This is what we expect from our middle order in ODIs

[sarcastic]

I am in no way defending pestering with non-performing seniors who are hogging onto their positions. Surely, they should be replaced by more competent and hungry youngsters.

 

We complain about the familiar scorecard of few runs for two or three early wickets.

But early wickets can fall and will fall and we need the middle order to be prepared for such situations and be able to build partnerships and take team to victory.

 

 

This is what people like Yuvraj, Kaif (for some time), Dhoni, Raina, Yusuf and to some extent Jadhav have done.

 

Now, we are seeing the current crop of youngsters Pant and Pandya. This is what we need from them. We don't want to be dependent on the top order alone.
We want a superstar middle order to follow a star top order.

Bravo to the new superstars Hardik Pandya and Rishab Pant

[Vijy]

1 minute ago, sarchasm said:

And what do we expect from our top 3?

 

How Dhawan creeped his way back is something that requires an investigation. He was getting owned by domestic trundlers in VH Trophy. Kohli has already crumbled in every knock out match since 2013? Rohit is now where Kohli was in 2021 - at the top of his downhill journey.

 

Is this the top 3 that is going to win us 2023 WC?

it is this top 3 that will win us 2027 WC, no worries.

[Lord]

people were yapping about middle order in the other thread. They did it here and nearly took us home in 2019 semi.

 

Its not gonna happen everyday. We can't be 20/3 regularly expecting middle order to do it everytime.

[Ankit_sharma03]

KL-Pant-Pandya dream middle order

Consistency+impact

 

Before anyone ask me about KL, look at his numbers at 5 .............amazing numbers 

[Lord]

1 minute ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

KL-Pant-Pandya dream middle order

Consistency+impact

 

Before anyone ask me about KL, look at his numbers at 5 .............amazing numbers 

 

With that we need SKY or even Iyer at 3. 

[Vijy]

Just now, Ankit_sharma03 said:

KL-Pant-Pandya dream middle order

Consistency+impact

 

Before anyone ask me about KL, look at his numbers at 5 .............amazing numbers 

at 4-6, they practically select themselves going by numbers. no. 7 and no. 8 are still not settled IMO - both are crucial batting positions; not sold on jaddu/axar at 7

[Vijy]

Just now, Lord said:

 

With that we need SKY or even Iyer at 3. 

no. 3 seems too high for SKY. and Iyer will keep getting short balls continuously

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, Lord said:

 

With that we need SKY or even Iyer at 3. 

iyer ???? 

Ill rather send thakur for pinch hitting

[vvvslaxman]

1 minute ago, Lord said:

 

With that we need SKY or even Iyer at 3. 

 

SKY is like 31. Not sure how many years left in him. He is starting his career. Iyer already has decent numbers in this format. Time and again put up middle order partnerships successfully. Temporarily SKY can play.

[Lord]

Just now, Ankit_sharma03 said:

iyer ???? 

Ill rather send thakur for pinch hitting

Iyer in ODIs can build an innings. Sure short ball issue is there,but he can do well despite it.

[Lord]

2 minutes ago, Vijy said:

no. 3 seems too high for SKY. and Iyer will keep getting short balls continuously

 

He doesnt attack them atleast,it can be managed in ODIs. 

[vvvslaxman]

5 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

KL-Pant-Pandya dream middle order

Consistency+impact

 

Before anyone ask me about KL, look at his numbers at 5 .............amazing numbers 

 

There is no way KL is batting in the middle order. He will open with Rohit. Dhawan may be phased out.

[Vijy]

Just now, Lord said:

Iyer in ODIs can build an innings. Sure short ball issue is there,but he can do well despite it.

I don't think so based on his career so far. his issues are much more glaring than azhar, and azhar was a big liability (barring some freak innings) on bouncy pitches.

[Vijy]

Just now, vvvslaxman said:

 

There is no way KL is batting in the middle order. He will open with Rohit. Dhawan may be phased out.

he is better suited for MO though. if he opens, he is weak against left arm pace. and most teams can field such a bowler: Fizz (Bang), Topless (Eng), Boult (NZ), Starc (Aus), Shaheen (Pak)

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, Lord said:

Iyer in ODIs can build an innings. Sure short ball issue is there,but he can do well despite it.

again ill say scream short ball isnt just the issue , wait till u see him against moving ball , against quick wrist spinner also he is struggling 

i know everyone has an issue against moving but guys like rohit, kohli, gill , pant dont have short ball problem. 

When u combine both problem na front foot pe ja paoge n back foot pe

Also iyer, sky, hooda with all i feel their international career will  last more then 3-6 yrs 

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

There is no way KL is batting in the middle order. He will open with Rohit. Dhawan may be phased out.

 

U havent understood Rohit till now , he ll back players to hill and Dhawan, kohli are both getting backed. 

If they make KL open again despite his middle order number they are idiots of highest order 

[zen]

Middle order is a wide term to use as it is divided into 2 parts:

 

• Upper middle order (#4-5)
• Lower middle order (#6-7) 

 

To make a consistent impact, match winner (or potential match winners being groomed) should be batting in the upper middle order. In lower middle order, the opportunities are relatively less. 

 

Upper middle order

 

Primary team India

Opposition team Australia  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka  or West Indies

Batting position between 4 and 5

Qualifications runs scored greater than or equal to 250  and matches played greater than or equal to 20

Ordered by batting average (descending)

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0
V Kohli	2009-2020	42	40	6	1748	139*	51.41	1946	89.82	6	9	0
MS Dhoni	2005-2019	110	99	22	3943	134	51.20	4456	88.48	3	29	2
AT Rayudu	2014-2019	25	23	4	766	100	40.31	926	82.72	1	5	2
SS Iyer	2018-2022	23	21	1	785	103	39.25	826	95.03	1	7	0
R Dravid	1996-2007	148	140	18	4689	109*	38.43	6577	71.29	3	40	7
RR Pant	2018-2022	22	20	1	729	125*	38.36	651	111.98	1	5	3
RG Sharma	2007-2012	50	48	9	1450	101*	37.17	1813	79.97	1	11	5
Yuvraj Singh	2000-2017	182	173	20	5625	150	36.76	6411	87.73	11	31	14
AM Rahane	2013-2018	21	20	1	690	89	36.31	810	85.18	0	5	0
A Jadeja	1995-2000	73	67	15	1854	105*	35.65	2542	72.93	3	8	4
DB Vengsarkar	1978-1990	77	74	12	2183	95*	35.20	3177	68.71	0	16	5
M Azharuddin	1985-2000	214	207	30	6216	111*	35.11	8375	74.22	3	42	4
KD Karthik	2006-2019	27	26	9	589	64*	34.64	848	69.45	0	4	2
SV Manjrekar	1988-1996	20	19	3	540	62	33.75	829	65.13	0	3	1
SK Raina	2006-2018	97	86	11	2526	100	33.68	2738	92.25	1	19	5
SR Tendulkar	1989-2007	92	88	14	2476	113	33.45	3231	76.63	3	18	8
M Kaif	2002-2006	32	31	5	764	95*	29.38	1201	63.61	0	6	5
Yashpal Sharma	1980-1985	20	20	2	525	89	29.16	842	62.35	0	3	0
SC Ganguly	1996-2007	26	24	1	581	85	25.26	823	70.59	0	3	1
VG Kambli	1992-2000	51	48	12	864	65	24.00	1249	69.17	0	4	2
SM Patil	1980-1986	33	31	1	688	84	22.93	801	85.89	0	6	3
GR Viswanath	1974-1982	23	23	1	439	75	19.95	830	52.89	0	2	1
N Kapil Dev	1981-1992	43	43	6	723	72	19.54	677	106.79	0	3	2

 

100s scored in upper middle order = 37 in 1371 innings 

 

 

Lower middle order

Primary team India

Opposition team Australia  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka  or West Indies

Batting position between 6 and 7

Qualifications runs scored greater than or equal to 250  and matches played greater than or equal to 20

Ordered by batting average (descending)

 

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0
M Azharuddin	1985-1999	25	20	10	597	108*	59.70	639	93.42	1	1	0
MS Dhoni	2005-2019	179	149	49	4637	139*	46.37	5527	83.89	2	33	4
KM Jadhav	2014-2020	46	34	14	859	120	42.95	777	110.55	1	2	1
HH Pandya	2016-2022	45	29	4	938	92*	37.52	834	112.47	0	7	3
A Jadeja	1992-2000	55	48	10	1303	119	34.28	1732	75.23	1	6	2
YK Pathan	2008-2012	40	28	9	627	123*	33.00	532	117.85	2	3	3
SK Raina	2005-2018	78	68	14	1740	106	32.22	1903	91.43	1	8	7
Yuvraj Singh	2000-2011	61	51	8	1363	98*	31.69	1725	79.01	0	10	2
RA Jadeja	2009-2022	115	84	30	1652	87	30.59	1950	84.71	0	8	6
RJ Shastri	1982-1992	66	55	11	1279	73*	29.06	1662	76.95	0	7	2
RG Sharma	2007-2012	20	18	7	266	58	24.18	347	76.65	0	1	1
RR Singh	1989-2001	86	76	16	1436	75	23.93	1987	72.26	0	6	3
N Kapil Dev	1978-1994	162	142	29	2700	87	23.89	2977	90.69	0	10	11
M Kaif	2002-2006	60	49	10	914	87*	23.43	1219	74.97	0	5	3
IK Pathan	2004-2012	30	24	6	384	47*	21.33	554	69.31	0	0	2
NR Mongia	1994-2000	68	49	17	664	69	20.75	941	70.56	0	1	0
PK Amre	1991-1994	29	23	3	384	55	19.20	609	63.05	0	1	1
AK Sharma	1988-1993	20	18	3	279	52*	18.60	309	90.29	0	2	2

 

100s scored in lower middle order = 8 in 965 innings 

[tweaker]

Surya,Pandya Pant are good middle order, late middle order should be made strong and option should be tried in bilateral series

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, sarchasm said:

 

He could possibly succeed in India like conditions but there are too many better candidates now for him to merit a discussion. Time to move on.

he was bounced out in India in IPL and Ind-Aus home series do even thats not safe

Ill back him for 2023 Wc but only as a backup 

[vvvslaxman]

Just now, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

U havent understood Rohit till now , he ll back players to hill and Dhawan, kohli are both getting backed. 

If they make KL open again despite his middle order number they are idiots of highest order 

 

KL Rahul at no level has indicated desire to bat down the order. He is the test opener. Opener for his IPL side. It will be a toss up between him and Dhawan.  India cannot afford to have 3 oldies forever. Purely based on batting form none of the three should be playing. But Rohit being the captain has to play.