Indian grandmaster Soumya Swaminathan pulls out of Asian Chess Championship in Iran due to compulsory headscarf rule

[Turning_track]

22 minutes ago, beetle said:

Khaps are no better.

They have done it all...from banning mobiles to endorsing killings of lovers.

They are no better.

I'm no admirer of Khap either. But ladies like Barkha or Sagarika are known to do balancing acts. Look how she diverts the core matter of issue, it's just an example of shoot & scoot tactic used innumerable times by the prima donna using TL. 

Edited June 13, 2018 by Turning_track

[Muloghonto]

4 minutes ago, Turning_track said:

I'm no admirer of Khap either. But ladies like Barkha or Sagarika are known to do balancing acts. Look how she diverts the core matter of issue, it's just an example of shoot & scoot tactic used innumerable times by the prima donna using TL. 

They are to liberal media what the conservative mouthpieces do with their 'what about Kashmiri Pundits' insertion in topics unrelated.

Its called 'whatabout-ism'. 

[Stradlater]

25 minutes ago, beetle said:

Khaps are no better.

They have done it all...from banning mobiles to endorsing killings of lovers.

They are no better.

Oh they are a billion times better than the Shiite theologian clergy which rules Persia.

Want me to list down their achievements in the last 1400 years? 

_______

On topic: I have a soft spot for Iranis because of their relations with India but moves such as these make me wanna bang my head against a brick wall.

[Stradlater]

3 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

They are to liberal media what the conservative mouthpieces do with their 'what about Kashmiri Pundits' insertion in topics unrelated.

Its called 'whatabout-ism'. 

Muloghonto for the last time whose side are you on?

Time to declare your allegiance, either Jihadi Mullahs or Hindutva chaddis.

[Clarke]

53 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Can you comprehend how absurd you sound in the bolded part? This is the real world bro, not a filmi one. Actions will have consequences, if she tries such a stunt she will join a long list of foreign political prisoners who are undergoing 3rd degree torture in Iranian jails on a daily basis. 

 

Regarding your 1st para, that shows the difference between her and lesser mortals like you or me. You need to sacrifice something to stand for what is right. She may suffer professionally but will also inspire 1000s of women who have their freedoms curtailed by religious dogma. Someone has to face up against tyranny and I am glad that an Indian lady is doing that, showing the world how to stand up against Islamic zealots and expose them for the turdballs they are. This act of defiance is already making news worldwide, hopefully more players choose to follow her path and publicly shame Iran/FIDE. 

Bolded part was a joke, u seriously thought I'd advocate dada-giri in an Islamic republic ? 

 

I don't have a problem with her decision. All I'm saying is for me life's goals take precedence over smaller matters such as a temporary scarf, hear something similar from the Capt below.

 

It should be up to the organizing body and its members to take a stance on such issues, not some athlete who now has to face threats for a matter which was essentially non-native to her. Additionally, I also believe that the reform of Islamic nations and societies will have to come mostly from within, there's only so much that can happen from external prodding. 

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=No1W8Ll34rk

 

 

[Muloghonto]

22 minutes ago, Stradlater said:

Muloghonto for the last time whose side are you on?

Time to declare your allegiance, either Jihadi Mullahs or Hindutva chaddis.

neither one of them. 

Duh. 

I am a liberal atheist. I am on the side of the individual, with socio-economic & law and order responsibilities entrusted to the individual, with full freedom of expression & choice in all matters barring libel towards an existing entity. 

 

Which makes me pretty much, anti-Indian as those criterias are not satisfied by more than 1 in a million Indians.

[Muloghonto]

25 minutes ago, Stradlater said:

Oh they are a billion times better than the Shiite theologian clergy which rules Persia.

Want me to list down their achievements in the last 1400 years? 

_______

On topic: I have a soft spot for Iranis because of their relations with India but moves such as these make me wanna bang my head against a brick wall.

The only reason the Shiite clerics in Iran are worse in terms of accomplishments, is because they have far more power. In terms of operating within their outreach, they are both pretty much the same.

 

[Alam_dar]

Iranian nation is highly educated as compared to other Muslim countries. 

Even Iranian Mullahs are also highly educated as compared to Wahabi/Sunni Mullahs. 

Khamenei has PhD degree himself. 

 

But problem is the same. Whenever there comes the "extremism" then things start to go only towards the negative. 

 

My Question to the religious Shia Iranians:

 

I have been always putting this question to the religious Shia Iranians:

 

For the last 1400 years of Islamic history, you compelled thousands of the slaves girls to move in the society without Hijab, even with naked breasts. 

 

Shia Imam Ali  and Sunni Caliph Umar Ibn Khattab used to punish the slave-girls with sticks if they ever try to take Hijab. They used to tell them that Hijab is only the Honour and Right of the FREE Muslim woman. And the breasts of the slave women were also open and they were sold half naked in the slave markets. 

 

Therefore, present Iranian Islamic Government is even going against the Islamic Sharia where it is compelling the Non-Muslim women to take Hijab, while Hijab is meant only for the Free Muslim women. 

 

Off course they never answer, as there is absolutely no answer to these Double Standards. 

 

===

 

After asking this question, I am always been abused by the religious Shia Iranians, as I have been abused by the Sunni religious people. There I find no difference between the Shia or Sunni. The disease of Extremism makes both of them to fell from the level of Humanity. 

[Stradlater]

2 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

The only reason the Shiite clerics in Iran are worse in terms of accomplishments, is because they have far more power. In terms of operating within their outreach, they are both pretty much the same.

 

Mulo Shiite clerics under Safavids routinely massacred and persecuted Sunni musalmans.

Are you telling me a secterian genocide is equivalent to asking girls not to wear jeans or carry mobile phones with them?

 

Surely you can't be this dumb. 

[Stradlater]

8 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

neither one of them. 

Duh. 

I am a liberal atheist. I am on the side of the individual, with socio-economic & law and order responsibilities entrusted to the individual, with full freedom of expression & choice in all matters barring libel towards an existing entity. 

 

Which makes me pretty much, anti-Indian as those criterias are not satisfied by more than 1 in a million Indians.

I get it you are a Bengali.

[Muloghonto]

Iran is today what India would look in 50 years after uninterrupted hinduvta rule : strictures and constraints in public, but behind closed doors/in private, much more 'western' in their outlook.

I live in a city with close to 100K Iranians, most of whom have arrived in the last 15-20 years. They are completely the ' say Allah-hu-akbar on Friday jumma prayer, get home and drink scotch' kinda people. Some may say 'yeah well, Pakistanis are like that too', but the difference is, Iranians ALL KNOW that they ALL drink, have sex, party it up, etc, except the mullahs ( its like Iranian society is like mullahs = boarding school headmaster, rest of the people = boarding school students who are all in cahoots with each other and looking out for each other against the Hitler headmaster), whereas Pakistanis are ultimate hypocrites - they will judge,kill and slander their own over 'un-islamic behaviour' and then do it themselves in complete secrecy.

 

[Muloghonto]

1 minute ago, Stradlater said:

Mulo Shiite clerics under Safavids routinely massacred and persecuted Sunni musalmans.

Are you telling me a secterian genocide is equivalent to asking girls not to wear jeans or carry mobile phones with them?

 

Surely you can't be this dumb. 

Its equivalent to killing Dalits, stoning women for marrying out of caste, honor killings, etc. 
Hindus of western & central India are guilty of that for centuries as well. 

 

We have Chola & Pallava manuscripts on how when Dharanikota fell to them, they raped the buddhist nuns, forced monks to have sex with each other, etc before butchering them. This is not alleged Buddhist slander ( like those who dismiss Pushyamitra Sunga's acts recorded in buddhist manuscripts say), these are own recordings of the Pallavas and Cholas.

 

In terms of similar acts, hindus have done the same. In terms of overall frequency & totality of imposition, its less because of hinduism lacking the centralized/uniformity of ideology + lack of power over time to enforce such things, especially in the last 1000 years.

 

[Muloghonto]

3 minutes ago, Stradlater said:

I get it you are a Bengali.

Dude, i've spent the whole of my adult life out of India and at this point, my adult life is longer than my pre-adult life. The only thing 'Bengali' about me, is that i speak the language, visit family there and love fish. 

I follow the teachings (or atleast try to) of the greatest thinker India has ever produced and the one Indians themselves are ignorant about by and large: Siddharta. 

 

But i get it, conservatives in general are confused without a label to box/categorize people with. One day you may grow up and find that exercise futile.

 

[Temujin Khaghan]

1 hour ago, coffee_rules said:

As usual Dhimmi whataboutry from the Rani of them all..

 

 

this has always been a problem with barkha...

she did a muslim women discussion show on youtube... its a quite popular video.

it had an african lady who was an ex-muslim who was taking on two other hostile middle aged muslim women

barkha wouldnt just shut up and just kept bringing hindus into the discussion.

many pointed out in the comments section that had this been a discussion about emancipation of hindu women, she wouldnt bring anything about muslims into the discussion...

[Stradlater]

5 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

Its equivalent to killing Dalits, stoning women for marrying out of caste, honor killings, etc. 
Hindus of western & central India are guilty of that for centuries as well. 

 

We have Chola & Pallava manuscripts on how when Dharanikota fell to them, they raped the buddhist nuns, forced monks to have sex with each other, etc before butchering them. This is not alleged Buddhist slander ( like those who dismiss Pushyamitra Sunga's acts recorded in buddhist manuscripts say), these are own recordings of the Pallavas and Cholas.

 

In terms of similar acts, hindus have done the same. In terms of overall frequency & totality of imposition, its less because of hinduism lacking the centralized/uniformity of ideology + lack of power over time to enforce such things, especially in the last 1000 years.

 

Stop shifting the goalposts Mulo.

What has the actions of Pallavas and Cholas got to do with Jats of Haryana? 

We were discussing Khaps and not the activities of hindu Rajas.

 

And wait, are you seriously telling me that Hindu Kings in the past have been on the same footing in massacring and pillaging like their Mulsim counterparts? 

 

And You have nerve to call others bigot .

[Turning_track]

2 minutes ago, Temujin Khaghan said:

this has always been a problem with barkha...

she did a muslim women discussion show on youtube... its a quite popular video.

it had an african lady who was an ex-muslim who was taking on two other hostile middle aged muslim women

barkha wouldnt just shut up and just kept bringing hindus into the discussion.

many pointed out in the comments section that had this been a discussion about emancipation of hindu women, she wouldnt bring anything about muslims into the discussion...

That black woman was Ayan Hirsi Ali, she carries multiple fatwas on her head. Her predicament is same as that of Salman Rushdie. 

[Muloghonto]

10 minutes ago, Stradlater said:

Stop shifting the goalposts Mulo.

What has the actions of Pallavas and Cholas got to do with Jats of Haryana? 

We were discussing Khaps and not the activities of hindu Rajas.

 

And wait, are you seriously telling me that Hindu Kings in the past have been on the same footing in massacring and pillaging like their Mulsim counterparts? 

 

And You have nerve to call others bigot .

Khaps of Haryana have killed people for marrying out of caste, ordered public gang-rapes. To their outreach population, they are just as bad.

And i didn't shift the goalposts- you did. We were talking about khap panchayats vs Irani mullahs TODAY. You inserted what happened hundreds of years ago under the Safavids. I countered with what happened hundreds of years ago under the Cholas and Pallavas. 

 

And yes, some hindu kings have been on the same footing as some muslim kings. Facts prove this. You really wanna open the history can of worms here ? the outcome may not be very pleasing towards your 'hindu kings were not religious bigots causing genocide/barbarism but muslims were' narrative. 

The frequency amongst muslim kings are greater, for the reasons i've already mentioned - linearity of Islam and them having greater power than hindu kings by and large.

 

[Gollum]

55 minutes ago, Clarke said:

Bolded part was a joke, u seriously thought I'd advocate dada-giri in an Islamic republic ? 

 

I don't have a problem with her decision. All I'm saying is for me life's goals take precedence over smaller matters such as a temporary scarf, hear something similar from the Capt below.

 

It should be up to the organizing body and its members to take a stance on such issues, not some athlete who now has to face threats for a matter which was essentially non-native to her. Additionally, I also believe that the reform of Islamic nations and societies will have to come mostly from within, there's only so much that can happen from external prodding. 

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=No1W8Ll34rk

  

 

Nice video.

 

For you scarf may be a small matter but most of the women may not think so. It is a symbol of oppression in many societies and liberated modern women have a right to choose what to wear. In Islamic countries it is perfectly possible to dress modestly (no flesh, tight fits etc) without hurting local sensibilities. But the imposition of Islamic hijab on non Muslims is an irksome topic. Question is where will it stop? Once they clerics have been emboldened because outsiders are acting as per their command next time they may ask players to read the kalima before a match. That is how Islamic societies progress on their path to decadence and at least non Muslims from other sovereign states shouldn't bow before this sort of Islamic aggression in the desert. 

 

I agree about internal reform not just in Islamic societies but in every society. FIDE is a pathetic body run by a clownish conman who has links with Assad and Iranian establishment. I can make a new mega thread about Kirsan which will guarantee plenty of amazement and laughter but not in the mood now. Point is FIDE is a joke of a body that isn't going to change unless some drastic measures are taken. Drastic measures should not just include economic sanctions but also bad press. It should be shamed in media outlets for its decisions to organize events in these hellholes. Already sponsors and many governments are wary of FIDE, more the **** it gets the easier it will be to get members of the federations to cast their votes diligently. Had Kasparov won in Tromso we would be having events in Paris, London, New York, Brussels, Mumbai, Hong Kong, Sydney etc. Players deserve a good and strong FIDE but they aren't getting it because they have no say in the election process. It is only when brave people like Soumya speak up that chess makes front page news for the wrong reasons and FIDE image takes a hit. There are many who selfishly carry on without any care in the world but very few have the moral courage to do what is right for the game. Caissa shouldn't be forced to see this debauchery happening in the chess world, it is a great game with great history. It's legacy and history must be preserved and attempts must be made to widen its reach. Today poker and online video games have a greater following which was unthinkable a few decades back. Chess was unquestionably one of the most popular games and Presidents/PMs/intelligence agencies would get involved in title matches, roads and streets would be choked during the big duels and critical matches would coincide with mass bunking/holiday. Once upon a time most people knew the names of World Champions, today people will find it hard to distinguish Kramnik from Anand and Carlsen. When Fischer won against Spassky in 1972 it was USA's greatest moment of the Cold War. When Karpov-Kasparov matches were going on Soviet politburo was split into 2 sides...both the players represented the two conflicting extreme ideologies in the USSR. When Kasparov beat Anand in New York  it was announced in the Duma and lawmakers got half day off to celebrate. I want chess to reach that status once again in the future, hence I support Soumya. These are baby steps but hopefully one day FIDE is made to pay for its sins and chess players get what they truly deserve.  

Edited June 13, 2018 by Gollum
spelling, grammar

[Stradlater]

4 minutes ago, Muloghonto said:

Khaps of Haryana have killed people for marrying out of caste, ordered public gang-rapes. To their outreach population, they are just as bad.

And i didn't shift the goalposts- you did. We were talking about khap panchayats vs Irani mullahs TODAY. You inserted what happened hundreds of years ago under the Safavids. I countered with what happened hundreds of years ago under the Cholas and Pallavas. 

 

And yes, some hindu kings have been on the same footing as some muslim kings. Facts prove this. You really wanna open the history can of worms here ? the outcome may not be very pleasing towards your 'hindu kings were not religious bigots causing genocide/barbarism but muslims were' narrative. 

The frequency amongst muslim kings are greater, for the reasons i've already mentioned - linearity of Islam and them having greater power than hindu kings by and large.

 

No in my original post to beetle I already mentioned the 1400 year old tyranny by Shiites. It was you who made it a Hindu vs Mulsim affair when infact we were talking about Khaps.

 

Go ahead mention the brutalities of Hindu Kings which was on a similar level to the Muslim Invaders.

I challange you to name one hindu king who committed atrocities on the scale of Timur in delhi and punjab and I can name 10 Muslim ones who were on par with him if not worse. What's even more interesting is that they all did it in the name of Islam.

 

[Texy]

They barred their own chess player from participating for refusing to wear hijab

Edited June 13, 2018 by Texy