Navdeep Saini is overrated.

[Amit228]

32 minutes ago, vayuu1 said:

The sample size u are talking about is flat Odis pitches where 350 was norm, agree he hasn't been up-to the mark but playing in Australia for the first time is never easy. Takes time for a newbie to settle in.

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Yeah i concur.. all here wants him to succeed.. provided he works hard on his game .. & for that we have examples in our team

 

Once umesh yadav was as innocuous as one can get.. but now he is vastly improved (specially in our home tests) yeah in sena test he isn't really wht we desire him to be.. but in home tests he is a beast..

 

Same goes with ishant .. where major part of his career he was a pie chucker...now ishant sharma of late is a workhorse bowling consistent lines nd length & seaming balls both ways..

 

Zaheer also had careers of two halves where zaheer 2.0 benefited greatly from his county stint..

 

Now all i want is bowler to work hard on his game & skills.. & not to take his pace only as solitary usp..

 

Saini can go 10 for 100 in one or two outing.. that is completely fine .. one performance doesn't make a player bad.. evn bumrah has his bad days.. 

 

however if he continues to bowl all over the pitch giving ample of scoring opportunities to oppn batsmen.. game after game.. bowling devoid of any brain, not learning nd not working on his game, not enchancing his skills.. than he will be languishing in cold corner...

[express bowling]

2 hours ago, Amit228 said:

It goes other way also.. people hyping up an unknown commodity as second coming of Akhtar.. 

 

Nobody expected him to blow away the opposition.. however what we all have expected from him is to bowl atleast a decent line or lenth nd not giving a boundary ball evry over..

 

I don't really loathe Saini nor i think anyone here has a personal agenda against him..  however this syndrome of hyping up a bowler just because he can throw few balls over 145kmph is something we as a fan should stop.. or else we will be same like our padosis who hyped up an alleged 17 yr old teen to celestial level of express bowling only to be left with egg in face...

 

Saini has two issues his inconsistent bowling (for that we have enough sample size going into this tour) nd his ability to make the ball talk on atleast some occasions.. nd i guess he isn't that express of what people here hyped up about..

 

So the truth remains the same *Pace without Brain is futile"

 

 

Saini is a pacer who has come up the ranks.

 

1. Took 5-fers in both the semi Final and final matches of Ranji Trophy 2017-18 ... that is performance in big knock out games.

 

2. Has played 40+ first class matches.

 

3. After that, he has performed in quite a few Unofficial test matches for India A.

 

4. After that he has been chosen to play for Team India ... and had to wait for more than 2 years for a test match debut.

 

He is nothing like Naseem Shah, who was fast tracked without much FC experience or A-team games. And no one has said he is the next Akhtar.

 

Ability to bowl 140 k+ ... with a few balls sbove 145 k+ is sort of a basic requirement these days for quality test match pacers. There are atleast 10 pacers in India who can do that.

 

So, Saini was not chosen based on just that. But because he is a quick pacer who has performed at every stage.

 

He was not debuted when he was in form ... And now he has to debut when he is out of form.

 

And this has happened with a lot of debutants these days.

[Amit228]

7 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

as if we had many option and he is a newcomer so captain takes more of a ca;;

 

 

Something thats not the norm in indian cricket

 

 

So a half fit bowler can be thrown in a brawl.. just because he is a new comer? Nd yes team had option.. thakur eventually replaced him in last odi.. what bad would hv happened if saini was rested in starting two odis?? 

 

why would our team management play a half fit bowler?  This theory doesn't make any sense..

[putrevus]

I don't think Saini is as great talent as people have made him out to be but he deserves his chances.Umesh has that ability to swing but he leaks runs.I don't know if Saini can swing the ball.  I don't think he has that 145 plus pace on consistent basis for a spell.

 

Once Umesh was out Saini was only option and we cannot rush in judgement on  first day.He was kept waiting for so long on field to bowl any debuatant would have  jitters.

 

Let us see how he does on day 2.

[Ankit_sharma03]

22 minutes ago, Amit228 said:

So a half fit bowler can be thrown in a brawl.. just because he is a new comer? Nd yes team had option.. thakur eventually replaced him in last odi.. what bad would hv happened if saini was rested in starting two odis?? 

 

Ask captain 

 

22 minutes ago, Amit228 said:

 

why would our team management play a half fit bowler?  This theory doesn't make any sense..

clearly u havent seen indian cricket before

[Suhaan]

People here are behaving like pak fans

The sole purpose of this thread

[raki05]

28 minutes ago, Amit228 said:

 

Now all i want is bowler to work hard on his game & skills.. & not to take his pace only as solitary usp.

 how do you know he doesn't work hard on his game? BTW what was your suggestion whom do you see best fit in this situation when our main bowlers are not available. Would you be happy with Thakur or Nattu? Do you think swing and seam made you successful if that's the case Bhuvi should have been more successful test bowlers. Even yadav spray gun is better than bhuvi in test ( Stats looks good for bhuvi but he only played so far in seaming or swinging pitches in india/abroad)

[rkt.india]

On debut, flat pitch, picked one of the two wickets to fell, still getting stick. Are we bowling paavarhause now?

[Ankit_sharma03]

funny - ppl keep cribing about how we dont fast track youngsters

 

• When pakistan do they make fun of Naseem - have patience he is fast tracked
• Not to forget many cribbing for Pandya- whom we fast tracked

 

Then they want players who have toiled in Fc

 

 

• When it comes to Siraj - they ll be scared of his lack of interntaional games ( how will he gain exp until he plays)
• When it comes To Saini wahi R**di Rona 
• Trundler ko khila do to bhi inhone Rona

 

Chahiye kya Dale steyn- wo roz paida nahin hote. No matter how much domestic u play ur skills go on next level when u play international thats called evolving 

Edited January 7, 2021 by Ankit_sharma03

[rkt.india]

14 hours ago, putrevus said:

I don't think Saini is as great as people have made him out to be but he deserves his chances.Umesh has that ability to swing but he leaks runs.I don't know if Saini can swing the ball.  I don't think he has that 145 plus pace on consistent basis for a spell.

 

Once Umesh was out Saini was only option and we cannot rush in judgement on  first day.He was kept waiting for so long on field to bowl any debuatant would have  jitters.

 

Let us see how he does on day 2.

How can a bowler be considered great without even playing a test!

Edited January 8, 2021 by rkt.india

[rkt.india]

1 minute ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

funny - ppl keep cribing about how we dont fast track youngsters

 

• When pakistan do they make fun of Naseem - have patience he is fast tracked
• Not to forget many cribbing for Pandya- whom we fast tracked

 

Then they want players who have toiled in Fc

 

 

• When it comes to Siraj - they ll be scared of his lack of interntaional games ( how will he gain exp until he plays)
• When it comes To Saini wahi R**di Rona 
• Trundler ko khila do to bhi inhone Rona

 

Chahiye kya Dale steyn- wo roz paida nahin hote. No matter how much domestic u play ur skills go on next level when u play international thats called evolving 

Even Steyn was dropped after his debut.

[putrevus]

How can a bowler can be considered great without even playing a test!

What I meant great is in terms of talent.

You don’t need to play to be considered as great talent.


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[Amit228]

36 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

 

Saini is a pacer who has come up the ranks.

 

1. Took 5-fers in both the semi Final and final matches of Ranji Trophy 2017-18 ... that is performance in big knock out games.

 

2. Has played 40+ first class matches.

 

3. After that, he has performed in quite a few Unofficial test matches for India A.

 

4. After that he has been chosen to play for Team India ... and had to wait for more than 2 years for a test match debut.

 

He is nothing like Naseem Shah, who was fast tracked without much FC experience or A-team games. And no one has said he is the next Akhtar.

 

Ability to bowl 140 k+ ... with a few balls sbove 145 k+ is sort of a basic requirement these days for quality test match pacers. There are atleast 10 pacers in India who can do that.

 

So, Saini was not chosen based on just that. But because he is a quick pacer who has performed at every stage.

 

He was not debuted when he was in form ... And now he has to debut when he is out of form.

 

And this has happened with a lot of debutants these days.

 

Even thakur (one of the most despised character here) is a domestic giant wherein in 2014-15 ranji season he was the joint highest wicket taker nd in 2015-16 season he helped mumbai win the title by taking 8 wickets in final...

 

So why we see people crying foul when thakur makes the list on the basis of his domestic performance... 

 

Nd there's little seperating saini nd thakur considering both have similar first class stats (their bowling avg)..with thakur being more experienced..

 

Saini - 125 wickets in 46 first class matches with avg of 28.3

Thakur - 206 wickets from 62 first class matches with avg of 28.6

 

So we can't say that one player is good but he wasn't given chances when in form nd scorn off other.. need to have same yardstick for everyone..

 

( I don't rate thakur either but had compare him with saini to bring this to light)

 

Instead a player should perform whenever he should be given the chances ..& if he keeps on failing game after game.. instead of learning nd making ammends than he is not cut for international cricket nd there is no room for excuses like being in form nd not being in form.

[express bowling]

27 minutes ago, putrevus said:

I don't think Saini is as great as people have made him out to be

 

 

I don't think anyone thinks that Saini is great.

 

It is not possible to label any person great till the time he performs like a great player for quite a few years in international cricket.

 

He is just the next in line pacer who was waiting for a test debut, based on FC and A-team game performances.

 

 

[putrevus]

Just now, express bowling said:

 

 

I don't think anyone thinks that Saini is great.

 

It is not possible to label any person great till the time he performs like a great player for quite a few years in international cricket.

 

He is just the next in line pacer who was waiting for a test debut, based on FC and A-team game performances.

 

 

Yes, I never denied that he did not deserve his place in third test. I also said  if they had selected Natrajan TM should be sacked. But The hype that some people put on here when he did not play in India against so called weaker teams was ridiculous.

[Suhaan]

Anyone who is on bench looks good,we are on course to match padosi forum

[putrevus]

52 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

 

Saini is a pacer who has come up the ranks.

 

1. Took 5-fers in both the semi Final and final matches of Ranji Trophy 2017-18 ... that is performance in big knock out games.

 

2. Has played 40+ first class matches.

 

3. After that, he has performed in quite a few Unofficial test matches for India A.

 

4. After that he has been chosen to play for Team India ... and had to wait for more than 2 years for a test match debut.

 

He is nothing like Naseem Shah, who was fast tracked without much FC experience or A-team games. And no one has said he is the next Akhtar.

 

Ability to bowl 140 k+ ... with a few balls sbove 145 k+ is sort of a basic requirement these days for quality test match pacers. There are atleast 10 pacers in India who can do that.

 

So, Saini was not chosen based on just that. But because he is a quick pacer who has performed at every stage.

 

He was not debuted when he was in form ... And now he has to debut when he is out of form.

 

And this has happened with a lot of debutants these days.

So now we have create a rule to debut players when they are in form but not when team needs them.How are we going assess that form. What should we do to the players who were picked before him and are currently in team.

[express bowling]

5 minutes ago, Amit228 said:

 

Even thakur (one of the most despised character here) is a domestic giant wherein in 2014-15 ranji season he was the joint highest wicket taker nd in 2015-16 season he helped mumbai win the title by taking 8 wickets in final...

 

So why we see people crying foul when thakur makes the list on the basis of his domestic performance... 

 

Nd there's little seperating saini nd thakur considering both have similar first class stats (their bowling avg)..with thakur being more experienced..

 

Saini - 125 wickets in 46 first class matches with avg of 28.3

Thakur - 206 wickets from 62 first class matches with avg of 28.6

 

So we can't say that one player is good but he wasn't given chances when in form nd scorn off other.. need to have same yardstick for everyone..

 

( I don't rate thakur either but had compare him with saini to bring this to light)

 

 

Thakur is too short for a bowler of his pace plus accuracy combo.  

 

Such bowlers never do well in test cricket.

 

India's fast bowling strength in tests has become awesome from 2018 onwards when we started to ignore medium pacers and short seamers without extra pace.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Amit228 said:

Instead a player should perform whenever he should be given the chances ..& if he keeps on failing game after game.. instead of learning nd making ammends than he is not cut for international cricket nd there is no room for excuses like being in form nd not being in form.

 

Saini is playing his first test first innings.

 

How has he failed game after game  ?

 

 

****   Who is your preferred pick as the 3rd pacer in test matches in the absence of Shami, Ishant and Umesh. ?

 

[raki05]

Saini deserved his chance and rightly selected.... there was a time when thakur also got same hyped but when he played internationals all format and playing till now people realized that he doesn't have height to perform at highest form of cricket so fans have mellowed down . BTW it doesn't matter if someone is hyped or not eventually selections are done by selectors and they are not reading icf to select players s. This is an open forum if someone would perform in doemestic he would be rightly sought out whether Siraj, Saini or Thakur ( all of them have got ICF attention when they performed) . So it's wrong to say that thakur din't get the same hype. 

[raki05]

2 minutes ago, express bowling said:

Saini is playing his first test first innings.

 

How has he failed game after game  ?