Are we missing Pandya already?

[goose]

Pandya could be to India what Shane Watson was to Australia in tests and that's being generous. 

[Trichromatic]

Just now, Khota said:

 He is not getting it. There is no room in Indian team for non performers or who in future might come thru.

Yeah, that might be the case. Slowly this team will settle and find regular players at each position and it will be tough to get into.

 

But he can develop into type of player who remains in 15 and get into the team according to the match conditions.

[Khota]

1 minute ago, Trichromatic said:

Yeah, that might be the case. Slowly this team will settle and find regular players at each position and it will be tough to get into.

 

But he can develop into type of player who remains in 15 and get into the team according to the match conditions.

If he gets more control on his bowling he has a gauranteed spot in T20. Otherwise I am not so sure.

[Straight Drive]

Pandya needs to work on his batting. In tough conditions for our batsmen (SENA) he is averaging even below Bhuvneshwar Kumar, Jadeja  and Ashwin who are primarily bowlers.  Panda is expected to have better batting average than them in SENA.

 

Averages in SENA

 

Kohli - 49.51
Pant - 42.66
Rahane - 39.02
Pujara - 36.02
.
.

Bhuvneshwar Kumar - 30.61
Vijay - 30.59

Jadeja - 28.50
.
.

Dhawan - 25.80
Rohit Sharma - 25.36
Ashwin - 24.84
.
.
Rahul - 22.43
Pandya - 21.76
 

[ShoonyaSifar]

5 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

Main concern is batting and that requires FC cricket.

7/102 and 73 runs in his comeback match showed he will excel at domestic level. As much as you want him to be sent to domestic cricket, he isn’t going there. Will slot in well in the next Test squad vs WI in July and will do well too.

[Number]

23 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

coz for long we had sehwag, sachin, ganguly who bowled in that lineup

I will try finding a post of mine in another thread where I provided stats that bw 2002-07 how many overs Sehwag SRT and Ganguly bowled. They were really not much.

[Ankit_sharma03]

14 minutes ago, Khota said:

Another subtle thing about sports. You should never leave anything on chance. 

by going in with 4 bowler arent we leaving it on chance that 4 will be enough to do the job

 

14 minutes ago, Khota said:

 

Now you will come up with ten useless facts where things on chance worked out. real life is different.

Wish u cud come up with a fact , rather then saying i knw it all 

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

8 minutes ago, Straight Drive said:

Pandya needs to work on his batting. In tough conditions for our batsmen (SENA) he is averaging even below Bhuvneshwar Kumar, Jadeja  and Ashwin who are primarily bowlers.  Panda is expected to have better batting average than them in SENA.

 

Averages in SENA

 

Kohli - 49.51
Pant - 42.66
Rahane - 39.02
Pujara - 36.02
.
.

Bhuvneshwar Kumar - 30.61
Vijay - 30.59

Jadeja - 28.50
.
.

Dhawan - 25.80
Rohit Sharma - 25.36
Ashwin - 24.84
.
.
Rahul - 22.43
Pandya - 21.76
 

but pandya has not played in All SENA countries till now ...he is yet to play in aus n Nz

[Ankit_sharma03]

23 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

That's just poor logic.

 

Success in FC doesn't guarantee success in internationals.

 

Failures in domestic has always been guaranteed failure international without exception in case of Indian cricket.

how is he a failure in domestic when he didnt play much domestic only

he came back from injury played the domestic game and scorecard is to be seeen for all 

23 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

Again try finding single batsman who has averaged below 30 in domestic and averaged high 30s in internationals.

Stokes will be picked by most teams as they are poor teams. Here you're looking to strengthen world no 1 team.

 

It's upto BCCI how to handle such rare talent.

 

Then you're just expecting magic to happen

i dnt expect magic.....but with all cricketer maturity happens as they understand their game better and they improve

i wud love him play domestic but that wnt happen a lot .....

[Ankit_sharma03]

20 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

How exactly was Stokes doing after his first 11 tests or 42 ODIs, Pandya’s career so far.

i did post those stats ...at par

they had one up in one dept each

[Straight Drive]

2 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

but pandya has not played in All SENA countries till now ...he is yet to play in aus n Nz

I know. If he was selected for this test he would have had at least some test cricket in OZ. We are not playing test in NZ. It will be few years now for tests series in those two countries. 

[Trichromatic]

5 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

how is he a failure in domestic when he didnt play much domestic only

he came back from injury played the domestic game and scorecard is to be seeen for all 

i dnt expect magic.....but with all cricketer maturity happens as they understand their game better and they improve

i wud love him play domestic but that wnt happen a lot .....

Avg below 30 in 20 domestic game is failure only. Not career failure though.

 

If he doesn't play domestic he won't succeed as batsman.

[Straight Drive]

Think tank should have released Pandya to play domestic if they were to not select him in any test on this tour. At least he could have improved his game for longer format.  Bad player management this.

 

Poor guy had to skip FC and travel only to find he is dropped for the test. How does that helps him.

Edited January 6, 2019 by Straight Drive

[Ankit_sharma03]

17 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

Avg below 30 in 20 domestic game is failure only. Not career failure though.

 

If he doesn't play domestic he won't succeed as batsman.

At the end playing cricket that what matters, unfortunately time doesnt allow him to play much domestic but he is playing international cricket no stop and i think he wnt improve. He is getting tested more here and hence he ll be always against the wall to improve faster.

 

IF we play him in homes series his batting wud  improve or else if he on the bench in home series he can go play domestic games. He will only get better from here and so wud the avgs . At the end the more he plays the better he ll become 

 

now question comes why at international coz team needs him and when team wudnt he can play domestic 

[zen]

Pandya has some exceptional performances  in tests in his first season 

 

* a 100 and a 50 in SL

* a 90 odd in SA (lone man standing. Could have been a match winning innings if some of others had stood up). Also picked up 3 wkts in one of the tests iirc 

* The 70 odd vs AFG where we had a mini collapse 

* The 50 odd + 5-er in the test he won us a test in Eng 

 

Can’t ask for more from a youngster in his first season, and that too when he has played most of his tests in SA and Eng, and mainly bowling with an older ball

 

He is a better option than likes of Vihari, and some of the struggling batsman. Vihari who has played in relatively good batting surfaces in SENA is not even averaging 25. In those games Agarwal and Pant, newcomers too, avg 55+ .... Pandya deserved to play ahead of  one of these (KL / Vihari / Rahane) guys

 

 

PS

 

Batting since Vihari's debut (away games)

 

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Overall figures

Player	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
MA Agarwal	2	3	0	195	77	65.00	375	52.00	0	2	0	19	5
CA Pujara	5	9	0	558	193	62.00	1362	40.96	3	1	2	55	2
RR Pant	5	9	1	469	159*	58.62	627	74.80	2	0	0	47	9
RA Jadeja	3	5	1	189	86*	47.25	325	58.15	0	2	0	22	2
V Kohli	5	9	0	331	123	36.77	755	43.84	1	1	2	37	1
RG Sharma	2	4	1	106	63*	35.33	199	53.26	0	1	0	7	3
KL Rahul	4	7	0	243	149	34.71	379	64.11	1	0	1	29	2
AM Rahane	5	9	0	254	70	28.22	577	44.02	0	2	1	23	3
GH Vihari	4	7	0	167	56	23.85	458	36.46	0	1	1	19	1
R Ashwin	1	2	0	30	25	15.00	94	31.91	0	0	0	1	0
M Vijay	2	4	0	49	20	12.25	154	31.81	0	0	1	4	0

 

Edited January 6, 2019 by zen

[Clarke]

1 hour ago, Number said:

6 batsmen and 4 bowlers is the formula which had worked for us for so long. 

No wonder it delivered again.

It is a time tested formula in the longest version. It doesn't mean that all rounders can't be accommodated but it's really annoying when one hears new theories being invented about modern game blah blah just so that their fav player is in the XI.

[Trichromatic]

4 minutes ago, zen said:

Pandya has some exceptional performances  tests in his first season 

 

* 100 and a 50 in SL

* 90 odd in SA (lone man standing. Could have been a match winning innings if some of others had stood up). Also picked up 3 wkts in one of the tests iirc 

* 70 odd vs AFG where we had a mini collapse 

* 50 odd + 5-er in the test he won us in Eng 

 

Can’t ask for more from a youngster in his first season, and that too when he has played most of his tests in SA and Eng

 

A better prospect than likes of Vihari, and some of the struggling batsman. Vihari who has played in relatively good batting surfaces in SENA is not even averaging 25. In those games Agarwal and Pant, newcomers too, avg 55+ .... Pandya deserved to play ahead of  one of these (KL / Vihari / Rahane) guys
 

Here you are assuming that since his it was his first season, so him averaging 30 with bat is ok and he will get better as batsman.

 

That's where you have to look average batsmen don't suddenly improve in international. If he is persisted without chances in domestic he will remain 25-30 avg batsman and that time we will ask for more from a no 6 batsman.

[zen]

Just now, Trichromatic said:

Here you are assuming that since his it was his first season, so him averaging 30 with bat is ok and he will get better as batsman.

 

That's where you have to look average batsmen don't suddenly improve in international. If he is persisted without chances in domestic he will remain 25-30 avg batsman and that time we will ask for more from a no 6 batsman.

He is avg 60+ in decent batting conditions .... and conditions in Aus would have suited him relatively 

[Trichromatic]

2 minutes ago, zen said:

He is avg 60+ in decent batting conditions .... and conditions in Aus would have suited him relatively 

Again batting doesn't evolve directly in international cricket. It's not a long term option and doesn't work like that. Bowling does, batting doesn't. Trying finding one example where batting worked like that. Pretty sure Pandya isn't most exceptional talent in history of Indian cricket.

 

Not his fault, it's just poor management atm. Should have played more FC games.

[zen]

5 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

Again batting doesn't evolve directly in international cricket. It's not a long term option and doesn't work like that. Bowling does, batting doesn't. Trying finding one example where batting worked like that. Pretty sure Pandya isn't most exceptional talent in history of Indian cricket.

 

Not his fault, it's just poor management atm. Should have played more FC games.

Since he has been fast tracked (and has shown signs of brilliance) there is no harm in persisting with him (vs so called specialist batsmen who look vulnerable at the crease) .... Pant is evolving as a batsman so can naturally move up to 6 based on the strengths of our line up. Pandya can bat at either 6 or 7

 

PS My line for 2019, playing in WI and Ind 

 

Agarwal

Shaw

Pujara

Kolhi

Gill (debut)

Pant

Pandya

Spinner / Pacer

Kuldeep

Shami

Bumrah 

Edited January 6, 2019 by zen