So now we are going back to 90s cricket

[putrevus]

Where our spinners feel as if they are great bowlers when bowling to on conducive dustbowls and will be found out when they tour abroad with no clue what do to get wickets. Our so called fast bowlers will be passengers who will be just filling in numbers to make the playing 11. Our batsmen will be sitting ducks when they tour outside sub continent.We have been trying to reverse the trend for two decades . 0-8 should not be the reason to go back to tracks where our batsmen score tons of runs on these kind of tracks but the minute the land anywhere with tinge of green even if that track is in India they are shi*t scared to play. Let these young guys play on sporting wickets and let them develop the ability to play everywhere and let our spinners learn how to take wickets on sporting wickets. I think especially against weak teams we should be playing on green tops in India with only one spinner. let our batsmen get better and our fast bowlers will have something to bowl, it is just ridiculous that both Zak and Yadav bowled just eight overs that too with new ball. Our pitches should assist spinners but not the extent where fast bowlers become just passengers.If they cant swing the new ball then what is the point of them playing at all. Even if we are winning matches like this one where spinners take 20 wickets, are we gaining any benefits in the long term.

[Sidhoni]

So you are trying to say that long term benefit can be gained only by making pitches conducive to fast bowling? We have been like this over the years. In fact, the whole SC has been like this. Preparing pitches suitable to spinners and beating non-SC sides. And to add, this one is not completely a dust bowl. If you have seen the match, you would know that the batsmen are throwing wickets away.

[yoda]

yea lets stop picking spinners and stop playing at home. all problems solved.

[GautiMaan]

make green pitches and make ur domestic teams play each other on them.Make the batsmen practice on these tracks before they go overseas Why would u give these touring teams an advantage by giving them familiar pitches?Have u ever seen England or Australia preparing turners even against weak teams?

[Number]

I'm okay if we keep pwning other teams on turners. But BCCI should preapare good tracks(help for both pacers and spinners) for Ranji games. That's the place, from where players can learn and work on their technique.

[Ultimate_Game]

It's called "home advantage" and we shouldn't give it up just to appease a few :facepalm: Yes, we need to prepare sporting/fast pitches but we need to do so ground level up, not in Tests. Make bouncy pitches in under-age cricket and for domestic cricket. Once the cricketers start coming through playing on those sort of wkts we can start preparing such pitches for intl matches. But you can't just start making these pitches straight away for intl games without any prior planning and hand over the advantage to opponents on a silver platter the way we did against Aussies at Nagpur in 2004 :banghead: Still can't forget what Maharashtra state association, especially that rat Shashank Manohar, did there just to show Dalmiya/Ganguly a finger and Aussies managed their lone series win due to the warring factions within BCCI :((

[GautiMaan]

^ SA won a match the same way,we were bundled out for 76 in the first innings:((

[putrevus]

So you are trying to say that long term benefit can be gained only by making pitches conducive to fast bowling? We have been like this over the years. In fact, the whole SC has been like this. Preparing pitches suitable to spinners and beating non-SC sides. And to add, this one is not completely a dust bowl. If you have seen the match, you would know that the batsmen are throwing wickets away.

We have not been like this in recent past our fast bowlers had very important role in getting wickets at home.Zak was as important bowler as any spinner. I am not saying this is dust bowl but fast bowlers bowling just eight overs of first 46 overs is not good.

[vvvslaxman]

Where our spinners feel as if they are great bowlers when bowling to on conducive dustbowls and will be found out when they tour abroad with no clue what do to get wickets. Our so called fast bowlers will be passengers who will be just filling in numbers to make the playing 11. Our batsmen will be sitting ducks when they tour outside sub continent.We have been trying to reverse the trend for two decades . 0-8 should not be the reason to go back to tracks where our batsmen score tons of runs on these kind of tracks but the minute the land anywhere with tinge of green even if that track is in India they are shi*t scared to play. Let these young guys play on sporting wickets and let them develop the ability to play everywhere and let our spinners learn how to take wickets on sporting wickets. I think especially against weak teams we should be playing on green tops in India with only one spinner. let our batsmen get better and our fast bowlers will have something to bowl, it is just ridiculous that both Zak and Yadav bowled just eight overs that too with new ball. Our pitches should assist spinners but not the extent where fast bowlers become just passengers.If they cant swing the new ball then what is the point of them playing at all. Even if we are winning matches like this one where spinners take 20 wickets, are we gaining any benefits in the long term.

Are you kidding. Lot of Indian batsmen have terrific record in England bar the last one series. Also in Australia prior to this tour Sehwag, Tendulkar, Laxman, Dravid all averaged over 50. Only in SA we have indifferent record. It is impossible to reproduce conditions of SA here in India. You should not prepare green tracks to learn how to play at test level. Ought to be done at the domestic level. Every team prepares tracks to suit their own strength. Our strength is bowling spin and batting against spin. Preparing fast bowler friendly track is not that easy. Even if you do there is a risk it will last only for one session on day 1 and it will ease out like in Ahmedabad. India bowled out inside 20 overs for 76 runs. Pitch eased out after that.

[Clarke]

FYI those turning tracks assist reverse swing, so its not like seamers have no role.

[Trichromatic]

Turners are actually better. At least it won't give T20 batsmen a chance to score centuries in tests.

[putrevus]

It's called "home advantage" and we shouldn't give it up just to appease a few :facepalm: Yes, we need to prepare sporting/fast pitches but we need to do so ground level up, not in Tests. Make bouncy pitches in under-age cricket and for domestic cricket. Once the cricketers start coming through playing on those sort of wkts we can start preparing such pitches for intl matches. But you can't just start making these pitches straight away for intl games without any prior planning and hand over the advantage to opponents on a silver platter the way we did against Aussies at Nagpur in 2004 :banghead: Still can't forget what Maharashtra state association did there just to show Dalmiya/Ganguly a finger and Aussies managed their lone series win due to the warring factions within BCCI :((

So why were we proclaiming some of our batsmen are better than Bradmans and are world's best and thumping our chests when these guys get some meaning less records. It is not to appease anybody it is for betterment of our cricket in general and changing the mindset of both batsmen and bowlers. The planning you are saying should happen but it may or may not happen.But these changing wickets at test level can definitely happen, let our new generation of middle order learn to play on fast wickets if they are good they will adapt and also they are not scarred as the previous guys. If you go back and look starting from South African series every country India has toured have prepared extra juicy green wickets just to exploit the weakness of our batting.

[Sehwag1830]

Yes Bradman had a very excellent test record on turning tracks. The only meaningless record is Bradman's batting average against county level attacks in 2 countries.

[panther]

If you make green tracks in india the team that bowls first will almost always win after 2 days the pitch will go dry and flat and the ball will comes onto the bat nicely.

[Ultimate_Game]

So why were we proclaiming some of our batsmen are better than Bradmans and are world's best and thumping our chests when these guys get some meaning less records. It is not to appease anybody it is for betterment of our cricket in general and changing the mindset of both batsmen and bowlers. The planning you are saying should happen but it may or may not happen.But these changing wickets at test level can definitely happen, let our new generation of middle order learn to play on fast wickets if they are good they will adapt and also they are not scarred as the previous guys. If you go back and look starting from South African series every country India has toured have prepared extra juicy green wickets just to exploit the weakness of our batting.

Indian players better than Bradman is a view supported by a few, not all and yeah not everybody cares about X no. of 100s or X no. of runs stats/records. I would rather have more team records like max no. of Test wins, or max no. of World Cups, or the team with max no. of consecutive wins etc. My point is simply that you can't expect players who have come through various levels playing on turning/flat wickets and suddenly give them bouncy/pace friendly pitches at intl level. These conditions will be alien to them and they will fail and there's no point doing so. If we have to get better we will need to have a co-ordinated plan with the help of all state associations. We will need to prepare such tracks in under-age cricket and for all domestic tourneys. Once that happens you will start seeing batsmen who can play in such conditions along with good fast bowlers emerge in a few years. Again this approach will take a few years (10-12 at the minimum) for it to show results when we see the next generation raised on such sporting pitches come into the national team. But that's long term planning which BCCI, and Indians in general, are not good at. We are short sighted and extremely tactical by nature and love to find a loop/work-around for any problem.

[Trichromatic]

So why were we proclaiming some of our batsmen are better than Bradmans and are world's best and thumping our chests when these guys get some meaning less records. It is not to appease anybody it is for betterment of our cricket in general and changing the mindset of both batsmen and bowlers. The planning you are saying should happen but it may or may not happen.But these changing wickets at test level can definitely happen, let our new generation of middle order learn to play on fast wickets if they are good they will adapt and also they are not scarred as the previous guys. If you go back and look starting from South African series every country India has toured have prepared extra juicy green wickets just to exploit the weakness of our batting.

Cricket is so good to watch because there are different types of tracks. India should prepare turners instead of flat tracks. Talks about our inability to play green tracks has been going on for long time. When India toured NZ in 2002, they prepared probably most pacer-friendly pitches that I have seen. They won the series and everyone started saying everything about batsmen. Like they have to learn shot selection, handling swing bowling etc. Later same batsmen toured other countries and scored runs everywhere - Aus, SA, England etc. Not being able to play in alien condition is not unique just to India. Every country has same problem. In 2000s our batting was probably best for away conditions, but none of them played domestic cricket on fast pitches. If a batsman is good then he will perform everywhere. As U_G said, India should make changes at domestic level. There should be all types of pitches in a country. England for ex - they have flat tracks, then pacer friendly nottingham and turner like oval.

[vvvslaxman]

So why were we proclaiming some of our batsmen are better than Bradmans and are world's best and thumping our chests when these guys get some meaning less records. It is not to appease anybody it is for betterment of our cricket in general and changing the mindset of both batsmen and bowlers. The planning you are saying should happen but it may or may not happen.But these changing wickets at test level can definitely happen, let our new generation of middle order learn to play on fast wickets if they are good they will adapt and also they are not scarred as the previous guys. If you go back and look starting from South African series every country India has toured have prepared extra juicy green wickets just to exploit the weakness of our batting.

Do you see England, Australia, SA trying to make turning tracks to unearth a great spinner. Good batsmen adapt to different conditions. Good bowlers adapt to different conditions.

[ShebbySB]

I'm okay if we keep pwning other teams on turners. But BCCI should preapare good tracks(help for both pacers and spinners) for Ranji games. That's the place, from where players can learn and work on their technique.

:dito:

[deathmonger]

Where our spinners feel as if they are great bowlers when bowling to on conducive dustbowls and will be found out when they tour abroad with no clue what do to get wickets. Our so called fast bowlers will be passengers who will be just filling in numbers to make the playing 11. Our batsmen will be sitting ducks when they tour outside sub continent.We have been trying to reverse the trend for two decades . 0-8 should not be the reason to go back to tracks where our batsmen score tons of runs on these kind of tracks but the minute the land anywhere with tinge of green even if that track is in India they are shi*t scared to play. Let these young guys play on sporting wickets and let them develop the ability to play everywhere and let our spinners learn how to take wickets on sporting wickets. I think especially against weak teams we should be playing on green tops in India with only one spinner. let our batsmen get better and our fast bowlers will have something to bowl, it is just ridiculous that both Zak and Yadav bowled just eight overs that too with new ball. Our pitches should assist spinners but not the extent where fast bowlers become just passengers.If they cant swing the new ball then what is the point of them playing at all. Even if we are winning matches like this one where spinners take 20 wickets, are we gaining any benefits in the long term.

why so much self hatred. england does the same thing. wins at home with green pitches then gets murdered in sc. u ever seen them say anything like this? they say we are best team in world, no 1 team etc.

[Ultimate_Game]

Between we need to learn not to apologise for our success. There's nothing to be ashamed of to make the most of our strength.