Pakistan are able to compete with India because of their superior Spinners and not Pacers.

[AuxiliA]

People say stats don't tell the whole story but they do tell much more than just people's opinions. 

 

Let's look at the combined stats of Indian and Pakistani bowlers from our 2 matches. 

 

Ind Pacers:  25.4 - 0 - 214 - 13   

Ave- 16.46  Eco- 8.33

 

Pak Pacers:  24 - 0 - 212 - 5

Ave- 42.4  Eco- 8.83

 

Ind Spinners:  14 - 0 - 112 - 2

Ave- 56.0  Eco- 8.0

 

Pak Spinners:  15.4 - 0 - 108 - 6

Ave- 18.0  Eco- 6.89

 

 

1) Indian pacers despite being slower have outperformed Pak pacers. They have slightly better economy and have taken significantly more wickets. 

 

2) On the other hand Pakistani spinners have completely outperformed the Indians. The difference in both Ave and Eco is huge. 

 

This tells us that lack of proper spinners has been the main reason for our troubles against Pak. And Indian pacers have fared much better than what people think. 

 

Chahal has been the biggest mujrim for us this Asia cup. All Asian teams have better spin attack than us, which is a big shame. 

 

Edited September 6, 2022 by AuxiliA

[Chakdephatte]

Hahaha! Someone show this to speed gun worshippers here. 

Edited September 6, 2022 by Chakdephatte

[AuxiliA]

1 minute ago, Chakdephatte said:

Hahaha! Someone show this to speed gun worshippers here. 

 

Exactly. Never heard anyone saying that John Isner is a better tennis player than Nadal because he has a bigger and much faster serve. 

 

At the end only performance matters. 

[Chakdephatte]

Chahal is problematic, cannot be dropped but cannot be trusted either. Recent performance suggested he has improved, but comes a world event, he started being ineffective.

[Chakdephatte]

3 minutes ago, AuxiliA said:

Exactly. Never heard anyone saying that John Isner is a better tennis player than Nadal because he has a bigger and much faster serve. 

 

At the end only performance matters. 

 

On TV, we see nothing. The angle from which we see the ball coming is different than the one the batsman facing him sees. To judge a bowler's effective speed, we need to see how easily a batsman picks him not his release speed. Some slow ball bowlers are extremely hard to hit, same for some fast bowlers, speed is just a one factor, basics cannot be ignored for speed.

[Number]

Somewhere you have to fault our batters too. Their batting is crap against spin.

[AuxiliA]

3 minutes ago, Number said:

Somewhere you have to fault our batters too. Their batting is crap against spin.

 

No our top 7 are among the best in the world. Not kidding. The fact that we score well despite having the worst tail in cricket and win so much with an iffy bowling. 

 

 

 

 

[AuxiliA]

If Indian batsmen faced Indian bowling minus Bumrah, they would score 200+ every match lol. 

[deepdynamo]

Our spinners are still not settled just one month prior to T20WC.

Chahal, Bishnoi, Axar, Ashwin, Jadeja ( Injured)

 

Only two of them can go to Australia.

 

[the don]

What about the worldcup match where pakistan completely outbowled the Indian seamers?

[AuxiliA]

1 minute ago, deepdynamo said:

Our spinners are still not settled just one month prior to T20WC.

Chahal, Bishnoi, Axar, Ashwin, Jadeja ( Injured)

 

Only two of them can go to Australia.

 

 

If Jadeja isn't available, I will take Bishnoi and Axar. Chalal is complete trash. Can't bat, can't field and can't even spin now. 

[AuxiliA]

1 minute ago, the don said:

What about the worldcup match where pakistan completely outbowled the Indian seamers?

 

That was 1 time in 13 WC matches lol. 

[Number]

22 minutes ago, AuxiliA said:

 

No our top 7 are among the best in the world. Not kidding. The fact that we score well despite having the worst tail in cricket and win so much with an iffy bowling. 

 

 

 

 

 

Pakistani spinners In world T20 2021

 

Against India

Imad : 2 overs 10 runs

Shadab : 4 overs 22 runs

Hafeez : 2 overs 12 runs

 

Against Australia 

Imad : 3 overs 25 runs

Shadab : 4 overs 26 runs (took 4 wickets though)

Hafeez : 1 over 13 runs

 

You can clearly see the diff.

I agree that Chahal has been poor but Indian batters haven't really done against half decent spinners in recent times.

[Frustrated]

Paxtani pacers were actually more effective than our pacers in the 1st game.  Not so much in the 2nd game.    It's too early to jump to any conclusions.  

[Jay]

1 hour ago, AuxiliA said:

People say stats don't tell the whole story but they do tell much more than just people's opinions. 

 

Let's look at the combined stats of Indian and Pakistani bowlers from our 2 matches. 

 

Ind Pacers:  25.4 - 0 - 214 - 13   

Ave- 16.46  Eco- 8.33

 

Pak Pacers:  24 - 0 - 212 - 5

Ave- 42.4  Eco- 8.83

 

Ind Spinners:  14 - 0 - 112 - 2

Ave- 56.0  Eco- 8.0

 

Pak Spinners:  15.4 - 0 - 108 - 6

Ave- 18.0  Eco- 6.89

 

 

1) Indian pacers despite being slower have outperformed Pak pacers. They have slightly better economy and have taken significantly more wickets. 

 

2) On the other hand Pakistani spinners have completely outperformed the Indians. The difference in both Ave and Eco is huge. 

 

This tells us that lack of proper spinners has been the main reason for our troubles against Pak. And Indian pacers have fared much better than what people think. 

 

Chahal has been the biggest mujrim for us this Asia cup. All Asian teams have better spin attack than us, which is a big shame. 

 

 

59 minutes ago, Chakdephatte said:

Hahaha! Someone show this to speed gun worshippers here. 

Keep sticking with these trundlers and we will see how they get smacked around in Australia.

 

We need our fast bowlers back regardless. Bumrah siraj bhuvi or prasidh/tyagi is the way to go. 

 

And yes our spinners suck donkey balls. 

 

We need bishnoi and axar in. 

[Jay]

2 minutes ago, Frustrated said:

Paxtani pacers were actually more effective than our pacers in the 1st game.  Not so much in the 2nd game.    It's too early to jump to any conclusions.  

Pace is useless. Need bounce/zip at decent clip.i need to see hostile bowling.

[AuxiliA]

4 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

Keep sticking with these trundlers and we will see how they get smacked around in Australia.

 

We need our fast bowlers back regardless. Bumrah siraj bhuvi or prasidh/tyagi is the way to go. 

 

And yes our spinners suck donkey balls. 

 

We need bishnoi and axar in. 

 

Our pace bowling will be better once Bumrah comes in. Him and Arshdeep will be great at death. Pandya is good for a 4th pacer. 

 

If only we can find a genuine wicket taking new ball baller, we will have a formidable pace attack. 

 

A bigger overlooked problem is the lack of an impactful spinner. 

[rkt.india]

So then play an extra pacer in place of chahal 

[Ankit_sharma03]

@Nikhil_cric already mentioned about it

 Even in last game their seamers went for 11 runs more then ours 

[Ankit_sharma03]

10 hours ago, Frustrated said:

Paxtani pacers were actually more effective than our pacers in the 1st game.  Not so much in the 2nd game.    It's too early to jump to any conclusions.  

 

how ??

In 1st game 

 

Indian seamers - 11.5 over 84 runs 9 wkts

Pakistan seamers 12 over 91 runs 2 wkts

 

Like how ??