samson
iyer
pant (wk)
pandey
dube
sundar
jadeja
kuldeep
saini
bumrah (c)