Have faith in Rishabh Pant like you did with Rohit Sharma

[vvvslaxman]

9 minutes ago, nevada said:

The reference was to shot selection for wide of off-stump balls and the discussion went off on a tangent to career comparison. As of now,.Pant's shot selection is a work in progress but it seems to be improving and seems to vary based on the match situation. In the last game, Pant left alone most of the wide of off-stump balls as he batted patiently to rebuild the innings. Today he bashed pretty much everything. Read an article about how he went back to his club coach recently to sort out his game and regain confidence. The work he did with his coach seems to have helped him free up his mind. He hit the first ball he faced in the first T20 for six and has been on a roll ever since. May his good form continue for long.

He has sense of timing. But placement has to be worked on. He just has to naturally react rather go with pre-meditated slog.

[vvvslaxman]

2 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Do check England's ODI ranking in 2006. 

And windies ODI ranking now? Fact is he was much younger 19.  Reason i drew a parallel was, role that Pant has to play is the same as that of Raina. Once Pandya is back he will bat up the order. Pant will have to do the finishing role. So he has to expand his range. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

46 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

We are talking about finisher role. Not test matches in Australia and England. What is the connection? Raina has 100 in 69 balls in a T20 game against SA bowling attack. So?

In 2010 - 5 years after he started playing for India.

 

So let's go back to the question again - why would you expect same things achieved by someone with 4-5 years of experience  from a player in his 2nd year of int'l cricket,

[Suhaan]

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

His shot selection has a lot of room for improvement.  For instance the same wide ball Raina wouldn't have tried to belt straight. He would have tapped that to backward point through gap. He has to develop the ability to make the split second adjustment to his shot. 

That awareness develops with game time,intermittent chances to him will only disturb his confidence and he will only regress

He should be backed that's it, Heytmyer is a live example

Recipe to sucess-Back your potential match winners

[Suhaan]

I feel sorry for people who have suddenly started liking Raina for some reason who was constantly mocked for his inconsistent display 

[Suhaan]

1 hour ago, tweaker said:

Shreyas & Pant ,both have played well at 4 & 5, they should be persisted now and should not be dropped after 1 or 2 failure

Yes shouldn't be dropped for upcoming calamity Rayudu and corpse Jadhav

[vvvslaxman]

21 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

In 2010 - 5 years after he started playing for India.

 

So let's go back to the question again - why would you expect same things achieved by someone with 4-5 years of experience  from a player in his 2nd year of int'l cricket,

No from the first year onwards his game was not one-dimensional.  He had a designated role of finishing mostly. Back then there was just one ball. Older ball harder to hit unlike now. There were no 4 fielders restriction till 40th over.  T20 was in infancy stage. So you cannot make a blanket comparison across 13 years.

[vvvslaxman]

20 minutes ago, Suhaan said:

I feel sorry for people who have suddenly started liking Raina for some reason who was constantly mocked for his inconsistent display 

COmpared him with one aspect of Raina's game. Pretty much similar game, similar role except he had better range.

[vvvslaxman]

24 minutes ago, Suhaan said:

That awareness develops with game time,intermittent chances to him will only disturb his confidence and he will only regress

He should be backed that's it, Heytmyer is a live example

Recipe to sucess-Back your potential match winners

Backing doesn't mean he is above criticis or scrutiny. Kohli, Rohit, Pandey everybody gets criticized. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

2 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

No from the first year onwards his game was not one-dimensional.  He had a designated role of finishing mostly. Back then there was just one ball. Older ball harder to hit unlike now. There were no 4 fielders restriction till 40th over.  T20 was in infancy stage. So you cannot make a blanket comparison across 13 years.

I am a big fan of Raina v2.0 but I'll keep repeating that your views on him are influenced by the batsmen he became post IPL. Raina in his early years was a limited player, did not have muc feet movement, did not have much of a power game (hardly hit 6s in his early years) and had a major technical flaw - vs the short ball. IPL 2008 was the turning point of his career. 

 

 

[ShoonyaSifar]

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

yes lol Like guys like Gill. Shaw are less talented

To your disappointment, those of us who have been backing Pant have also been shouting about Gill to be given proper run and would keep backing Shaw as well. 

[vvvslaxman]

3 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

I am a big fan of Raina v2.0 but I'll keep repeating that your views on him are influenced by the batsmen he became post IPL. Raina in his early years was a limited player, did not have muc feet movement, did not have much of a power game (hardly hit 6s in his early years) and had a major technical flaw - vs the short ball. IPL 2008 was the turning point of his career. 

 

 

To become what we want him to be, he has to focus on reacting to the ball. It will make him more consistent and reliable. Also his connection will improve. With India's longish tail it is not enough he can score cameo. But he has to stay till the end while accelerating.

[Suhaan]

7 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Backing doesn't mean he is above criticis or scrutiny. Kohli, Rohit, Pandey everybody gets criticized. 

Criticism is over done here

Point to be noted is players you have mentioned were atleast weren't criticized as much as this guy when they started their career,for instance did you really count number of times Rohit failed as a bat in his initial years,i saw him debut for us in 2008 in odis ,our regulars disintegrated post 2011 WC ,he got regular chances  till 2013,from where he started to define himself

[vvvslaxman]

4 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

To your disappointment, those of us who have been backing Pant have also been shouting about Gill to be given proper run and would keep backing Shaw as well. 

Compared to them he definitely gets better treatment atleast in limited overs. 

[Vk1]

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

He did get dropped after 2 years before he came back. My point is Pant has to learn to develop wider range of stroke play to be a good finisher which was what Raina used to do. 

Raina was never a great finisher.. you could have compared Pant with Yuvi or MS in his young days 

[vvvslaxman]

Just now, Suhaan said:

Criticism is over done here

Point to be noted is players you have mentioned were atleast weren't criticized as much as this guy when they started their career,for instance did you really count number of times Rohit failed as a bat in his initial years,i saw him debut for us in 2008 in odis ,our regulars disintegrated post 2011 WC ,he got regular chances  till 2013,from where he started to define himself

Reckless players were always criticized. Kapil dev was dropped from a test for one reckless shot. He was criticized after 1987 world cup reckless shot. Rohit was criticized, Rahul criticized. Kohli criticized. Nobody needs cottom wool treatment here. You have to rise above it.

[ShoonyaSifar]

7 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Compared to them he definitely gets better treatment atleast in limited overs. 

Because he's had a more distinguished set of achievements than Gill or Shaw - 300 in FC cricket, 1000+ runs in a FC season, 500+ runs in back to back IPLs, fastest FC 100 for India, fastest T20 100 for India. All this as a keeper-batsman.

 

Having said that, Gill and Shaw are 18 months younger, so haven't played for as long as Pant but in another 6-9 months time, they'll be permanent members of the national team across formats.

[Suhaan]

30 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Reckless players were always criticized. Kapil dev was dropped from a test for one reckless shot. He was criticized after 1987 world cup reckless shot. Rohit was criticized, Rahul criticized. Kohli criticized. Nobody needs cottom wool treatment here. You have to rise above it.

Iam certain the magnitude of criticism wasn't this level,besides getting criticized those people were getting picked almost everytime,this guy gets publicly humiliated and gets dropped from his strongest format(as per his performance till date)

Im sure he will improve if we persist with him

 

[prudent_kreeda]

33 minutes ago, Vk1 said:

Raina was never a great finisher.. you could have compared Pant with Yuvi or MS in his young days 

       Raina had a big weakness against short stuff in his entire career , pant does not have it else he would have been exposed in test Cricket on foreign soil.  So pant has a higher ceiling. 

 Pant's problem is with shot selection and predictable hitting zone right now without maintaining balance  .

  Give him  a year or so

[putrevus]

People keep talking about the faith they had with Rohit Sharma, but it was not the faith which made him the player he is today.Rohit was in and out of the team from 2007 till 2013.

 

He made his debut before Kohli but did not play world cup 2011.He did not replace Sehwag or Sachin while they were playing either.There was an opening as an opener in 2013.He was given that chance and he has not looked back ever since.

 

Rahul got more chance in test cricket without getting dropped than Rohit ever got but people tend to forget that fact.Pant is getting his chances and if he is putting himself under pressure , it is on him also not just TM.