IPL ... Speeds and Performances of Pacers and Spinners ....

[tapandrun]

1 hour ago, Mariyam said:

Gurjapneet looks like a very fast bowler.

 

 

 his default pace is sub-135 kmph and when pushing he goes up to 138 kmph. So mostly sub 140 kmph

 

 

[MK55]

1 hour ago, Mariyam said:

Instead of watching Kamboj get tonked, I actually calculated this.

 

(22*144.8)+ 145.6 + 149

 

And then divide all of it by 24

 

Gives 145.0000833333 as his average across the 4 overs.

 

I feel so smart. I should have studied engineering.

Or shorter way is just

 

New average = old average + (total delta over average) / 24

or 144.8 + (0.8 + 4.2) / 24 

or 144.8 + 5/24

or 144.8 + (6/24 -1/24)

or 144.8 + 0.25 - (roughly 0.04)

or 144.8 + 0.21

or 145.01 

exact answer is 145.00833

[express bowling]

2 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Full marks to consistency.

 

But I can’t get myself to ‘hate’ him. If he recovers from this pasting, I will have new found respect for him.

 

We don't hate these medium pacers. They are just trying to do their job. It's usually not their fault that they lack pace.

 

And as @Mosher bro said, everyone gets hit in T20s.

 

But there are atleast 2 issues.

 

       1 )  There are lots of medium pacers who seem accurate against 2nd rung or 3rd rung batters. Or even top batters who are just going through the motions and not playing with intensity in low key matches.

 

But the moment these medium pacers come against top rung batters playing with intensity, and / or the ball is not swinging, they get absolutely decimated. They lose their so called accuracy. And perform far worse than a moderately accurate quick or bouncy pacer. 

 

But despite witnessing this phenomenon decade after decade, many Indian selectors, commentators and state boards keep promoting these pacers in international cricket.

 

They don't demarcate between the genuinely accurate medium pacers like Bhuvi or Arshdeep, who can maintain their accuracy against thd big guns ... and Mukesh Kumar or Kamboj, who lose their accuracy against the top batters batting with intensity.

 

        2 )  Genuinely quick pacers, spinners who can turn the ball big and strokeplayer batters may have far higher ceilings, provided they have the temperament to do well in big matches. And are guided properly and backed. 

 

But they may take more time or more effort to become finished products. Because there are far more variables to control. And they may not become finished products at all if poorly guided or quick results are sought or the selectors / coaches lack vision or ambition. 

 

Everyone would like a finished product like Pat Cummins of the 2020s. But would they take the trouble for years to mould a raw young pacer to the great pacer of today ?

 

The vision, effort and techniques that Cricket Australia displayed, to transform an injury prone and often inaccurate young tearaway quick to a highly efficlient great pacer, is rarely found in India.

 

Instead we prefer backing an average medium pacer who is doing ok in domestic cricket or low key matches. And Indian commentators are often seen ridiculing a young, talented quick pacer, who is returning from injury, and struggling due to lack of match practice. And these ex-players end up as selectors too.

 

Which is why Bumrah is the only pacer, in the history of Indian cricket, to take 100+ test wickets averaging 25 or less.

 

These are the main issues.

 

 

Edited May 15 by express bowling

[MK55]

Just goes to show how crucial the nature of the pitch plays a role.

 

Get a fast track and Mayank’s length balls are hard to play and he’s the most economical bowler. Anyways one day at a time.

The highest wicket taker Kamboj goes at 24 rpo. Absolutely slaughtered with almost all of the shots being convincing / dominant / well connected hits. This is difficult to recover from.

 

And Marsh I’ve always said - he’s the most powerful hitter and probably the best against short balls in the world. Unfortunately not as consistent as he’d like to be.

 

 

 

Edited May 15 by MK55

[MK55]

With KKR knocked out, they should give Umran a chance.

[diga]

5 hours ago, express bowling said:

 

We don't hate these medium pacers. They are just trying to do their job. It's usually not their fault that they lack pace.

 

And as @Mosher bro said, everyone gets hit in T20s.

 

But there are atleast 2 issues.

 

       1 )  There are lots of medium pacers who seem accurate against 2nd rung or 3rd rung batters. Or even top batters who are just going through the motions and not playing with intensity in low key matches.

 

But the moment these medium pacers come against top rung batters playing with intensity, and / or the ball is not swinging, they get absolutely decimated. They lose their so called accuracy. And perform far worse than a moderately accurate quick or bouncy pacer. 

 

But despite witnessing this phenomenon decade after decade, many Indian selectors, commentators and state boards keep promoting these pacers in international cricket.

 

They don't demarcate between the genuinely accurate medium pacers like Bhuvi or Arshdeep, who can maintain their accuracy against thd big guns ... and Mukesh Kumar or Kamboj, who lose their accuracy against the top batters batting with intensity.

 

        2 )  Genuinely quick pacers, spinners who can turn the ball big and strokeplayer batters may have far higher ceilings, provided they have the temperament to do well in big matches. And are guided properly and backed. 

 

But they may take more time or more effort to become finished products. Because there are far more variables to control. And they may not become finished products at all if poorly guided or quick results are sought or the selectors / coaches lack vision or ambition. 

 

Everyone would like a finished product like Pat Cummins of the 2020s. But would they take the trouble for years to mould a raw young pacer to the great pacer of today ?

 

The vision, effort and techniques that Cricket Australia displayed, to transform an injury prone and often inaccurate young tearaway quick to a highly efficlient great pacer, is rarely found in India.

 

Instead we prefer backing an average medium pacer who is doing ok in domestic cricket or low key matches. And Indian commentators are often seen ridiculing a young, talented quick pacer, who is returning from injury, and struggling due to lack of match practice. And these ex-players end up as selectors too.

 

Which is why Bumrah is the only pacer, in the history of Indian cricket, to take 100+ test wickets averaging 25 or less.

 

These are the main issues.

 

 

That is exactly why Prasidh was given so many chances... But I guess it's time to move on from him to Mayank I believe 

[AKane]

1 hour ago, MK55 said:

And Marsh I’ve always said - he’s the most powerful hitter and probably the best against short balls in the world. Unfortunately not as consistent as he’d like to be.

 

Marsh may be strong but overall cricketing talent... I dunno about him.

 

There is a reason he averages 28 in test cricket in 46 matches and 33 in FC cricket.

 

Now he is good enough for "hit and giggle" T20 cricket - but don't expect consistency from him.

[singhvivek141]

47 minutes ago, diga said:

That is exactly why Prasidh was given so many chances... But I guess it's time to move on from him to Mayank I believe 

Prasidh is tailor made for these pitches.

He was unlucky that he became injury prone during his best years 2020-23...also that duration was impacted by Covid.

 

Now he is fit and his body is responding well. Is able to bowl lot of overs in FC.

 

Ideally he was supposed to be like for like replacement for Ishant. There are still years in him...but Gurnoor is next in line and he is in his peak years of 25-26. If not now...then never.

[Mariyam]

11 hours ago, express bowling said:

 

 

You are on the right track

 

There were 3 wide balls.

 

144.8 × 25 balls = 3620

 

3620 + 145.6 + 149 = 3914.6 / 27

 

= 144.99 kph

As a matter of principle, should extras count in the average speed though?

 

Those are basically deliveries that are bowled again. One could in theory release a really fast hip/head level full toss whose speed is not broken by the bounce and could break all records.

[Mariyam]

Vande Bharat's top speed is 160kmph.

 

Which Indian bowler will be the first to over take the Vande Bharat?

[express bowling]

26 minutes ago, Mariyam said:

As a matter of principle, should extras count in the average speed though?

 

You are probably right. But, AFAIK, all deliveries are considered currently.

 

IMO, slower balls should be excluded too and average speed of non-slower legal deliveries should be measured.

 

 

26 minutes ago, Mariyam said:

Those are basically deliveries that are bowled again. One could in theory release a really fast hip/head level full toss whose speed is not broken by the bounce and could break all records.

 

These are release speeds and not measured at the batsman's end. 

[vishalvirsingh]

i read...Gurnoor and Aquib nabi  to partner prasidh and siraj for Afghanistan TEST.

 

SHAMMI"S fitness for TEST is to be verified. 3 of the 4 will play in the 11. harshit rana and akashdeep are unfit and BOOM rested.

i am 100 % sure Gurnoor will succeed if he is in the 11 provided, he bowls 138K to 145K, he will get bounce and afghani batsmen cannot handle him, Prasidh and Siraj.

if SHAMMI is fit , he may sneak in too at the cost of either of the two.

i believe Gurnoor, Prasidh and Siraj will be in the 11. Prasidh will take the most wickets. Gurnoor and Siraj too will get there share of wickets.

heard a new Spinner will also get a chance.

Gurnnor BRAR is 6ft 5 inches tall, Prasidh is 6ft 2 inches and Siraj is 5.11 ft close to 6ft.  prasidh gets bounce at will and all his success is due to the bounce he gets from good length, gurnoor could get even more purchase and his success is guranteed on any track which has a little bit of green on it.

remember the days when a 6.4 ft west indies walsh/ambrose  would come leisurely bowling even at 135k still getting so much bounce and getting wickets at their own will. 

Steep bounce is very difficult to HANDLE...kind off impossible even for best batsmen.

Gurnoor and Prasidh will always get a lot of wickets in TEST on slightly green wickets. yes on patta's they could go for sixes as there bounce may not get speed.

[vishalvirsingh]

3 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Vande Bharat's top speed is 160kmph.

 

Which Indian bowler will be the first to over take the Vande Bharat?

i have driven my car Honda City upto 140K-  any fast bowler that touches that pace with proper line n length ( top of off stump or shoulder length ) is good enough.

but he has to be around 140K regularly and with perfect line n length and bounce is critical too.

if he can get to move the ball too he will be deadly.

Siraj is moving the ball now a days and Siraj will be the PURPLE cap holder of this IPL ahead of BHUVI as bhuvi is moving the ball at 135k where as Siraj is moving /swinging a little faster then bhuvi.

My prediction- SIRAJ will be the Purple cap HOLDER of 2026 IPL.

[vishalvirsingh]

15 hours ago, Lone Wolf said:

Ashok is I think more well rounded than Mayank.  His bouncers are v accurate and so are his yokers.

 

Mayank though has better HTD skills.

what is HTD Skills.

 

if i was Ajit agarkar and i had to pick one among ASHOK SHARMA and Mayank- i would pick Mayank with no doubt in my mind (assuming he is bowling like he bowled yesterday and is super fit like yesterday)

he is a Genius, a gem like bumrah , he is a Super Talent-some one who can just go and bowl fast, see his action, smooth and fast. if he maintains his pace and fitness he will become world number 1 fast bowler.

Ashok is hard working and very strong just like Umesh Yadav but not as pacy or has a comfy action like Mayank.

Mayank will soon bowl 156k/158k too but i think Ashok will not go above 154k.

kkarthik ki helmet tod di thi KAL Mayank ne. Just after that batsmen gave an easy catch of a 146k bouncer which lazy RISHABH ran to catch but Mottu could only get one hand to the ball and missed it.

bhai wicket lena important hai par jab batsmen ka sar phodta hai , body pe hit karta hai wo bhi wicket se kam nahi hai. 

akaash got wickets but Mayank was the hero.....

[express bowling]

10 minutes ago, vishalvirsingh said:

what is HTD Skills.

 

 

 

Hit The Deck skills.

[vishalvirsingh]

 KARMBHOJ-2.4 overs - 63 runs and 0 wickets.

 

mitchell marsh and karthik hit 4 sixes ...8 sixes of 8 balls against him.

 

mujhe bhi marna hai ....

 

@BCCISelector kindly notice this. 

Edited May 16 by vishalvirsingh

[express bowling]

Will Gurnoor Brar get to play today as per BCCI request  ?

[vishalvirsingh]

3 hours ago, express bowling said:

Will Gurnoor Brar get to play today as per BCCI request  ?

has BCCI requested Brar to get an opportunity???

[singhvivek141]

4 hours ago, vishalvirsingh said:

what is HTD Skills.

 

if i was Ajit agarkar and i had to pick one among ASHOK SHARMA and Mayank- i would pick Mayank with no doubt in my mind (assuming he is bowling like he bowled yesterday and is super fit like yesterday)

he is a Genius, a gem like bumrah , he is a Super Talent-some one who can just go and bowl fast, see his action, smooth and fast. if he maintains his pace and fitness he will become world number 1 fast bowler.

Ashok is hard working and very strong just like Umesh Yadav but not as pacy or has a comfy action like Mayank.

Mayank will soon bowl 156k/158k too but i think Ashok will not go above 154k.

kkarthik ki helmet tod di thi KAL Mayank ne. Just after that batsmen gave an easy catch of a 146k bouncer which lazy RISHABH ran to catch but Mottu could only get one hand to the ball and missed it.

bhai wicket lena important hai par jab batsmen ka sar phodta hai , body pe hit karta hai wo bhi wicket se kam nahi hai. 

akaash got wickets but Mayank was the hero.....

 

I disagree.

I think Ashok can clock faster than 154..

Mayank no doubt has a rhythmic action, and that helps in generating pace. But as with every well oiled machine, a small bit of variation or dust..and it will impact the effectiveness.

Mayank's biggest quality in speed was his pivot on the left leg, which immediately transformed the energy from his runup to release the bowl. That seems to be missing now.

 

Ashok has strength...his load gives him enough time to transform his kinetic energy to potential energy and then during release it again uses that potential energy into Kinetic and releases the bowl with power. Ashok is raw, like a desi ghee type..unadulterated.

 

Who can go faster is up for debate...its like Umesh vs Aaron. Umesh with hjs rhythm can maintain consistency in pace, but Aaron can really rip the bowl when he wanted.

Same is with Mayank vs Ashok. Mayank when rhythm can clock consistent pace, Ashok can go up and down but when he wants he can real up the pace reading.

[express bowling]

57 minutes ago, vishalvirsingh said:

has BCCI requested Brar to get an opportunity???

 

Have told the franchises to give chances to players who are likely to play against Afghanistan.