India & China force amendment on Coal Reference at COP26 Summit - Disappointing End to Climate Summit

[Adi_91]

Countries adopt Glasgow Climate Pact after India, China force amendment on coal reference

https://indianexpress.com/article/world/climate-change/glasgow-climate-pact-coal-subsidy-cop26-conference-7621670/

 

Didn't expect India to force a dramatic last minute amendment in the summit. This has not gone down well with most island nations as reported in the media.

[ravishingravi]

Well screw them. First create the problem and then ask poor countries to solve it. 

[Mariyam]

Can someone please succinctly summarise what all this climate change business is all about re:India?

 

I am too bored to read 14 contradictory 500 page studies about it and form an opinion. I want it dumbed down. Even if it's wrong. 

 

My sister has fallen for this climate change scare totally. She stays in velayat and is very agitated whenever she talks about this topic. Idk why.

 

And she always speaks to me about this topic and nothing else. How India should do more, 'you Indians' yadda yadda...

 

Makes for a very boring monologue.

[ravishingravi]

2 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Can someone please succinctly summarise what all this climate change business is all about re:India?

 

I am too bored to read 14 contradictory 500 page studies about it and form an opinion. I want it dumbed down. Even if it's wrong. 

 

My sister has fallen for this climate change scare totally. She stays in velayat and is very agitated whenever she talks about this topic. Idk why.

 

And she always speaks to me about this topic and nothing else. How India should do more, 'you Indians' yadda yadda...

 

Makes for a very boring monologue.

 

One simple suggestion. Ask her for data and trend. That should end her ranting. 

[Adi_91]

15 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Can someone please succinctly summarise what all this climate change business is all about re:India?

 

I am too bored to read 14 contradictory 500 page studies about it and form an opinion. I want it dumbed down. Even if it's wrong. 

 

My sister has fallen for this climate change scare totally. She stays in velayat and is very agitated whenever she talks about this topic. Idk why.

 

And she always speaks to me about this topic and nothing else. How India should do more, 'you Indians' yadda yadda...

 

Makes for a very boring monologue.

 

So to keep it short, there is a Climate Change Summit that happened recently called COP26 in Glasgow, Scotland. All major economies attended it including India, US and China.

 

The Developed countries have grown at the expense of the environment with a large carbon emission footprint as part of Industrial Revolution. Since they have abused the environment for the production of resources, it has hurt our environment and climate badly and we are seeing the impact.

 

India, on the other hand is not one of the top emitters. India is also a fast developing economic power. Therefore, India is of the opinion that Developed Countries should do more to help developing economies like ours mitigate the climate crisis by gradually adopting green energy (solar, wind, etc) and reduce the emittance of poisonous gases. The one sticky point is the high dependence of India, China and SA on coal for Electricity and other energy needs.

 

So, these countries wanted India and China to phase out coal eventually by 2050. At the very last minute, India and China forced an amendment to the COP26 resolution to phase down instead of phase out coal usage. This is the issue right now. Western media is running a biased take of India's views (as expected).

[Clarke]

I believe human ingenuity will get us beyond coal by 2050. The way Solar power prices have fallen, its purely a matter of storage, and that's just one renewable source. 

[ravishingravi]

@Mariyam

 

 

[Adi_91]

This report nails the hypocrisy of the so called "West" and how they make developing countries like India and China the big villains of coal usage. Australia, South Korea and US are the top emitters of of CO2 using Coal.

 

https://ember-climate.org/commentary/2021/11/11/per-capita-coal-power-emissions-show-australia-and-south-korea-far-beyond-india-and-china/

 

 

[coffee_rules]

This is an amazing speech

 

He is a Marxist himself, but this is what most RWers think like too

Edited January 4, 2022 by coffee_rules

[coffee_rules]

Full video

 

 

[BacktoCricaddict]

On 11/15/2021 at 7:23 AM, Clarke said:

I believe human ingenuity will get us beyond coal by 2050. The way Solar power prices have fallen, its purely a matter of storage, and that's just one renewable source. 

3 words:

 

Nuc - lee - ar.  Solar, wind etc. have some advantages, but are low-density, unreliable, boutique sources of energy. So, if you find "environmentalists" who think nuclear should not be part of a zero-carbon future, they are not environmentalists, just ideologues.

 

 

Edited January 4, 2022 by BacktoCricaddict

[dial_100]

3 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

Full video

 

 

 

This reminded me of Sehwag 309*. Itana koi marta hai kya bhai. 

[Clarke]

5 hours ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

3 words:

 

Nuc - lee - ar.  Solar, wind etc. have some advantages, but are low-density, unreliable, boutique sources of energy. So, if you find "environmentalists" who think nuclear should not be part of a zero-carbon future, they are not environmentalists, just ideologues.

 

I'm for nuclear as well and also find Germany's stance too ideological, glad that India is pursuing it in conventional energy & research areas. My feeling is with a suitable storage solution the disadvantages of wind & solar can be overcome in the coming decades. Nuclear can then pitch in for the high load and bad weather scenarios.

[BacktoCricaddict]

16 hours ago, Clarke said:

 

I'm for nuclear as well and also find Germany's stance too ideological, glad that India is pursuing it in conventional energy & research areas. My feeling is with a suitable storage solution the disadvantages of wind & solar can be overcome in the coming decades. Nuclear can then pitch in for the high load and bad weather scenarios.

 

In addition to energy storage issues (which will likely be solved with human ingenuity), per kWh waste and land-use are unspoken issues associated with solar and wind.  Eventually it circles back to that kWH denominator.  As long as that is small, every problem will be large compared to nuclear.  But it is not sexy for Greenpeace/FOE and others to mention that to their rich, "environmentally conscious" donors.      

 

https://www.johnlocke.org/waste-problems-from-wind-and-solar-yes-its-why-we-need-proper-decommissioning/

 

 

 

   

[Clarke]

8 hours ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

 

In addition to energy storage issues (which will likely be solved with human ingenuity), per kWh waste and land-use are unspoken issues associated with solar and wind.  Eventually it circles back to that kWH denominator.  As long as that is small, every problem will be large compared to nuclear.  But it is not sexy for Greenpeace/FOE and others to mention that to their rich, "environmentally conscious" donors.      

 

https://www.johnlocke.org/waste-problems-from-wind-and-solar-yes-its-why-we-need-proper-decommissioning/

  

 

Agree on waste, a 360 deg cycle is needed. I find land use to be a typical human attitude problem. Until y'day, I wasn't aware of shingles, it costs more and produces less energy than panels and is much less reliable but hey my house looks better with them on the roof. I mean, WTF is wrong with panels on the roof. Given a choice, i'd set up my entire roof with panels and give some power back to the grid. 

[Mariyam]

On 11/14/2021 at 3:18 PM, ravishingravi said:

 

One simple suggestion. Ask her for data and trend. That should end her ranting. 

No it does not!.

She just spams the family WA group with 1000s of graphs and write ups and science stuff. Science has ruined humanity. Science means that arguements are decisively right or wrong. That's no fun. Arguements should solely be judge by the way in which they are presented. Frankly, her conviction in her new found belief is very scary. 

 

Besides, I want to spam my family WA group with cute pics of me and my daughter. Don't want to see histograms of CO2 emissions and what not really!

[Clarke]

37 minutes ago, Mariyam said:

No it does not!.

She just spams the family WA group with 1000s of graphs and write ups and science stuff. Science has ruined humanity. Science means that arguements are decisively right or wrong. That's no fun. Arguements should solely be judge by the way in which they are presented. Frankly, her conviction in her new found belief is very scary. 

 

Besides, I want to spam my family WA group with cute pics of me and my daughter. Don't want to see histograms of CO2 emissions and what not really!

 

Well most of humanity functions that way so you shouldn't mind the odd scientific argument, sucks though if its the in your face type & persistent. 

[ravishingravi]

1 hour ago, Mariyam said:

No it does not!.

She just spams the family WA group with 1000s of graphs and write ups and science stuff. Science has ruined humanity. Science means that arguements are decisively right or wrong. That's no fun. Arguements should solely be judge by the way in which they are presented. Frankly, her conviction in her new found belief is very scary. 

 

Besides, I want to spam my family WA group with cute pics of me and my daughter. Don't want to see histograms of CO2 emissions and what not really!

 

It is unfortunate reality for the world. Maybe you could share this. But she might be too deep in echo chamber to get this.

 

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/50-cognitive-biases-in-the-modern-world/

[BacktoCricaddict]

 

5 hours ago, Mariyam said:

No it does not!.

She just spams the family WA group with 1000s of graphs and write ups and science stuff. Science has ruined humanity. Science means that arguements are decisively right or wrong. That's no fun. Arguements should solely be judge by the way in which they are presented. Frankly, her conviction in her new found belief is very scary. 

 

Besides, I want to spam my family WA group with cute pics of me and my daughter. Don't want to see histograms of CO2 emissions and what not really!

 

While I understand your perspective and even follow it for the most part,, I also feel that it is the biggest reason that misinformation spreads.  Anyone can post any nonsense on WA - including dangerous medical/nutritional advice that they got from their MIL's brother's neighbor's son's granddad.  It almost always goes unchallenged.  So, I feel it necessary sometimes to share what I have learned as a scientist/teacher and judiciously share scientific information - graphs, articles etc. - and challenge people's viewpoints on WA groups.  But I make sure to do it respectfully and kindly, and make it clear that it is not a personal attack, but an exchange of ideas.  If one sharing is caring, other sharing is caring too, na? 

 

And I request such information from them to challenge my viewpoint.  It usually does not come. 

 

Science has not ruined humanity.  People being entrenched in their viewpoints and taking every challenge as a personal attack on them or their belief system has.      

Edited January 6, 2022 by BacktoCricaddict

[zen]

India is a country that as ruined its air, rivers, and land. The population garbages whatever it touches. 
 

Then it will resort to whataboutism ignoring the challenges the planet is facing now. It will blame population as if others are responsible for it being highly populated. In future, I hope that 1.3 B ppl (4x USA’s) living in an area that is 1/3rd of the area of US is counted as a type of pollution too. 

 

Countries brought up in pollution, which could be a way of life, ideally should not comment on it. 
 

PS https://www.iqair.com/ca/india

 

 

Edited January 7, 2022 by zen