panther Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 He fought the British sided with the French.Choosing one imperialistic power over other.He did the right thing he was the last great Muslim king of India, it's a shame but one day we will rule again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diga Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 Google Karnad and Bhyrappa to know more about what some real "Indian" historians say about Tipu. SL Bhyrappa who is mostly apolitical has been painted as a Sanghi by these communist influenced Congi favored writers. No wonder Karnad got Jnanapeeth award and SL Bhyrappa , altho being senior and more popular has been sidelined by Sahitya academy. Aavarana written by SL Bhyrappa which has been well researched paints the tyranny of muslim invaders and psuedo patriots like Tipu. Always trust regional writers, historians on Indian history than some western one who always will have yesmen advisors. I think there is an urgent need for rewriting our text books in this context... nice article on the samehttp://indiafacts.co.in/indian-history-textbooks-are-needed-to-be-rewritten-now/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 I think there is an urgent need for rewriting our text books in this context... nice article on the samehttp://indiafacts.co.in/indian-history-textbooks-are-needed-to-be-rewritten-now/ On this subject, there is a very famous narration from SLB on NCERT directive and how it works on setting content for history in school books:https://bharatabharati.wordpress.com/2012/05/22/distorting-indian-history-s-l-bhyrappa/There is nothing worse than corruption of mind, especially those of young children. When it comes to how Buddhism lost it's appeal, it was conveniently blamed on brahmins while Ambedkar himself writes that it could be because of muslim rulers killing monks and priests and destroying universities (stupas) , who then had to flee to Tibet and Nepal. At that time I was a reader in Educational Philosophy at NCERT and was selected as one of the five members of the committee. In our first meeting Mr. Parthasarathy, as Chairman of the committee explained the purpose of our committee in typically diplomatic language: “It is our duty not to sow the seeds of thorns in the minds of the growing children which will grow up as barriers to national integration. Such thorns are found mostly in the history courses. Occasionally we can find them in language and social science courses also. We have to weed them out. We have to include only such thoughts that go towards inculcating the concept of national integration firmly in the minds of our children. This committee carries this great responsibility.”The other four members were nodding respectfully. But I said, “Sir, I am unable to understand your words. Will you please explain with a few illustrations?” The Chairman responded: “Ghazni Mohammed looted the Somnath Temple, Aurangzeb built mosques by demolishing the temples in Kashi and Mathura, he collected jizya — is it possible to build a strong India under the present circumstances by conveying such useless facts? What purpose do they serve, other than generating hatred?”“But are they not historical truths?” I persisted.“Plenty of truths are there. Using these truths judiciously is the wise way to teach history,” he retorted. The remaining four members simply nodded their heads saying “Yes, yes.” But I was not prepared to let him off.“You yourself gave examples of Kashi and Mathura. Even today, lakhs of pilgrims from all corners of the country visit these places every year. They can see for themselves the huge mosques built using the walls, pillars and columns that once belonged to demolished temples. They can also see a recently built cow shed like shack in a corner, behind the mosque, that serves as their temple. All these pilgrims are distressed to witness such awful structures. They describe the plight of their temples to their relatives after they return home. Can this create national integration? You can hide such history in the school texts. But can we hide such facts when these children go on excursions and see the truth for themselves? Researchers have listed more than thirty thousand such ruined temples in India. Can we hide them all?…”Mr. Parthasarthy interrupted me and asked: “You are a professor of Philosphy. Can you please tell us what is the purpose of history?”“Nobody can define the purpose of history. We do not know how the things will shape up because of the development of science and technology in the future. Some western thinkers might call it the philosophy of history. But such thoughts are futile. Our discussion here should be — what is the purpose of teachinghistory? History is seeking out the truths about our past events, learning about ancient human lives by studying the inscriptions, records, literary works, relics, artefacts etc. We should learn also not to commit the same blunders that our predecessors committed. We have to imbibe the noble qualities that they adopted; historical truths help us to learn all these things.”“What if this search for truth hurts the feelings of the minority? Can we divide society? Can we sow the seeds of poison?” He tried to stop me with these questions.“Sir, the categorisation on the lines of majority and minority would itself be dividing the society, or at least a step towards dividing the society. This idea of ‘seeds of poison’ is prejudiced. Why should the minority think of Gazni Mohammed and Aurangzeb as their own people and heroes? Mughal kingdom was destroyed by the religious bigotry of Aurangzeb. It was at its height in Akbar’s time because his policy of tolerance led to religious and social harmony. Can’t we teach such lessons to children without offending the historical truths? Before teaching the lessons to be learnt from the history, should we not explain the historical truths? This idea of hiding true history is driven politics. This trend will not last long. Whether they are minority or majority, if the education does not impart the character to face the truth with emotional maturity, such education is meaningless and also dangerous.” I replied.Parthasarathy agreed. He said he appreciated my scholarship and the ability to think clearly. During the lunch break he called me aside, indicated his closeness to me by placing his hand on my shoulders. He then said with a winning smile: “What you say is correct academically. You go and write an article about what you said. But when the government formulates a policy covering the whole nation, it has to consider the interests of all the people. Intellectually pure principles do not serve any purpose.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 Thank you! It's stupid to look at medieval kings through a modern prism. That is something I've been consistently posting about whenever the Sanghis choose to do so. Tipu like any other medieval King was patriotic to his own kingdom - Hindu or Muslim. To portray Shivaji and Tipu as some patriots is nuts, as is this decision by KA govt.Shivaji was trying to unite Marathas (who were majority in the area) and Tipu was trying to establish his Islamic kingdom in a land where there were majority of Hindus at that time. There is a difference between the two. Shivaji is a regional hero for Hindus/Marathas, not a freedom fighter as Tipu is made out to be, by the pinkies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkt.india Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 (edited) Thank you! It's stupid to look at medieval kings through a modern prism. That is something I've been consistently posting about whenever the Sanghis choose to do so. Tipu like any other medieval King was patriotic to his own kingdom - Hindu or Muslim. To portray Shivaji and Tipu as some patriots is nuts, as is this decision by KA govt.A patriotic person wont kill people of his territory while he was killing Hindus. He killed them just because they were not of religion. Can you deny that? Hindus of that place alone arent protesting this but christian as well whom he destroyed. Edited November 13, 2015 by rkt.india Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulbul Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 A patriotic person wont kill people of his territory while he was killing Hindus. He killed them just because they were not of religion. Can you deny that? Hindus of that pace alone arent protesting this but christian as well whom he destroyed.As per intellectualism Hindu lives doesn't matter much as there so ma ny of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singh bling Posted November 13, 2015 Author Share Posted November 13, 2015 Thank you! It's stupid to look at medieval kings through a modern prism. That is something I've been consistently posting about whenever the Sanghis choose to do so. Tipu like any other medieval King was patriotic to his own kingdom - Hindu or Muslim. To portray Shivaji and Tipu as some patriots is nuts, as is this decision by KA govt.Maharaja Ranjit Singh fought muslims all his life yet there is no instance where he massacred them , There is no instance he converted them by force.We have to choose which King , Hindu , Muslim or Sikh to celebrate or not on the basis of the records how he treated people. Anybody who massacred or forcibly converted should never be celebrated.BTW you believe that any king that fought with britishers should be considered patriot, But there are so many kings from Sirjudaullah to Bahadur shah Zafar who fought with Britishers why only Tipu? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoda-esque Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 Well people have defended Aurangzeb here lol,yeh Tipu kya cheez hai?Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jalebi_bhai Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 The Congress is finished in Karnataka. That's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jalebi_bhai Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 As per intellectualism Hindu lives doesn't matter much as there so ma ny of them.You know and I know how we Karnatakans feel about Tipu.Christians and Hindus from Karnataka and Kerala absolutely hate the despot. Wannabe intellectuals can keep serving themselves their khayali pulao. Only certified psychopaths would admire Tipu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abhilash93 Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Thank you! It's stupid to look at medieval kings through a modern prism. That is something I've been consistently posting about whenever the Sanghis choose to do so. Tipu like any other medieval King was patriotic to his own kingdom - Hindu or Muslim. To portray Shivaji and Tipu as some patriots is nuts, as is this decision by KA govt.What act of barbarism targeting common people did Shivaji commit that can even remotely be compared to Tipu Sultan ?Pl. read some history before comparing Tipu Sultan to Shivaji. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 3 people have died because of a needless event started by Sidda, but nobody in MSM cares and there is no accountability. If it was done by a BJP govt, we would have have heard about it for days. Not even a bare mention of criticism from media. Truly sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulbul Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 3 people have died because of a needless event started by Sidda, but nobody in MSM cares and there is no accountability. If it was done by a BJP govt, we would have have heard about it for days. Not even a bare mention of criticism from media. Truly sad.Nothing new, our MSM & intellectuals always maintain a neutral stand when it comes to Hindu's who is getting affected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Looks like some Sanghis have advised me to read history. History isn't what is taught in Shakhas. I've read works from Brittlebank, Dalrymple, Gordon, Laine, Thapar etc. on these topics and am merely paraphrasing their deductions. These are people associated with some of the best institutions in the world committed to academic rigor and accuracy. I understand it's fashionable in the Sangh to look down upon the top institutions in the world as being beacons of western conspiracy to deride India, but that's not how the real world works. Which is also why the jaahil 'historians' of the Sanghi brand are laughed upon by anyone familiar with the process of following scientific rigor and thought.Some counter advise- get out of the Sanghi indoctrination and explore the accurate world based on peer review, historical rigor and scientific process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Maharaja Ranjit Singh fought muslims all his life yet there is no instance where he massacred them , There is no instance he converted them by force.We have to choose which King , Hindu , Muslim or Sikh to celebrate or not on the basis of the records how he treated people. Anybody who massacred or forcibly converted should never be celebrated.BTW you believe that any king that fought with britishers should be considered patriot, But there are so many kings from Sirjudaullah to Bahadur shah Zafar who fought with Britishers why only Tipu? I consider Tipu to be a patriot for his kingdom and not for India. Obviously, he was a patriot for his kingdom because he was its king unless you are suggesting he conspired to destroy his own kingdom. My earlier statement was to point out the hollowness of the Sanghi logic which seeks to introduce concepts about patriotism towards India to an era where the concept of India did not eve exist - for Tipu, Shivaji, Aurangzeb no one. And Ashoka should be the first one struck off the list of people being celebrated based on your criteria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 A patriotic person wont kill people of his territory while he was killing Hindus. He killed them just because they were not of religion. Can you deny that? Hindus of that place alone arent protesting this but christian as well whom he destroyed.Yes I can deny that. His motivations for killing Hindus was political. Not only me most top historians of the world also deny that he killed Hindus because of their religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singh bling Posted November 15, 2015 Author Share Posted November 15, 2015 I consider Tipu to be a patriot for his kingdom and not for India. Obviously, he was a patriot for his kingdom because he was its king unless you are suggesting he conspired to destroy his own kingdom. My earlier statement was to point out the hollowness of the Sanghi logic which seeks to introduce concepts about patriotism towards India to an era where the concept of India did not eve exist - for Tipu, Shivaji, Aurangzeb no one. And Ashoka should be the first one struck off the list of people being celebrated based on your criteria.Ashoka is famous for his change of heart and not because of massacres O/W he was just a tyrant and nothing should be celebrated about him. As far being being Patriot is concerned , almost 100% of kings were patriots to their kingdom barring few exceptions.Infact big evils like Hitler were biggest patriots to their nations .Nothing special in this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diga Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 History is mostly written from the point of view of the winner... Scientific rigour also mandates that one considers all the sources before discarding one or the other. Dont tell me that the libtards are not aware of manipulation of history. Read some of the local authors who are in no way connected to sangh before dismissing them as absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Excellent piece in dailyo on reclaiming the Intellect. Indic studies normally get linked to right wing propaganda. It is sad that Indian civilization that survived 5000 years need to not studied to a large extent in India. Indian philosophy as written in vedas, puranas are as deep as Plato or Aristotle , very few have gone on to study them for modern understanding. There is abundance of philisophy in Sanskrit works of Kalidasa, Jaydeva, Bhasa etc. that needs to be included in studies at university level. http://www.dailyo.in/politics/modi-in-uk-anish-kapoor-article-guardian-hindu-taliban-isis-irfan-habib-left-liberals/story/1/7422.htmlThe post-Independence India could not rid itself of this mindset. Nehru-Indira governments gave ample space to Leftist-Marxist discourse and institutions like JNU churned out thousands of bureaucrats, academics, journalists and activists with "left-liberal" leaning. Over a period of time, the Left discourse elbowed out the Indic intellectual ecosystem which was shunned as regressive and backward.Even today the course on Indian philosophy is not taught in JNU and the proposal for a centre on Sanskrit and Yoga studies is met with stern resistance. It is this intellectual tradition that convinces people like Anish Kapoor and Irfan Habib that the Indian civilisation has forever been exploitative and hence the need to stitch up a new system with no Indic traces.According to this line of thought Sanskrit is the road to conservatism and Brahmanical dominance. The theory of a terrible Brahmanical regime thus comes to be accepted as a fact and often dangled as a fearsome consequence of faith in the Indic system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adi B Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Hate these sickular leftist,please continue to appease that particular community even more and get your ass handed on plate again in the next gs!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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