TN Elections

[Gollum]

11 minutes ago, ash said:

I was talking about the 2014 elections and the NDA alliance. Even after NDA won, Jaya openly opposed NEET and many other policies. Point is ADMK was never an ally of NDA when Jaya was alive, she fought fiercely for State autonomy.

That's ok, state autonomy is important, even for BJP ruled states. Regarding the non-ally part, as long as they find ways to work together should be fine. Look at Naveen Patnaik, BJD isn't with NDA but he has cordial relations with Modi, offers constructive criticism, doesn't oppose just for the sake of opposing. I like that, we need more of that in our democracy rather than nuisance created by these Mamatas and Vijayans. 

Edited January 9, 2021 by Gollum

[randomGuy]

23 minutes ago, ash said:

Weather is not an issue, Hyderabad is as hot as Chennai. Most Northies don't stay here cause we don't speak Hindi.

 

I don't undermine the labour workers from north, they are doing a great job for us. It is like people from Mexico going to US for a better life. We welcome them and provide the life their state can't. 

 

TCS , Microsoft and all won't come by magic. It is the work of a strong state government. DMK started SEZ zones for IT park way back in 1999 when IT outsourcing was not even a thing.  ADMK brought many manufacturing companies. Facts tell the truth my friend

Agreed, governments in the north States have done a bad job, now the likes of Yogi have good reputation and expectations. Punjab, Haryana, Delhi, jnk, himachal, uttarakhand Gujarat and Maharashtra - basically the north and the west are leaps and bounds better than the south for the natives of these places.... No one would wanna migrate to Chennai...one of my engineer friends from Delhi came to Chennai for a software job(tough guy, physically like sunny deol), he changed the job specifically to get the hell out of Chennai.

 

Hyderabad, and banglore - they happily migrate to,... but one would love if these cities also would not have the drinking water problem, traffic problem and the pollution problem.

 

summary - comparisons are not valid... US-mexico comparison

, Although you didn't compare south with usa, but putting usa and south in same sentence is hilarious.

 

 

[Gollum]

4 hours ago, G_B_ said:

Who told you aiadmk was dharmic? Not against dharma but not dharmic either

Relatively speaking, even BJP isn't entirely pro-dharmic if you look at it that way. I like that AIADMK leaders are unabashedly Hindu despite the legacy of Periyar/DK in the state. Btw look at this news from last week To celebrate god Murugan, TN CM announces Thaipusam as public holiday, maybe a sign of things to come.

 

Digressing here, for a state with so many temples, mutts, devotees, dharmic traditions, how long can DMK get away with being antagonistic towards the majority faith? A couple of years ago I was in Chennai during Ganesh Visarjan and the length of the procession I saw, even Bengaluru falls short. Land of Tamils (along with Odisha) has been the last standing remnant of Hindu civilization in its purest form in India, untouched by medieval invasion of barbarian hordes, enemies of our dharma (mainly EVR's legacy/ideology) must be annihilated in the state. May not be in the immediate future, but eventually. Unlike Bengal, Assam the demography in TN is still very much in our favor and will continue to be so. 

Edited January 9, 2021 by Gollum

[ash]

2 minutes ago, randomGuy said:

Agreed, governments in the north States have done a bad job, now the likes of Yogi have good reputation and expectations. Punjab, Haryana, Delhi, jnk, himachal, uttarakhand Gujarat and Maharashtra - basically the north and the west are leaps and bounds better than the south for the natives of these places.... No one would wanna migrate to Chennai...one of my engineer friends from Delhi came to Chennai for a software job(tough guy, physically like sunny deol), he changed the job specifically to get the hell out of Chennai.

 

Hyderabad, and banglore - they happily migrate to,... but one would love if these cities also would not have the drinking water problem, traffic problem and the pollution problem.

 

summary - comparisons are not valid... US-mexico comparison

, Although you didn't compare south with usa, but putting usa and south in same sentence is hilarious.

 

 

All you are claiming are anecdotal evidence like my friend said this my friend said that . That is just hearsay. Come back with some proper stats like life expectancy, healthcare, education, GDP, jobs, percentage of migrant workers , doctor to population ratio etc etc.  

[ash]

3 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Relatively speaking, even BJP isn't entirely pro-dharmic if you look at it that way. I like that AIADMK leaders are unabashedly Hindu despite the legacy of Periyar/DK in the state. Btw look at this news from last week To celebrate god Murugan, TN CM announces Thaipusam as public holiday, maybe a sign of things to come.

 

Digressing here, for a state with so many temples, mutts, devotees, dharmic traditions, how long can DMK get away with being antagonistic towards the majority faith? A couple of years ago I was in Chennai during Ganesh Visarjan and the length of the procession I saw, even Bengaluru falls short. Land of Tamils has been the last standing remnant of Hindu civilization in its purest form in India, untouched by medieval invasion of barbarian hordes, enemies of our dharma must be annihilated in the state. May not be in the immediate future, but eventually. Unlike Bengal, Assam the demography in TN is still very much in our favor and will continue to be so. 

Simple. Dravidian parties gave the people jobs, education, good healthcare and development. As long as they continue to give it, their anti Hindu sentiments will not be a major factor in elections for people. Religion here is just a part of life,.nobody makes it their whole identity.  

[Gollum]

2 hours ago, ash said:

Simple. Dravidian parties gave the people jobs, education, good healthcare and development. 

Not very different from what ruling parties have done in neighboring South states, Goa, Maharashtra, Gujarat, Delhi, Punjab, Haryana. More or less at the same level, we don't exactly have Norways and Swedens in India, all states must improve!!!! 

2 hours ago, ash said:

As long as they continue to give it, their anti Hindu sentiments will not be a major factor in elections for people.

Weird, are you implying Tamils are prone to self-hatred like bhadraloks? Can't be...

Quote

Religion here is just a part of life,.nobody makes it their whole identity.  

Still it is an important component of identity. I would be very uncomfortable if hating part of my identity is normalized. 

Edited January 10, 2021 by Gollum

[randomGuy]

10 minutes ago, ash said:

All you are claiming are anecdotal evidence like my friend said this my friend said that . That is just hearsay. Come back with some proper stats like life expectancy, healthcare, education, GDP, jobs, percentage of migrant workers , doctor to population ratio etc etc.  

You wrote life expectancy first, so I googled that first..

TN 70.x

Karnataka 68.x

Andhra 68.x

 

West Bangal 70.x

Bihar 68.x

https://niti.gov.in/content/life-expectancy

 

 

Like previously mentioned, people from TN seem to tend to sing a lot of self praises. As if, the likes rel jio, airtel, hdfc, Tata , Birla cos. , Flipkart, uniliver, Amazon are all started and owned by tamilians. :)

 

 

 

[ash]

2 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Not very different from what ruling parties have done in neighboring South states, Goa, Maharashtra, Gujarat, Delhi, Punjab, Haryana. More or less at the same level, we don't exactly have Norways and Swedens in India, all states must improve!!!! 

Weird, are Tamils prone to self-hatred? 

Still it is an important component of identity. I would be very uncomfortable if hating part of my identity is normalized. 

There is no hatred. Contrary to what North Indians think, DMK is not anti Hindu all the time. They just keep religion away from politics. Dravidian politics is more about state autonomy, social justice schemes and development. Anti Hindu is not the main identity of DMK and people are okay with that. It is just a logical choice, not emotional

[ash]

10 minutes ago, randomGuy said:

You wrote life expectancy first, so I googled that first..

TN 70.x

Karnataka 68.x

Andhra 68.x

 

West Bangal 70.x

Bihar 68.x

https://niti.gov.in/content/life-expectancy

 

 

Like previously mentioned, people from TN seem to tend to sing a lot of self praises. As if, the likes rel jio, airtel, hdfc, Tata , Birla cos. , Flipkart, uniliver, Amazon are all started and owned by tamilians. :)

 

 

 

Yes, TN and Kerala is among the top there. Combine this with other factors . See the healthcare ratio, see the jobs, education, no of colleges. All these combined makes a good state. Pretty sure all south states make it to the top

[randomGuy]

1 minute ago, ash said:

Yes, TN and Kerala is among the top there. Combine this with other factors . See the healthcare ratio, see the jobs, education, no of colleges. All these combined makes a good state. Pretty sure all south states make it to the top

Clutching at straws my friend... Kerala is the smallest state of south..much like Delhi in North (also having higher life expectancy)...TN -high, really? 70 years is high? Today India average is 70 years and world average is 73 years

https://www.worldometers.info/demographics/life-expectancy/

 

 

Anyways, Peace out, you are reasonable guy , not like a couple of jokers from your state @Stan AF @Vilander

[G_B_]

1 hour ago, ash said:

There is no hatred. Contrary to what North Indians think, DMK is not anti Hindu all the time. They just keep religion away from politics. Dravidian politics is more about state autonomy, social justice schemes and development. Anti Hindu is not the main identity of DMK and people are okay with that. It is just a logical choice, not emotional

 

Dmk is allied with the indian union muslim league. The indian union Muslim league is a religious party. They also invited Owaisi to a speak at their pan party gathering before pulling out after other muslim parties in their alliance berated them.

 

It is simply untrue that the dmk keeps religion out of politics.

[G_B_]

1 hour ago, Gollum said:

Relatively speaking, even BJP isn't entirely pro-dharmic if you look at it that way. I like that AIADMK leaders are unabashedly Hindu despite the legacy of Periyar/DK in the state. Btw look at this news from last week To celebrate god Murugan, TN CM announces Thaipusam as public holiday, maybe a sign of things to come.

 

Digressing here, for a state with so many temples, mutts, devotees, dharmic traditions, how long can DMK get away with being antagonistic towards the majority faith? A couple of years ago I was in Chennai during Ganesh Visarjan and the length of the procession I saw, even Bengaluru falls short. Land of Tamils (along with Odisha) has been the last standing remnant of Hindu civilization in its purest form in India, untouched by medieval invasion of barbarian hordes, enemies of our dharma (mainly EVR's legacy/ideology) must be annihilated in the state. May not be in the immediate future, but eventually. Unlike Bengal, Assam the demography in TN is still very much in our favor and will continue to be so. 

 

Eps only did that cause bjp's vel yatra in honour of lord murugan was attracting plenty of people and eps had banned the said yatra. This public holiday was announced after pressure from bjp top brass.

 

I feel your knowledge on aiadmk is misplaced.  

[ravishingravi]

10 hours ago, ash said:

There is no hatred. Contrary to what North Indians think, DMK is not anti Hindu all the time. They just keep religion away from politics. Dravidian politics is more about state autonomy, social justice schemes and development. Anti Hindu is not the main identity of DMK and people are okay with that. It is just a logical choice, not emotional

 They are more anti Hindu than MiM. 
Should I start quoting their esteemed leaders on Gita, temples and Manusmriti ? 
 

Let’s be clear. Dravidian politics is nice concoction of Marxist ideology with Tamil identity. There were some historical injustices and the rise of such an idea was necessary for its time. But let’s not fool anyone what they stand for. 
 

 

[velu]

@ash I find DMK brings religion and caste in almost everything , but you find it they are not

 

also seats are distributed based on caste arithmetic in DMK , so much they proudly claim they are a periarist party

 

Admk is just a namesake Dravidian party , founder mgr is a big devotee of Murugan ( maybe influenced by chinnappa devar ) and jj , ops , eps are all openly practising Hindus 

Edited January 10, 2021 by velu

[someone]

18 hours ago, G_B_ said:

 

Eps only did that cause bjp's vel yatra in honour of lord murugan was attracting plenty of people and eps had banned the said yatra. This public holiday was announced after pressure from bjp top brass.

 

I feel your knowledge on aiadmk is misplaced.  

AIADMK is a relative pro- dharmic party. The line is Hinduphobia. Thats the top most thing that matters. They are one of few parties who havent resorted to slandering Hinduism to gather some votes.

[Gollum]

18 hours ago, G_B_ said:

 

Eps only did that cause bjp's vel yatra in honour of lord murugan was attracting plenty of people and eps had banned the said yatra. 

COVID related restrictions? 

[G_B_]

8 hours ago, velu said:

@ash I find DMK brings religion and caste in almost everything , but you find it they are not

 

also seats are distributed based on caste arithmetic in DMK , so much they proudly claim they are a periarist party

 

Admk is just a namesake Dravidian party , founder mgr is a big devotee of Murugan ( maybe influenced by chinnappa devar ) and jj , ops , eps are all openly practising Hindus 

 

Their selection of district sectetaries suggests what they think of social justice.

 

 

[ravishingravi]

Tamil Nadu is pretty straight forward and complicated at the same time. You can win there with religion or atheism. Just prostrate to Tamil culture and accept that it is best thing sinçe slice bread. 
 

as a Tamilian I dare say, I would prefer Pongal wadey over slice bread any day. 

[G_B_]

1 hour ago, ravishingravi said:

Tamil Nadu is pretty straight forward and complicated at the same time. You can win there with religion or atheism. Just prostrate to Tamil culture and accept that it is best thing sinçe slice bread. 
 

as a Tamilian I dare say, I would prefer Pongal wadey over slice bread any day. 

 

 

The number 1 thing that matters in tn is caste.

 

Anything else is a secondary factor, especially outside the chennai bubble which you get these social justice periyar types.

 

Politically in tn there are three dominant obc communities. Devars in the south, goundars in the west and vanniyers in the north and west. 

 

The vanniyers are split between aiadmk and dmk (ignoring pmk) but the devars and goundars stood by jayalalitha  and the aiadmk. They are also more religious in nature. This allowed aiadmk to have a stronger social base than the dmk, especially in rural areas.  Jayalalitha was a brahmin but was seen as caste neutral. She juggled her base . The big current caste issue the aiadmk is eps is goundar. He is not seen as caste neutral by other smaller obc and sc groupings. In addition devars who generally stood with aiadmk are fragmented. Ammk of sasikala and nephew is splitting their votes. This has made an uphill caste even more harder and is a strong structural barrier for the aiadmk beyond this election.

 

For the bjp to rise in tn it needs to be anchored by one of the three big obc groupings. In karnataka lingayat voters anchor the bjp. In telangana the anchor is kapu caste.

 

If the bjp manages to be the defacto choice of devars in the south of tn over time and also retains its foothold in hindu naders they will start extracting seats. Easier said than done. You will need to reach a deal with ops and the sasikala faction to come under the bjp banner. Then hope nadars are ok with it.

 

In this election, BJP is targeting Devendra Kula Vellalars, Hindu Nadars, Arunthathiyar and Muthuraja caste people as their base.  It’s a good strategy to begin with. After a long time there is a method to the bjp in the state.

[Stan AF]

Speaking on pongal,