Dhoni should bat at number 4 or not be played

[maniac]

Just now, rkt.india said:

But stokes too hasn't done anything great despite batting at top 5. #7 will always be hot and miss. Even Pandya's good knocks came in when he batted up or he got to play more overs after a collapse.

England can afford players with X factor like Stokes because of their batting and bowling depth we can’t .

 

Are you telling me that Pandya has outperformed Stokes as a cricketer overall in internationals?

[maniac]

Summary of this thread: So we want Dhoni and Pandya promoted to 4 and 5 in slots of other specialist batsmen because they are consistently not delivering in their current roles ????

[rkt.india]

Just now, maniac said:

England can afford players with X factor like Stokes because of their batting and bowling depth we can’t .

 

Are you telling me that Pandya has outperformed Stokes as a cricketer overall in internationals?

In ODIs, for sure stokes isn't ahead and its not about what england can afford. It's about what bigger problems We have and Pandya isn't that because he has already showed match winning abilities and he will get better. We right now need to fill #4 and #5.

[Shunya]

With musical chair happening, its almost impossible to find a consistent guy. Still feel Dhoni can make it work as no.4. Though he must increase his SR which will happen. 

Our team management should define the roles so Dhoni as well as others like Pandya know and get into grove. Current situation is just giving practice to players but there is no exposure/experience being gained by the players for a defined role.

Only top 3 have been consistent because they have mastered their position playing same type of cricket. All others are just being randomly shuffled up and down which will always make middle order position very tough to bat. Even Kohli or Rohit playing up and down in 4 to 7 position will ruin their numbers.

 

Check out the stats of each player in last 2 years batting at #4-7. 

 

No 4 for India in Last 2 years

Overall figures

Player	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
Yuvraj Singh	10	9	1	358	150	44.75	367	97.54	1	1	0	45	7
HH Pandya	5	5	0	150	78	30.00	141	106.38	0	1	0	8	8
KD Karthik	5	5	3	142	64*	71.00	212	66.98	0	2	1	12	0
MS Dhoni	4	4	0	139	80	34.75	186	74.73	0	1	0	10	5
AM Rahane	4	3	0	98	79	32.66	114	85.96	0	1	0	6	2
MK Pandey	7	6	1	79	36	15.80	116	68.10	0	0	1	4	1
KM Jadhav	3	3	1	18	12	9.00	36	50.00	0	0	0	2	0
KL Rahul	2	1	0	17	17	17.00	24	70.83	0	0	0	2	0
AT Rayudu	1	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-

 

No.5 for India in last 2 years

Overall figures

Player	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
MS Dhoni	17	11	2	458	134	50.88	540	84.81	1	3	0	32	12
KM Jadhav	9	6	0	196	67	32.66	226	86.72	0	2	1	21	2
HH Pandya	5	5	2	75	30	25.00	63	119.04	0	0	0	3	5
MK Pandey	4	4	2	41	28*	20.50	65	63.07	0	0	1	5	0
AR Patel	1	1	0	38	38	38.00	40	95.00	0	0	0	3	1
KD Karthik	1	1	0	37	37	37.00	47	78.72	0	0	0	4	0
SS Iyer	1	1	0	18	18	18.00	21	85.71	0	0	0	2	0
Yuvraj Singh	1	1	0	14	14	14.00	10	140.00	0	0	0	1	0
KL Rahul	1	1	0	7	7	7.00	8	87.50	0	0	0	0	0
V Kohli	1	1	0	4	4	4.00	2	200.00	0	0	0	1	0

 

No.6 for India in last 2 years

Overall figures

Player	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
KM Jadhav	16	10	3	399	120	57.00	310	128.70	1	1	0	40	11
MS Dhoni	16	12	7	374	79	74.80	484	77.27	0	3	0	30	6
MK Pandey	4	4	2	131	50*	65.50	111	118.01	0	1	0	15	1
HH Pandya	4	1	0	9	9	9.00	5	180.00	0	0	0	0	1
KD Karthik	1	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-

 

No.7 for India in last 2 years

Overall figures

Player	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
HH Pandya	19	11	2	349	83	38.77	287	121.60	0	3	1	25	17
MS Dhoni	4	3	2	65	49*	65.00	58	112.06	0	0	0	6	2
AR Patel	6	2	0	41	24	20.50	40	102.50	0	0	0	1	2
KM Jadhav	8	4	2	39	25*	19.50	23	169.56	0	0	1	5	1
KD Karthik	1	1	1	4	4*	-	3	133.33	0	0	0	0	0
JJ Bumrah	1	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-
MK Pandey	2	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-

 

 

Cumulative numbers for #4-7 in last 2 years

Overall figures

Player	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
MS Dhoni	41	30	11	1036	134	54.52	1268	81.70	1	7	0	78	25
KM Jadhav	36	23	6	652	120	38.35	595	109.57	1	3	2	68	14
HH Pandya	33	22	4	583	83	32.38	496	117.54	0	4	1	36	31
Yuvraj Singh	11	10	1	372	150	41.33	377	98.67	1	1	0	46	7
MK Pandey	17	14	5	251	50*	27.88	292	85.95	0	1	2	24	2
KD Karthik	8	7	4	183	64*	61.00	262	69.84	0	2	1	16	0
AM Rahane	4	3	0	98	79	32.66	114	85.96	0	1	0	6	2
AR Patel	7	3	0	79	38	26.33	80	98.75	0	0	0	4	3
KL Rahul	3	2	0	24	17	12.00	32	75.00	0	0	0	2	0
SS Iyer	1	1	0	18	18	18.00	21	85.71	0	0	0	2	0
V Kohli	1	1	0	4	4	4.00	2	200.00	0	0	0	1	0
JJ Bumrah	1	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-
AT Rayudu	1	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-

[rkt.india]

Just now, maniac said:

Summary of this thread: So we want Dhoni and Pandya promoted to 4 and 5 in slots of other specialist batsmen because they are consistently not delivering in their current roles ????

Because 4 and 5 are not delivering. Once 4 and 5 starts delivering, pressure on Dhoni and Pandya will reduce. Dhoni and Pandya are your last batting pair, you lost 5 Wickets around 40 over. Situation becomes ambiguous. Whether to hit or try to play 50 overs. Once you have a good start, it is the job of 4, 5, 6 to play 50 over but 4 and 5 aren't delivering.

[jalebi_bhai]

12 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Pandya should be given the chance at 5 for a considerable period and not just odd game. Iyer is no #5. Can bring krunal at 7.

Agree. Number 5-6 he'd work. Also support Krunal's inclusion.

[putrevus]

Forget Pandya's role, the bigger question needs to be asked is , does he belong in the team. He is total liability against fast bowlers and he cannot be trusted to bowl his own 10 overs.

Edited February 10, 2018 by putrevus

[rkt.india]

Just now, jalebi_bhai said:

Agree. Number 5-6 he'd work. Also support Krunal's inclusion.

Coz you need multiple big hitters at the end. Big hitting is lottery. Will always be inconsistent. If you depend solely on pandya, you are expecting him to score quickly every time in death because he is the only hitter which is not going to happen. What we need is 4 top proper batsmen then good hitters at 5, 6, 7. Even two of 5, 6, 7 will do. Right now, there is only one.

[rkt.india]

1 minute ago, putrevus said:

Forget Pandya's role, the bigger question needs to be asked is , does he belong in the team. He is total liability against fast bowlers and he cannot be trusted to bowl his own 10 overs.

So, you want a readymade alrounders? You will have to back your players who has won you games. We want players who can win you games. Pandya is one. Most Indian batsmen aren't great hitting against pace. Also can you tell me how many 5th bowlers can be trusted to bowl 10 overs? He is a 5th bowler, not a third seamer.

[Ankit_sharma03]

6 minutes ago, putrevus said:

Forget Pandya's role, the bigger question needs to be asked is , does he belong in the team. He is total liability against fast bowlers and he cannot be trusted to bowl his own 10 overs.

If u want someone to agree to ur points which are just filled with over expectation then atleast come up with an option ........

Say i have XYZ player who can replace pandya n give better result or else just rest ur overexpectation n just go on any cricket stats based site and see how many gr8 career stood in their initial yrs

[Sooda]

4 and 5 is a problem and 6th bowler is a problem too. When Pandya is not bowling well, no one to chip in. Itd be great if Krunal was fit for an extended period and he is drafted in to the LOI set up, i also think Deepak Hooda can be a good no 7 and bowl some overs of tidy offspin potentially... Vijay Shankar cannot bat as low as 7

 

I do think why not Virat at 4 and Lokesh at 3. MSD at 5. 

 

The problem is when MSD comes in around or after the 40th over and he does not have it in him anymore to start at a good SR

 

So MSD at 4 is not a bad shout, I agree he does not start quick enough anymore but with enough time he will make up for it, like Rohit. He accumulates quick enough once he is settled.

 

5 feels too high for Pandya, and it would be nice if they could give Lokesh a go there he'd be my first choice... with Iyer the next option

 

In summary-

Rohit, Dhawan, Virat, MSD, Lokesh/Iyer, Hardik, Krunal/Hooda, Bhuvneshwar, Kuldeep, Yuzvendra, Bumrah

 

 

 

 

[jalebi_bhai]

35 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Because 4 and 5 are not delivering. Once 4 and 5 starts delivering, pressure on Dhoni and Pandya will reduce. Dhoni and Pandya are your last batting pair, you lost 5 Wickets around 40 over. Situation becomes ambiguous. Whether to hit or try to play 50 overs. Once you have a good start, it is the job of 4, 5, 6 to play 50 over but 4 and 5 aren't delivering.

Not really. Iyer got out in the 43rd over trying to be the aggressor when the score was 247/4. My problem with Dhoni's innings today was that even as the senior partner his strike rotation was very poor. Even if boundaries weren't easy to come it doesn't mean that batsmen shouldn't try to maintain a run rate of 6. 

 

Start of 40th over 230/4 - 4 runs

Start of 41st over 234/4 - 6 runs

Start of 42nd over 240/4 - 3 runs

Start of 43rd over 243/4 - 6 runs

Start of 44th over 249/5 - 4 runs

Start of 45th over 253/5 - 6 runs

Start of 46th over 259/5 - 3 runs

Start of 47th over 262/6 - 5 runs

Start of 48th over 267/6 - 10 runs

Start of 49th over 277/6 - 12 runs

Final score           289/7

 

We scored 37 runs in the first 8 overs of the death overs at less than 5 rpo . Didn't Dhoni have the common sense to tell Iyer and Pandya to at least try and look to find gaps rather than trying to slog everything?   

 

[prasen82]

My order would be

Rohit,Dhawan, Kohli,Rahul/Shubman, Raina/Iyer,Dhoni,Pandya/Krunal , Bhuvi,kuldeep,chahal,boomraah.

 

i feel shubhman could have an early induction as he could be the next sachin/kohli ... considering the lack of options it is a wishful thinking..

 

dhoni can come in 4 when we have lost early wickets or if there is more than 20 overs at play. 

Edited February 10, 2018 by prasen82

[Rasgulla]

18 minutes ago, jalebi_bhai said:

Iyer and Pandya to at least try and look to find gaps rather than trying to slog everything?

Quit trolling.. Iyer or pandya didn't try to slog everyball.   you are posting some BS.. 27(34) that's not how sloggers innings look like..

Edited February 10, 2018 by Rasgulla