500 & 1000 rs notes stopped from tonight

[Singh bling]

8 minutes ago, randomGuy said:

^ bro...we have arnd 40 notes of 100 at the moment...I think 100 re. notes are aplenty.

 

Let's say 19 billion new notes of 100 only : means 1900/30 = 63 notes per family of 4 people if i am not wrong.

 

what do u say?

Most notes that were printed is of 2000 denomination

[randomGuy]

33 minutes ago, Singh bling said:

Most notes that were printed is of 2000 denomination

I don't think so bro. 1900 cr X 2000 = 38 lac crore. But we need only 4 lac crore using 2000 notes.

 

These notes are of 100, 50, 20 and 10. These notes were already kept aside (for the usual day-to-day process of replacing purane kate-fate 100 Re. notes with the new ones). But suddenly demonetisation move came and all these new notes were released at once.

 

 

[randomGuy]

google Pakistani fake currency printer javed khanani. he committed suicide after demonetisation.

[tweaker]

The Income Tax department today recovered at least Rs 106 crore cash, including Rs 10 crore in new currency, and 127 kgs of gold bars in searches at multiple locations in the city to check instances of tax evasion post demonetisation.

 

This is the largest seizure of new currency notes post demonetisation. The I-T operation had been launched yesterday here.

"127 kg gold in 1 kg bars and 96 crore in old currency and Rs 10 crore in Rs 2,000 notes has been seized by the sleuths after the operation," top I-T department officials said.

[tweaker]

Faced with chaos after eliminating India’s highest value rupee notes, Prime Minister Narendra Modi has roped in a billionaire from the ranks of his adversaries to help. 

 

Nandan Nilekani, a high-profile member of the opposition Indian National Congress party, has joined a committee to map a path to digital payments. India is trying to end its reliance on cash, especially in rural areas where almost every transaction is done in hard currency. It’s not the first time the former head of outsourcing giant Infosys Ltd. has tackled a national project -- he spearheaded the country’s biometrics-based Aadhaar unique identity program. 

[vayuu1]

http://blogs.economictimes.indiatimes.com/et-commentary/79357/

This could be really interesting

Sent from my SM-N900 using Tapatalk

[vayuu1]

GoI claims demonetisation to be a crackdown on black money and to stop counterfeiting of banknotes. But what if the motive was to checkmate all previous governments that may have arm-twisted RBI to print more currency than accounted for in its books?

GoI has valued India’s cash economy at Rs 14 lakh crore in Rs 500 and Rs 1,000 notes. What if RBI, on any government’s insistence, had printed, say, Rs 18 lakh crore? So, currency above Rs 14 lakh crore, while not on RBI’s books, remains official and has a serial number. This can’t be ‘fake’ or ‘black’ money.



Let’s call it ‘extra’ money. Over the years, this ‘extra money’ has been in circulation through the banking channels. Every government’s statistics report shows that 0.028 per cent — about Rs 400 crore — is fake currency. How can one then explain the difference between this and the much higher volume of currency moving in the economy? If there is an asset-liability mismatch on RBI’s books, how will it hide it? For, if all this ‘extra currency’ comes into PSBs and they deposit it back at RBI, RBI then has to pay extra interest also on this extra liquidity.

It’s a different matter that GoI has a windfall gain and interest rates will collapse. But this could cast serious doubts on the integrity of previous governments and RBI.

Sent from my SM-N900 using Tapatalk

[Singh bling]

Quote

Black money estimates overshot as 82% of cash deposited in banks

About Rs12.6 trillion had been deposited into bank accounts as of 3 December

http://www.livemint.com/Industry/SmaP4M0Q6lf2nrpjnQTgGO/Black-money-estimates-overshot-as-82-of-cash-deposited-in-b.html?li_source=LI&li_medium=news_rec

 

[Singh bling]

Quote

India’s Hunt For Point of Sale Machines Hits A Roadblock In China

http://www.bloombergquint.com/business/2016/12/10/indias-hunt-for-point-of-sale-machines-hits-a-roadblock-in-china

 

[urbestfriend]

India is not a poor country. It is a country where laws have been made and perpetuated for the elite, and not for the laity. One hopes and prays that this changes. The demonetisation attack on black money is the first of many steps which Modi must take in order to dismantle the structures that serve elites more than the masses.

Tax-free agriculture income elite: Much has been written about the rampant misuse of tax-free status granted to a small farmer toiling in the fields, but abused by holders of black money to whitewash it. The amounts in 2010-11 and 2011-12 are staggering at ₹200 lakh crore and ₹687 lakh crore respectively! Juxtapose that to the ₹14 lakh crore which has been demonetised and it seems logical that the next point of investigation would be the eight lakh assessees who had declared these staggering amounts. They are the elites.

The big investor elite: Aided by clever lawyers and accountants, the big investor can happily use laws, treaties and structures to avoid tax. The double tax avoidance agreement (DTAA) with Mauritius is one such example. In the case of the Mauritius treaty, it ends up being a no-tax treaty, if the money is sent by a company registered in Mauritius and invested in Indian listed companies for more than a year. Moreover, it is repatriated in dollars.

And if the money comes in through P-Notes, via a sub account with a foreign institutional investor (FII), there is no need for KYC either.

The P-Note and the Mauritian special treatment must stop.

Scamsters and legal elites: We also have several examples of scamsters who, after having stolen thousands of crores, have enough moolah with them to subvert the wheels of justice. Aided, of course, by some lawyers for whom money is, both alphabetically and ethically, placed ahead of morality. Using this moolah, justice can be indefinitely delayed. Adjournments are granted ad nauseum, never mind the adage of delayed justice.

What else explains the trials that last decades, where verdicts are given long after the victims are dead? What else explains the plethora of reports sought in rather obvious cases, such as NSEL, and the multitude of committees, all of which report a fraud and seek action, but none is taken.

The political elite: There are over 1,900 political parties of which 400 have never fought any election! Anyone can start a political party and donations to it up to ₹20,000 a person are not questioned! This is why 400 parties have not ever fought an election. They are just laundering money and the system allows them to. They are elites.

Parliamentarians get a pension after serving one five-year term.

Army men qualify after 20 years. The former’s pay and perks are huge, and decided by themselves. It is not linked to inflation similar to the one laid for the laity.

The demonetisation step will help eradicate corruption only if special laws and rules for elites are removed and the inequality bred by them is reduced.

Let the inequality be the result of honest and hard work, not thanks to tax breaks and an impotent legal system.

Should action be taken by the government to dismantle the elite structures, stock markets would correct. That would be a time to buy.

In Karnataka many officials got caught with huge sums of money in new denominations..It came to know that offcials are involved in converting black money for Janardhan reddy. I hear many stories of money bags (with new notes) getting caught. At least 5 cases were reported in Bangalore ( read bangalore mirror ) where police themselves acted as commission agents and looted money. 

India's governance system is corrupt, only corrupt people can get in and they can find multiple ways to convert their black money. It is poor and middle class who stand in line for their own money. Untill we bring an effective judiciary which acts on common sense and punishes the culprits in time bound manner, nothing is going to change.

 

 

http://www.thehindubusinessline.com/markets/stock-markets/elites-vs-laity/article9420362.ece?homepage=true

[Haarkarjeetgaye]

12 hours ago, vayuu1 said:

GoI claims demonetisation to be a crackdown on black money and to stop counterfeiting of banknotes. But what if the motive was to checkmate all previous governments that may have arm-twisted RBI to print more currency than accounted for in its books?

GoI has valued India’s cash economy at Rs 14 lakh crore in Rs 500 and Rs 1,000 notes. What if RBI, on any government’s insistence, had printed, say, Rs 18 lakh crore? So, currency above Rs 14 lakh crore, while not on RBI’s books, remains official and has a serial number. This can’t be ‘fake’ or ‘black’ money.



Let’s call it ‘extra’ money. Over the years, this ‘extra money’ has been in circulation through the banking channels. Every government’s statistics report shows that 0.028 per cent — about Rs 400 crore — is fake currency. How can one then explain the difference between this and the much higher volume of currency moving in the economy? If there is an asset-liability mismatch on RBI’s books, how will it hide it? For, if all this ‘extra currency’ comes into PSBs and they deposit it back at RBI, RBI then has to pay extra interest also on this extra liquidity.

It’s a different matter that GoI has a windfall gain and interest rates will collapse. But this could cast serious doubts on the integrity of previous governments and RBI.

Sent from my SM-N900 using Tapatalk

could be. But surely RBI has lost credibility by letting government announce this move. The legal tender of 500 and 1000 was between RBI and person who holds. Government has no right to intervene. Secondly RBI has legally broken a tender abruptly. That is falling back on a signed promise. 

[Mariyam]

@urbestfriend funds via P-Notes have no need for a KYC? 

Edited December 10, 2016 by Mariyam

[mishra]

I have a theory about laks/crores of rs 2000/- notes caught at various locations. Banks are too easily traceable risky place to exchange.

 This money is coming from sources where 500/- 1000/- notes were still valid and 2000/- note has been used. So Transport department, government hospitals, railways, utility bills and probably medical stores are culprits here. These are the places where  few 2000/- notes would have started coming after first week of demonitisations. And lot of 2000/- rupee notes would have come in last few weeks.

These department are known too be filled with corrupt administration.  

[Singh bling]

Quote

Woman in bank queue dies of ‘heart attack’ in Ludhiana

Rani had been visiting the bank for four days to get cash to shop for her daughter’s wedding in February.

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/woman-in-bank-queue-dies-of-heart-attack-in-ludhiana/

This has nothing to do with demonitisation , poor woman was going for fun to stand in queue for four days

[mishra]

3 minutes ago, Singh bling said:

This has nothing to do with demonitisation , poor woman was going for fun to stand in queue for four days

Nope. Still nothing

[Haarkarjeetgaye]

12 hours ago, Singh bling said:

This has nothing to do with demonitisation , poor woman was going for fun to stand in queue for four days

I hope the government or whoever has taken this decision accepts responsibility of poor execution , in public and compensates these families. Whether this pain will result in a long term gain is debatable, but it has definitely inflicted pain on some families

[Singh bling]

Quote

Modi’s Note Ban May Spell Catastrophe for the BJP

BY PREM SHANKAR JHA ON 11/12/2016 • LEAVE A COMMENT

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Demonetisation has hit every sector of the economy from construction to automobile at the same time and its ripple effects are likely to be felt for months to come.

A farmer smoked while sitting on a sack of crops as he waited for customers in Sanand village on the outskirts of Ahmedabad, India, Nov. 15, 2016. Credit:Reuters/Amit Dave/File photo

Remember the old adage, ‘You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time?’ Narendra Modi’s government is reluctantly learning its truth now. Exactly a month after the sudden announcement of the demonetisation of Rs 500 and Rs 1000 notes, even the tame audio-visual media has, almost unanimously, turned against his government on this issue. Their consensus echoes an epitaph favoured by Bismarck, “ it was not a crime; it was a mistake”.

The mistake is so elementary that it leaves no room for doubt that Modi announced the demonetisation without consulting either the Reserve Bank of India or the economists in the finance ministry and NITI Aayog. One of the most basic equations in economic theory – MV=PT – seems to have been forgotten. It is the base of the quantity theory of money upon which the whole neoliberal macroeconomics of today rests.

In layman terms, the equation states that the money supply in an economy (M) multiplied by the number of times it changes hands in a year (V) equals the average price level (P) multiplied by the number of transactions (T) that take place during the year. PT is the gross revenue generated in the economy during the year. Take away double counting – the resale of intermediate goods from one producer to the next – and you arrive at the GDP of the country.

Neo-classical economists use it to show that if you double the money supply, prices will simply have to double in the long term. But implicit in this is the belief that the velocity of circulation of money is very stable as it reflects the culturally determined habits of saving and consumption, and will therefore remain unchanged. The volume of transactions in any given period is, therefore, constant.

This assumption does not, in fact, hold true all the time. In his book General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money, J.M. Keynes showed that in actual fact, V rises or falls depending on the optimism or pessimism about the future course of the economy. Thus prices can, in fact, increase ­– and output can respond – without an increase in money supply, and fall without a reduction in it. This is the basis of Keynes’ theory of the trade cycle, one of the two that together fully explain this endemic seesaw in a market economy.

But Keynes never envisaged the possibility that a government would, of its own volition, bring the circulation of money to a near halt and force V down close to zero. For, since anything multiplied by zero is zero, it would, therefore kill the market economy and drive it back to barter. That is precisely what the demonetisation is doing. For an already tottering economy, this is a disaster. For the political future of the BJP, it is a self-inflicted goal that may well cost it the match.

I got some idea of how much V had fallen after demonetisation when a sweet shop owner told me that on the day after demonetization, his sale had fallen from Rs 30,000-40,000 per day to a mere Rs 700. A bookshop owner in Connaught Place told a friend that his sales had fallen from Rs 20,000-30,000 a day to Rs 12,000 in the past month. A high-end optician in Khan Market, New Delhi told me that his sales had fallen by 25% in the past month. Automobile sales, which had been rising at 11% a year in the first half of the year, fell by 38% for Mahindra & Mahindra, 28% for Tata Motors, 20% for Hyundai and 22% for Renault in November. There is not a single retailer who does not have a similar story to tell.

If is the condition of demand in the urban areas, where more people have bank accounts and use credit cards, it is not hard to imagine what the situation is in rural areas where where moneylenders still meet four-fifths of the demand for credit, and nearly all the transactions are done in cash. Two-wheeler sales have fallen by 35-40% because 65% of all the sales are done in cash and tractor purchases have fallen by a whopping 63% because only farmers and a few construction companies buy them.

The worst affected sector is construction. After being starved for funds for nine years, the construction industry has been pushed further down by demonetisation. The immediate impact has been on employment, for not only is it India’s second largest employer – providing jobs to 45 million people – but since employment in agriculture stopped growing a decade and a half ago, it has also been the principal creator of new jobs.

But the bulk of its workers are migrants from other states who are paid by the day, or at best by the week, and they ask for their wages in cash. Therefore, in order to pay them, their employers need to maintain large daily stocks of cash. Those were the cash reserves that Modi made worthless overnight. What is worse, even their current overdraft facilities, and their bank deposits, are not available to them because the government has put a Rs 24,000 a day limit on all withdrawals.

Unsurprisingly, anecdotal evidence suggests that the industry has virtually ground to a halt. The employers’ shortage of cash has translated into a shortage of jobs and stalled construction. Earnings by have fallen by 80-90%. Until November 8, for instance, the mazdoor naka near the Madhuban garden in Bhandup in Mumbai was among the largest in the city, with nearly 500 construction workers thronging it every morning. On November 30, there was just a trickle of 30 workerswaiting hopefully for jobs there.

In desperation, more and more workers are accepting payment in the old currency notes, and sending a member of their family to queue in front of banks all day to exchange it for legal tender. But as the employment opportunities have continued to dwindle, an increased number have joined a return flow of migrants to their villages in order wait until the times get better. Bus companies that brought migrant workers from Orissa to Gujarat are now plying in the opposite direction. There is a similar return of migrant workers to Andhra and Telangana from Mumbai and other cities in Maharashtra, and now, increasingly, from Delhi, Uttar Pradesh, Bihar and Rajasthan.

Construction is not the only sector in which jobs have disappeared. A fortnight after demonetisation, the Engineering and Export Promotion Council estimated that more than 400,000 workers had been laid off in the textiles and garments industries and as many as 60,000 in the leather industry. These are only a few lightning flashes illuminating the storm that is enveloping India’s poor.

Demonetisation is also laying waste to small and medium-sized producers and artisans in the country. It has not even spared the service industries, for except in software and domestic service, income and employment in every other service industry is directly related to production in the primary and secondary sectors of the economy.

The story of a utensils manufacturer in Noida that has lost more than half of its employees is the story of hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions of SMEs all over the country. In the month after demonetisation his sales have dropped by 90% for only one dealer has placed orders with his company during this period. More than half of his 40 workers, nearly all of whom are migrants, have been forced to go home, a journey that the government is considerately facilitating by asking the railways to accept old currency notes.

He has so far been able to hold retain the remaining employees only because a grocery store has been willing to provide basic food on credit. But the latter’s finances are not endless either. What is more, the remaining workers still need some money to send home. So the company’s finance manager has been standing in bank queues until 1:30 p.m. every day to withdraw money. However, after ten days of doing so, he was unable to withdraw any cash.

Demonetisation has not even spared the service industries, for except in software and domestic service, income and employment in every other service industry is directly related to production in the primary and secondary sectors of the economy. An idea of the hardship and loss of employment that it is causing, even if it is temporary, may be had from the fact that 90% of the country’s 300 million workers are in the unorganised sector and, with few exceptions, are paid entirely in cash.

What Modi has inflicted on India, therefore, is far worse than a natural calamity or a recession. For the first hits only parts of a country, while the second often spares agriculture and exports. But demonetisation has hit every part of a country and every sector of an economy at the same time.

Today, as the data for November pours in, a few of the government’s spokespersons and apologists are still trying to minimise the damage demonetisation has done by quoting the data for the whole of November, not just slurring over the fact that the first eight days saw the small surge of demand that had begun in April, but also on last-minute festival season rush.

But the retail sales data for December confirm that the post-November 8 data cited above, that the decline in sales is continuing. Even the automobile sector, where cash is least used is still experiencing a shortfall of over 20%, and two wheeler sales remain down by half.

The government spokesperson is reassuring customers that that demand will bounce back as soon as the cash crisis is over, but while this happens in sales, production will have to wait for three months’ accumulation of inventories to be liquidated in order to revive.

So the impact of demonetisation will not end when the currency replacement is complete because of the ripple effects that the sudden, two-moth long contraction of demand has set off in the economy.

These effects that J.R. Hicks – another great 20th-century economist – dubbed the “accelerator,” are well known to any student who has studied his theory of trade Cycles. But if anyone in his government pointed them out to him, he chose not to listen.

As many experts have pointed out, not only was demonetisation unnecessary but also badly bungled. It was unnecessary because the government knew from its income tax raids that people hold merely 5-6% of their undeclared income in cash, and the balance is in gold, precious gems, real estate and benami shareholdings.

It was inept because not only had the government not printed the more than 20 billion new currency notes needed to replace the old, but it also changed their size to ensure that they could not be dispensed from the 150,000 ATMs in the country without extensive modifications. In the end, therefore, demonetisation has created no gainers, only losers. They now have two and a half more years to remember that they owe their hardships to a government and a prime minister who had promised them acche din, but has so far failed to deliver.

http://thewire.in/86086/modis-note-ban-may-spell-catastrophe-bjp/

This

[Singh bling]

Quote

Jobless, these labourers can barely get one meal a day

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Jobless-these-mazdoors-can-barely-get-one-meal-a-day/articleshow/55918186.cms

 

[G_B_]

hmm

 

only time will tell for sure, but in bypolls held across the country post demonetization BJP has performed extremely well.

 

That is an actual quantitative guideline as compared to an opinion.

 

India has a first past the post system. So long as 30% firmly believe in what Modi has done the BJP will sail through. The opposition is scattered on this issue be it Nitish or Patnaik. The assumption is the remaining 70% will vote for one party against the BJP which is just not the case.

 

Take UP, once again if there are no major alliances this effectively means BJP needs about 30% to form government or to do well. If India had a presidential system where every vote mattered then Modi was probably in trouble, assuming demonetization does not clear up.

 

The Samajwadi themselves are looking to extend the UP elections from Feb-March to March-April and have done this by announcing board exams in Feb-March period. By then demonetization will not be an issue.

 

In terms of medium term effects this will shave off 0.5-1% of growth in this financial year as per most reports I have read. However this can easily be recouped based on government spending which means the budget for 2017-2018 is probably going to define the long term gains. The NPA crisis is effectively over as well which means banks are going to start lending.

 

 

[BeautifulGame]

. The NPA crisis is effectively over as well which means banks are going to start lending.

 

 

Just curious.On what basis the NPA crisis is over ?