Dennis Lillee

[zen]

How do you rate Lillee among ATG pace bowlers? Stats (though not everything) are below too for reference. 

 

Recently, I have been reconnecting with the "classic" cricketers by watching videos -  Lillee is fun. He runs in like a train. Is quick. Competes with the best (Sobers and Richards for e.g.) .... Known as a complete bowler .... Brings intensity to the game ....  And also said to be one of the most charamaristic cricketers .... Usually compared with Marshall and Hadlee .... Was amazing bowler with the X-factor in his prime inspiring a lot of bowlers .... And his contributions to the MRF pace foundation. 

 

 

Tests

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Opposition team Australia  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka  or West Indies

Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 1970

Type of bowler (by style) pace bowler

Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 100  and bowling average less than or equal to 25

Ordered by bowling average (ascending)

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Showing 1 - 21 of 21

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Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	Balls	Runs	Wkts	BBI	BBM	Ave	Econ	SR	5	10
MD Marshall (WI)	1978-1991	81	151	17584	7876	376	7/22	11/89	20.94	2.68	46.7	22	4
J Garner (WI)	1977-1987	58	111	13169	5433	259	6/56	9/108	20.97	2.47	50.8	7	0
CEL Ambrose (WI)	1988-2000	96	175	21641	8401	397	8/45	11/84	21.16	2.32	54.5	22	3
PJ Cummins (AUS)	2011-2020	28	53	6383	2947	137	6/23	10/62	21.51	2.77	46.5	5	1
GD McGrath (AUS)	1993-2007	120	235	28485	11930	549	8/24	10/27	21.73	2.51	51.8	29	3
VD Philander (SA)	2011-2020	60	113	10935	4828	219	6/21	10/102	22.04	2.64	49.9	13	2
Sir RJ Hadlee (NZ)	1973-1990	86	150	21918	9611	431	9/52	15/123	22.29	2.63	50.8	36	9
AA Donald (SA)	1992-2002	69	123	14906	7113	316	7/84	12/139	22.50	2.86	47.1	19	2
Imran Khan (PAK)	1971-1992	88	142	19458	8258	362	8/58	14/116	22.81	2.54	53.7	23	6
CEH Croft (WI)	1977-1982	27	52	6165	2913	125	8/29	9/95	23.30	2.83	49.3	3	0
RJ Harris (AUS)	2010-2015	27	52	5736	2658	113	7/117	9/106	23.52	2.78	50.7	5	0
DW Steyn (SA)	2004-2019	86	159	17426	9507	403	7/51	11/60	23.59	3.27	43.2	24	5
MA Holding (WI)	1975-1987	60	113	12680	5898	249	8/92	14/149	23.68	2.79	50.9	13	2
SM Pollock (SA)	1995-2008	100	186	22964	9238	389	7/87	10/147	23.74	2.41	59.0	15	1
Wasim Akram (PAK)	1985-2001	92	160	20096	8728	367	7/119	11/110	23.78	2.60	54.7	21	4
DK Lillee (AUS)	1971-1984	70	132	18467	8493	355	7/83	11/123	23.92	2.75	52.0	23	7
K Rabada (SA)	2015-2020	40	72	7579	4319	179	7/112	13/144	24.12	3.41	42.3	7	3
IR Bishop (WI)	1989-1998	43	76	8407	3909	161	6/40	8/57	24.27	2.78	52.2	6	0
Mohammad Asif (PAK)	2005-2010	23	44	5171	2583	106	6/41	11/71	24.36	2.99	48.7	7	1
CA Walsh (WI)	1984-2001	130	238	29536	12554	510	7/37	13/55	24.61	2.55	57.9	22	3
BA Reid (AUS)	1985-1992	27	42	6244	2784	113	7/51	13/148	24.63	2.67	55.2	5	2

 

 

ODIs

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Opposition team Australia  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka  or West Indies

Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 1970

Type of bowler (by style) pace bowler

Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 100  and bowling average less than or equal to 25

Ordered by bowling average (ascending)

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Showing 1 - 15 of 15

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Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	Balls	Runs	Wkts	BBI	Ave	Econ	SR	4	5
J Garner (WI)	1977-1987	97	97	5288	2739	144	5/31	19.02	3.10	36.7	2	3
DK Lillee (AUS)	1972-1983	61	61	3467	2075	101	5/34	20.54	3.59	34.3	5	1
MA Holding (WI)	1976-1987	101	101	5401	3001	140	5/26	21.43	3.33	38.5	5	1
Sir RJ Hadlee (NZ)	1973-1990	114	111	6110	3397	158	5/25	21.50	3.33	38.6	1	5
SE Bond (NZ)	2002-2010	73	71	3875	2866	128	6/19	22.39	4.43	30.2	5	4
AA Donald (SA)	1991-2003	148	147	7749	5454	242	5/29	22.53	4.22	32.0	9	1
GD McGrath (AUS)	1993-2007	218	216	11443	7594	333	5/14	22.80	3.98	34.3	9	6
B Lee (AUS)	2000-2012	193	190	9918	7946	337	5/22	23.57	4.80	29.4	11	9
MA Starc (AUS)	2010-2020	82	82	4251	3664	155	6/28	23.63	5.17	27.4	8	7
C Pringle (NZ)	1990-1995	64	64	3314	2459	103	5/45	23.87	4.45	32.1	2	1
Waqar Younis (PAK)	1989-2003	233	231	11440	9051	377	7/36	24.00	4.74	30.3	13	13
NW Bracken (AUS)	2001-2009	102	102	5228	3862	159	5/47	24.28	4.43	32.8	5	2
Wasim Akram (PAK)	1984-2003	314	310	16234	10711	439	5/16	24.39	3.95	36.9	15	4
CEL Ambrose (WI)	1988-2000	169	168	9008	5305	216	5/17	24.56	3.53	41.7	6	4
CJ McDermott (AUS)	1985-1996	133	133	7233	4892	197	5/44	24.83	4.05	36.7	4	1

Edited March 24, 2020 by zen

[Gollum]

Didn't prove himself in SC and WI. For all we know he might have been the Ashwin/Jadeja equivalent of fast bowling in those days. Great bowler nonetheless but not tier I great, that tier has Marshall, Ambrose, McGrath, Hadlee, Steyn etc. But he was a trendsetter, flame passed from him to Andy Roberts to others. 

[zen]

1 hour ago, Gollum said:

Didn't prove himself in SC and WI.

In the supertests in WI, Lillee took a lot of wkts against WI .... Supertests do not count as official tests but the series was highly competitive - Link 

 

In SC, I won't be surprised if tracks were prepared to blunt likes of Lillee out esp. considering that Aus would not have a quality spinner. In Pak, no quick bowler made a big impact including Imran Khan, who does "special things" in Pak  

 

View overall figures [change view]

Primary team Australia  or Pakistan

Opposition team Australia  or Pakistan

Host country Pakistan

Start of match date between 1 Jan 1980 and 1 Jan 1981

Type of bowler (by style) pace bowler

Ordered by wickets taken (descending)

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Overall figures

Player	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	BBM	Ave	Econ	SR	5	10
Imran Khan (PAK)	2	3	56.0	14	144	6	2/28	4/116	24.00	2.57	56.0	0	0
GS Chappell (AUS)	3	3	34.0	9	74	3	3/49	3/49	24.66	2.17	68.0	0	0
DK Lillee (AUS)	3	4	102.0	19	303	3	3/114	3/114	101.00	2.97	204.0	0	0
Sarfraz Nawaz (PAK)	3	5	111.0	30	255	2	2/119	2/119	127.50	2.29	333.0	0	0
G Dymock (AUS)	3	4	51.0	13	129	1	1/49	1/49	129.00	2.52	306.0	0	0
Ehteshamuddin (PAK)	1	1	18.0	2	59	1	1/59	1/59	59.00	3.27	108.0	0	0
Taslim Arif (PAK)	3	1	5.0	0	28	1	1/28	1/28	28.00	5.60	30.0	0	0
KJ Hughes (AUS)	3	1	8.0	1	19	0	-	-	-	2.37	-	0	0
Mudassar Nazar (PAK)	3	4	12.0	1	46	0	-	-	-	3.83	-	0	0
GN Yallop (AUS)	3	2	5.0	0	29	0	-	-	-	5.80	-	0	0
Haroon Rasheed (PAK)	2	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-

 

 

Above there is hardly any recognizable Aus bowler apart from Lillee .... a couple of close LBWs not given by Pak umpires could make a big difference on such surfaces .... Knowing the exceptional quality of Lillee, I would give him a benefit of doubt in SC. 

 

[zen]

After looking a what Lillee did to Pak below .... Not surprised to see pitches made to blunt Lillee (as seen in my last post) and highly defensive attitude from Pak in Pak:

 

 

 

 

Edited March 21, 2020 by zen

[rtmohanlal]

what ever said & done he remains over rated...not enough sample size in sub continent...

[Suhaan]

Had  great footwork

Edited March 22, 2020 by Suhaan

[zen]

Looking at factors such as pace, skills, X factor,  ability to intimidate the opposition,  etc., along with that train like run up and charisma (though not related to skills but can get bonus points in a subjective discussion as many Australian cricketers can be uncharismatic and since all great players have good stats), Lillee, imo, continues to be Australia’s greatest pace bowler! 

 

 

 

[zen]

My world 11 bowlers/ARs

Tests

* Sobers - the batting great and a bowler who can bowl both pace and spin 

* Gilly (WK AR)

* Hadlee - not only among the greatest bowlers but can lend depth to batting as well .... among the greatest cricketers 

* Marshall - the premier test match  fast bowler 

* Warne - the premier test match spinner 

* Ambrose - a bowling great and compliments the bowling line up well with his ability to generate bounce. Can run through sides and be unplayable in the 4th inning. The type of bowler to defend 150 or less

 

Without looking at batting skills, Lillee can be a great contender for a spot in the playing 11 for his bowling skills - rated as a “complete” bowler 

 

[zen]

Lillee has a great record in ODIs too. The video below appears to be from the last part of his career but his bowling is still sharp: 

 

https://youtu.be/pWfeHOjHZxQ

[zen]

Watched some more videos today .... like the atmosphere .... the crowd clapping when Lillee is running to bowl:

 

 

 

 

Good to see a bowler engage the crowd in such a fashion

Edited March 22, 2020 by zen

[Straight Drive]

He and Thomson were one of the best bowling pair ever. Thomson being the most brutal of pace bowlers with little mercy for batsmen whom he injured.

 

Lillee and Jeff could have been more dangerous if the Aussie team of that times had a good 3rd pacer.

Edited March 23, 2020 by Straight Drive

[zen]

Lillee's monument at MCG

 

 

 

 

Front Inscription

DENNIS LILLEE

With menacing speed and bounce,
Lillee burst onto the international scene when he took 8/29
against a powerful World XI at Perth in 1971.
On return from a serious back injury in 1974,
his slightly reduced pace was offset by a
compelling mix of guile and perseverance and he
became a legend of Australian cricket,
retiring in 1984 as the highest Test wicket-taker
with 355 victims at 23.92.
Many regard Lillee as the greatest fast bowler of any era.

[Jimmy Cliff]

Great bowler. How did some of the best batsmen of his time fare against him? I am specially interested in how Indian batsmen measured up to him in Tests. Asking for a friend.

[Gollum]

The pioneers of that era, Andy Roberts and Lillee both rated Vishy above Gavaskar. 

[Jimmy Cliff]

5 hours ago, Gollum said:

The pioneers of that era, Andy Roberts and Lillee both rated Vishy above Gavaskar. 

Roberts is probably biased towards Vishy since he was at the receiving end of couple of ATG match-winning performances by Vishy in 1974-75 when India were down 2-0. Can't blame Lillee though as Gavaskar was woeful against him in 1971 as a part of the World XI as well as in 1981.

[zen]

[Gollum]

On 4/5/2020 at 10:09 PM, Jimmy Cliff said:

 Can't blame Lillee though as Gavaskar was woeful against him in 1971 as a part of the World XI as well as in 1981.

Also Vishy's ATG match-winning 100 in 1981 MCG test.

[Real McCoy]

When lillee was bowling, he ran through the batting lineup like a billie amongst pigeons

[rkt.india]

On 3/22/2020 at 6:39 PM, zen said:

Looking at factors such as pace, skills, X factor,  ability to intimidate the opposition,  etc., along with that train like run up and charisma (though not related to skills but can get bonus points in a subjective discussion as many Australian cricketers can be uncharismatic and since all great players have good stats), Lillee, imo, continues to be Australia’s greatest pace bowler! 

 

 

 

Lillie had lost his pace quite early in his career due to a stress fracture in the back. 

[rkt.india]

On 4/5/2020 at 10:09 PM, Jimmy Cliff said:

Roberts is probably biased towards Vishy since he was at the receiving end of couple of ATG match-winning performances by Vishy in 1974-75 when India were down 2-0. Can't blame Lillee though as Gavaskar was woeful against him in 1971 as a part of the World XI as well as in 1981.

In 71, he was express but by 1981, he was past it, had lost pace as well.