Butler proves why Xfactor players need to be backed in long formats

[sandeep]

43 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

For me its not about pandya , its about team combination.

This basic concept is too much for Maniac to accept, because he doesnt want to admit that he was wrong about Pandya's potential and possibility. 

[zen]

As discussed, in his short test career, Pandya has a 100 in SL and a 90 odd in SA ——> almost 2 100s overseas, along with a 5-er! 
 

If this was done by an AR from some other country, ppl could be going gaga over it  

Edited August 9, 2020 by zen

[Ankit_sharma03]

5 hours ago, maniac said:

every opportunity to lose out to a guy just based on his IPL or LOI cameos?

Are u serious?

U started this thread saying backing rohit , the guy who not long ago before 1-2 not out had worse avg overseas then ashwin, jaddu, bhuvi. 

Pandya who has 90+ score in sa and a 50+ in england, 100 in sl , 70 in a home game

Match winning 5 fer in england

These are cameos and guy who doesnt have a Single 50 in sa , wi or eng is deserving....wah 

Away from india he doesnt even have a 80+ score also.....

Pandya has. 90+ in sa

100 in sl where also rohit threw his wkt 

 

20-30 runs are cameos which rohit has many in away condition including lanka n wi 

 

[SK_IH]

Well as always the real judge will be the Ashes for Poms wherein Buttler will be exposed once again. He doesn't back his attacking instincts enough and tries to hard to be a test batsman and that's where his failures originate from.

Rohit is in different class as a batsman, I thought you were a fan of Rohit and you are comparing him with Buttler. Rohit is a proper frontline batsmen capable of a 300 scoreline, I just hope he finally succeeds in Test Cricket down under, he deserves a satisfactory finish to his test career.

 

 

 

Edited August 9, 2020 by SK_IH

[Adamant]

Yeah, that's why pant should be preffered over Saha.

Rohit's competition is prithvi shaw ,x factor kiska zyada hai decide karlo.

12 hours ago, maniac said:

Self explanatory.

 

This is for all those guys who think Rohit doesn’t deserve a test spot.

 

You need to back proven match winners and they will deliver when you don’t expect it or in miraculous situations.

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

7 hours ago, SK_IH said:

Well as always the real judge will be the Ashes for Poms wherein Buttler will be exposed once again. He doesn't back his attacking instincts enough and tries to hard to be a test batsman and that's where his failures originate from.

Yup the same problem which was with dhoni n yuvi in test, whereas sehwag backed his insticts.

Even though dhoni cant be termed as failure in test yet he didnt look in that much control specially away. In india also his best innings came when he backed his instinct of attack like that 200.

That why sehwag was rare. 

[Trichromatic]

15 hours ago, zen said:

Pandya is a very good batsman with the ability to bowl at 140+. Ind does not produce such cricketers frequently. What is needed is to support such cricketers find feet at the international level. 

Pandya is not a very good batsman. 

[Straight Drive]

Another "Ghuma balla laga Chakka" type of batsman doing well in test cricket ?
Or did he win it by playing "Tuku Tuku"" type of cricket yesterday to win the match.

 

Edited August 9, 2020 by Straight Drive

[zen]

1 hour ago, Trichromatic said:

Pandya is not a very good batsman. 

Ok, then he must be great!

[zen]

1 hour ago, Straight Drive said:

Another "Ghuma balla laga Chakka" type of batsman doing well in test cricket ?
Or did he win it by playing "Tuku Tuku"" type of cricket yesterday to win the match.

 

Eng tries to play with a positive mindset relatively speaking. 

[Straight Drive]

1 hour ago, zen said:

Eng tries to play with a positive mindset relatively speaking. 

It's reflecting in the batting averages of this team. Is there even one England batsman averaging above 45 in test cricket apart from Joe Root. Joe Root isn't the dasher by any means.

[Ankit_sharma03]

8 minutes ago, Straight Drive said:

It's reflecting in the batting averages of this team. Is there even one England batsman averaging above 45 in test cricket apart from Joe Root. Joe Root isn't the dasher by any means.

its a lot due to home conditions as well, in england it favours bowler a lot and through test unlike Australia or Nz these days which get flat

anyways england batting is currently inexp- sibely, pope, burns, crawley havent played a lot 

[maniac]

Woakes is good enough to be in the side as a frontline seamer. He is probably top 5 fast bowler in England right now and given Anderson is on his last legs probably top 3.

 

Stokes just like VVS was for us is not about averages, he is the guy who gets you over the line in clutch situations as shown in WC and other games. In fact he is the top 2 bat in entire England right now along with Root.

 

Pandya is neither the top middle order bat in India nor is he the top 5 fast bowler in India. In the current scheme of things Pandya will take up the spot by Vihari or in future Gill or the spot of Bhuvi/Umesh and Saini. Vihari may not be up to the mark yet but he has averaged over 50 and performed and toiled his way to get where he is today. He isn’t some quota pic or fav pic that came out of nowhere. If not him, there are 10 other in queue who need to get ahead of Pandya.

 

should the proper  batsmen and bowler Say “kya karoon,job chod doon? “ because it looks like all it takes is a few cameos or some odd flashes of brilliance in IPL gets you a test spot?

 

Shadab Khan got 45 in the game which Pakistanis were harping about. However he has replaced a guy who has 50 average in FC like Fawad Alam. Now Alam may have gotten a pair here but then you bring some other batsman. The expectation from a frontline bat is 100+ but when you get such bits and pieces player, scores like this are highlighted like they are some 300. Clearly it’s one of the reasons that cost Pakistan the game. Pandyas fluke 90 in SA is no different. Pandya was just riding his luck in that knock. It was important in the context of the game but it was not a controlled knock like most great innings are. We saw yesterday, Woakes scored more but it was actually Butler’s presence and composure that won them the game. That’s what separates a proper player from a little bit of this and that players. 

 

Test cricket is a game for specialists. 

[Straight Drive]

4 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

its a lot due to home conditions as well, in england it favours bowler a lot and through test unlike Australia or Nz these days which get flat

anyways england batting is currently inexp- sibely, pope, burns, crawley havent played a lot 

Joe Root also plays in same conditions, but he shows he is quality. The others need to increase their average else, the batting lineup will be fragile and prone to collapses.

[zen]

2 minutes ago, maniac said:

Pandya is neither the top middle order bat in India nor is he the top 5 fast bowler in India. In the current scheme of things Pandya will take up the spot by Vihari or in future Gill or the spot of Bhuvi/Umesh and Saini. Vihari may not be up to the mark yet but he has averaged over 50 and performed and toiled his way to get where he is today. He isn’t some quota pic or fav pic that came out of nowhere. If not him, there are 10 other in queue who need to get ahead of Pandya.

Irrelevant as Pandya is the best when it comes to combining batting (has performances overseas) and bowling skills (won a test in Eng). If he brings in the balance, team will groom him. Others can compete for the 5 specialist batting and 4 specialist bowling spots. 


 

 

[zen]

1 minute ago, Straight Drive said:

Joe Root also plays in same conditions, but he shows he is quality. The others need to increase their average else, the batting lineup will be fragile and prone to collapses.

The averages are fine considering English conditions and their deep batting. Eng is probably using an advanced approach which allows them to compete despite not having players with great personal records. 
 

 

[maniac]

2 minutes ago, zen said:

Irrelevant as Pandya is the best when it comes to combining batting (has performances overseas) and bowling skills (won a test in Eng). If he brings in the balance, team will groom him. Others can compete for the 5 specialist batting and 4 specialist bowling spots. 


 

 

The only time India had that balance was with Kapil and it just so happened that he was the best bowler in india for about 95% of his career.

 

That kind of balance is a luxury not mandatory.

 

2 of the greatest teams ever to play cricket 70-80 WI and 90-2000 Aus didn’t have a single allrounder. Watson came in much later but he struggled to cement his spot till they made him a full time opener.

[Straight Drive]

1 minute ago, zen said:

The averages are fine considering English conditions and their deep batting. Eng is probably using an advanced approach which allows them to compete despite not having players with great personal records. 
 

 

What is next best average after Joe Root .

[zen]

30 minutes ago, maniac said:

The only time India had that balance was with Kapil and it just so happened that he was the best bowler in india for about 95% of his career.

 

That kind of balance is a luxury not mandatory.

 

2 of the greatest teams ever to play cricket 70-80 WI and 90-2000 Aus didn’t have a single allrounder. Watson came in much later but he struggled to cement his spot till they made him a full time opener.

That probably shows that ATG teams with many  ATG players can do without an AR (and also that good ARs are difficult to find). Not that teams like Ind with likes of Vihari, Ishant, etc.,can do without them

 

Also WI had likes of Viv, who were competent bowlers. Similarly, Aus had Waughs brothers, Chappell and Border, who were decent bowlers too. So you may have misread the information 

 

PS Note that Kapil had a few good spells in Aus and  WI. Apart from that he was not too great overseas. Similarly in batting, he had a few good knocks here and there (a 100 each in SA, WI and Eng). Pandya at his peak can be like a Botham, who hit 14 test 100s, with the bat for e.g., while also contributing with the ball

Edited August 9, 2020 by zen

[zen]

8 minutes ago, Straight Drive said:

What is next best average after Joe Root .

I do not know from the top of the mind recall. But the current team has a lot of new players who avg in 40s including Pope and Foakes. Earlier guys like Cook averaged in 40s too.