India should play five bowlers - Chappell

[tweaker]

The team should be Vijay,Rahul,Pujara,Kohli,Rahane,Raina,Saha,Axar,Ashwin,Yadav,Aaron.

[express bowling]

-- About one and a half years back, our bowling unit's problem was .....not even bowling that surprise bouncer ....let's say 1 per over on an average. -- Now, our problem is bowling too many attempted bouncers....most of the times , Dhoni was wanting 6 bouncers an over. Even if someone is trying the bouncer strategy, combining them with a couple of yorkers would bring best results ...because 6 bouncers become too predictable. -- I agree completely. Our young quicks should go for 4 or 5 deliveries that are good length + channel. 1 or atmost 2 bouncers in an over...mostly just 1 bouncer. That bouncer must be bowled with effort, should be high and directed around the batsman's head. -- Whenever in trouble, just bowl good length + channel.

[express bowling]

I complete agree with the OP and Chappell. Our bowlers have bowled bad line and length BUT the main reason for that is because the captain wanted them to bowl too many bouncers. This has made it very difficult for them to bowl good areas at other times. It is near impossible for young pacers to make that change as an when required. Our young pace bowlers would perform much better than they have if the captain encourages them to bowl good length + channel punctuated by surprise bouncers.

[express bowling]

biggest problem is cleaning up the tail' date='if it can be done even these bowlers with all these problems will look better.[/quote'] If we study great bowlers who have knocked off tail -enders regularly and quickly..... They have basically attacked the stumps. You miss I hit. Tailenders have a habit of missing many deliveries. Hence, this strategy comes in handy. Kumble, Akram, Waqar, Steyn etc. do just this. Our bowlers typically bowl either bouncers or outswingers to tailenders. These guys usually miss even the good deliveries but, because they are not aimed at the stumps by our pacers ...the lower order batters play on. I would call it bad strategy by our pacers as well as team management.

[Lord]

If we study great bowlers who have knocked off tail -enders regularly and quickly..... They have basically attacked the stumps. You miss I hit. Tailenders have a habit of missing many deliveries. Hence, thus strategy comes in handy. Kumble, Akram, Waqar, Steyn etc. do just this. Our bowlers typically bowl either bouncers or outswingers to tailenders. These guys usually miss even the good deliveries but, because they are not aimed at the stumps by our pacers ...the lower order batters play on. I would call it bad strategy by our pacers as well as team management.

Exactly this is basic stuff.I don't think bowlers should need anyone to tell this

[kosingh]

This short bowling crap seems to have increased even more after ishant's 7 wicket haul in England-- where he got all wickets with short balls, but not necessarily brilliant short balls. England basically threw their wickets away. Ever since that match, we've decided that short bowling is our biggest strength and we must send 5 bouncers an over -- even if they're 128 km bouncers way outside off stump, or tennis ball bounce shirt balls down the leg side.

[ThePhenomenal1]

Even aussies know that 4 bowlers isn't enough these days. You need 5 and that includes a guy like watson/marsh. We should move ashwin to 7, get axar in and thats it. 3 quicks and 2 spinners.

[express bowling]

agree ' date='but even if they bowl like they do to the top order they will do well,i feel they give up too quickly toward the end.[/quote'] They may do better than what they are doing now. But , why not try the time tested formula of bowling at the off and middle stumps ? Tailenders usually miss the great outswingers / really good outgoing balls ...can't even edge them.

[Forever Indian]

These are the scores of India's no.6 batsmen in this series - 43, 6, 32, 0, 3, 1 with an avg of 14.17. I think any 5th bowler who can bat a bit will have more average than this. As an example Bhuvi averages 25 with the bat in tests till now, and even Ashwin who has had an average series with bat averages 21 with bat in the 2 tests he played in this series.

[Vijy]

These are the scores of India's no.6 batsmen in this series - 43, 6, 32, 0, 3, 1 with an avg of 14.17. I think any 5th bowler who can bat a bit will have more average than this. As an example Bhuvi averages 25 with the bat in tests till now, and even Ashwin who has had an average series with bat averages 21 with bat in the 2 tests he played in this series.

Yep. Play 5 bowlers and get rid of the No. 6 bat. Have Ashwin play at 6, Saha at 7, Bhuvi at 8 in the future. At 9, we can have another all-rounder if necessary - Rishi Dhawan, Akshar, Rassool, etc

[TheWall]

India needs to take 20 wkts to win... its doesn't matter how much u score...

[express bowling]

Do we have a proper batsman who is a decent bowler too. No.6 is a batsman's spot and should not go to a bowler who can bat.

[youngindia]

The "world class startegists" of icf have discovered after 140 years of test cricket that 5th bowler is like a magic potion....he brings extra ordinary power. he can give rest and energy to aaron and umesh..so that in a matter of minutes umesh aaron will bowl like McGrath and Gillespie and will thrash all opposition in sight according to other geniuses here, the extra bowler will bring a bucketful of wickets...possibly he has a magic bucket ashwin will take on no 7 or no 5 battin gpositions or what not....so prodigious is his battnig talent that a world has not seen this all versatile allrounder before pity that our team management didn't hear out these wannabe einsteins and clausewitzes on icf and end our 15 years of overseas drought in 86-01 :hysterical:...after all if they played a extra bowler, 20 wickets would have fell in a heap! I would place a good bet that these people are a fan of movies like nayak anil kapoor issues dismissal letter to corrupt people....errant people dismissed ... problem solved!! :hysterical: pity I was not an intellectual giant who could not anticpate the magical powers of rest,wickets,energy provided by the 5th bowler

[Old guy]

The "world class startegists" of icf have discovered after 140 years of test cricket that 5th bowler is like a magic potion....he brings extra ordinary power. he can give rest and energy to aaron and umesh..so that in a matter of minutes umesh aaron will bowl like McGrath and Gillespie and will thrash all opposition in sight according to other geniuses here, the extra bowler will bring a bucketful of wickets...possibly he has a magic bucket ashwin will take on no 7 or no 5 battin gpositions or what not....so prodigious is his battnig talent that a world has not seen this all versatile allrounder before pity that our team management didn't hear out these wannabe einsteins and clausewitzes on icf and end our 15 years of overseas drought in 86-01 :hysterical:...after all if they played a extra bowler, 20 wickets would have fell in a heap! I would place a good bet that these people are a fan of movies like nayak anil kapoor issues dismissal letter to corrupt people....errant people dismissed ... problem solved!! :hysterical: pity I was not an intellectual giant who could not anticpate the magical powers of rest,wickets,energy provided by the 5th bowler

You always post this but never reply when someone posts facts .. I am not even gonna try this time but this is professional crickete you are flaking about now and keep in mind when marsh got injured Australia had Watson and still 5 bowlers and yet they whined hat we got hampered and had to bowl more because of injury :winky:

[velu]

i am against 5 bowlers .. our 4 bowlers cant buy wickets to save their life

[youngindia]

You always post this but never reply when someone posts facts ..

"facts"? that wouldn't have left me banging my head ...the irrationality level had reached crescendo and the amount of baseless speculation was breaking all records. :--D the fact is there is no evidence 5 proper bowlers had solved our bowling problems before in recent decades or helped us take 20 wickets...infact it has proved an infeasible approach and deployed very rarely.. so what facts are you going to come with? don't go into another round of useless speculation about rest,blah blah again....as for the injury issue, find the answer yourself..

[Old guy]

"facts"? that wouldn't have left me banging my head ...the irrationality level had reached crescendo and the amount of baseless speculation was breaking all records. :--D the fact is there is no evidence 5 proper bowlers had solved our bowling problems before in recent decades or helped us take 20 wickets...infact it has proved an infeasible approach and deployed very rarely.. so what facts are you going to come with? don't go into another round of useless speculation about rest,blah blah again....as for the injury issue, find the answer yourself..

It is deployed by every test playing nation playing cricket now and it is a fact . Every expert right now agrees this is where india has disadvantage Another fact is out number 6 batsman has averaged 14 yes 14 in this series ! Another fact is we are forced bowl our freaking keeper in almost every test series because we want to rest out bowlers ..,the scene of dhoni bowling depresses me more than anything else we do on away tours .. And it's not useless speculation Australia cannot even bowl properly with Watson as all rounder and we expect our 3 quick bowlers to do all the bowling it's not feasible and every other country in world knows this and plays 4 quicks when track demands it . I already explained you how it's different at home and how it's not issue when we play in India but away from home you won't find single team in world which plays 1 seamer other than india not 1 team in world ..how do you explain that ? And what have we achieved in our history with 4 bow,era every match we win is either on bowling track where 3 quicks don't have to bowl much and just tell me how doing same thing and losing again and again by playing number 6 batsman who averages 14 is good idea ? That alone is reason enough to try something else ..

[vvvslaxman]

The "world class startegists" of icf have discovered after 140 years of test cricket that 5th bowler is like a magic potion....he brings extra ordinary power. he can give rest and energy to aaron and umesh..so that in a matter of minutes umesh aaron will bowl like McGrath and Gillespie and will thrash all opposition in sight according to other geniuses here, the extra bowler will bring a bucketful of wickets...possibly he has a magic bucket ashwin will take on no 7 or no 5 battin gpositions or what not....so prodigious is his battnig talent that a world has not seen this all versatile allrounder before pity that our team management didn't hear out these wannabe einsteins and clausewitzes on icf and end our 15 years of overseas drought in 86-01 :hysterical:...after all if they played a extra bowler, 20 wickets would have fell in a heap! I would place a good bet that these people are a fan of movies like nayak anil kapoor issues dismissal letter to corrupt people....errant people dismissed ... problem solved!! :hysterical: pity I was not an intellectual giant who could not anticpate the magical powers of rest,wickets,energy provided by the 5th bowler

Loading the side with batsmen will somehow get us 20 wickets.. thanks genius :cantstop: While we are at it we shall go with 11 batsmen..

[youngindia]

It is deployed by every test playing nation playing cricket now and it is a fact . ..

guys like boycott would differ on the same...' Depends on variables...how any team can play the 5th bowler without a feasible allround option? and more importantly what have they achieved? did kallis,Pollock and klusener help SA achieve undisputed no 1 status? often they were defeated by Australia employing only 4 bowlers. there are many scorecards where teams with 4 bowlers have defeated teams with 5-6 bowlers For decades Australia didn't have a Watson..they did just fine I guess :winky: even with gilchrist at no 7 they didn't play 5 bowlers and there were guys like bichel in the wings so why this unwarranted craze about allrounders ? I can play 7 batsmen and 4 bowlers for the same result strategy is about immersing yourself in the realities of indian cricket and its team ... And that's when you are in the best position to come with a quality strategy..we can borrow lessons from others occasionally, provided its high quality and can help us improve our performance Otherwise its about indian cricket. As you can see despite the repeated pronouncements of gavaskar,dravid and so many players, they have failed to deploy it. they have failed for one reason --its not feasible...6 batsmen is a must and for india it makes even less sense. we produce quality batting talent and have to rely on our stronger arm the case is open and shut for me..batting is our strength and we deploy it to the full extent possible. this comes under my "fill in the matchwinners and fill in the blanks" approach international cricket rewards those who worry about matchwinners and brilliant players MOST guys who worry about 5th bowler and balance will burn themselves like dhoni or come second like SA!

[Old guy]

guys like boycott would differ on the same...' Depends on variables...how any team can play the 5th bowler without a feasible allround option? and more importantly what have they achieved? did kallis,Pollock and klusener help SA achieve undisputed no 1 status? often they were defeated by Australia employing only 4 bowlers. there are many scorecards where teams with 4 bowlers have defeated teams with 5-6 bowlers For decades Australia didn't have a Watson..they did just fine I guess :winky: even with gilchrist at no 7 they didn't play 5 bowlers and there were guys like bichel in the wings so why this unwarranted craze about allrounders ? I can play 7 batsmen and 4 bowlers for the same result strategy is about immersing yourself in the realities of indian cricket and its team ... And that's when you are in the best position to come with a quality strategy..we can borrow lessons from others occasionally, provided its high quality and can help us improve our performance Otherwise its about indian cricket. As you can see despite the repeated pronouncements of gavaskar,dravid and so many players, they have failed to deploy it. they have failed for one reason --its not feasible...6 batsmen is a must and for india it makes even less sense. we produce quality batting talent and have to rely on our stronger arm the case is open and shut for me..batting is our strength and we deploy it to the full extent possible. this comes under my "fill in the matchwinners and fill in the blanks" approach international cricket rewards those who worry about matchwinners and brilliant players MOST guys who worry about 5th bowler and balance will burn themselves like dhoni or come second like SA!

Yar I am not saying 4 bowlers do not work they do if 2 of them are warne and McGrath with decent part timers like Lehman and few others but you just cannot ignore that cricket today is played on flatter tracks with tighter schedule and even teams like Australia who played and succeeded with 4 bowlers play 5 or 6 bowlers My entire argument is number 6 won't help you when top order did nothing we do to have quality there ashwin averaged more than 20 while number 6 average is 14 ...why not play him there as bowling all rounder and play 4 quicks . We have gottent harem down to 6 wickets to get tired and throw away key moment because bowlers get tired and are not able to continue bowling and par timers and spinner shave to chip in and that lets batsman get set it has happened again and again over years and not coincidence Some days Aussie bowlers like,Johnson only bowled 15 overs siddle bow,ed 10 overs can we afford that with 3 quicks ? They are forced to bowl more overs compared to other team how can we expect them to maintain same intensity as Australians ? You give example of Australians please tell me why they played guys like symounds ...why same Australian side after 5 or so years plays 5 bowlers ? Why should we imitate Australians when they themselves do not Imitate them ..,why should we ignore what all other teams are doing right now ,every team in world is doing right now and doing it more successfully than us and imitate what Aussies did decade ago ? Like I said 4 bowlers will work at home but what is the sixth batsman adding here ? 14 runs ?! I can understand if number 6 was saving us in every game by scoring 100 but could not even win us match at winning position in Adelaide ...