sandeep Posted October 28, 2022 Share Posted October 28, 2022 I urge all Pakistan watchers to watch this - this is unprecedented defensiveness and emotional appeal to deny allegations of treason by a country's top military leadership. If things have come to this point, its an indicator to how besieged the Pakistan military jernails are feeling. Saying things like, "we may have made mistakes, but we are not traitors, we are paying price of our mistakes in blood". On a certain level, folks may feel a lot of schadenfreude, but honestly speaking this is a very dangerous signal as to how badly things have degenerated in terms of governance and political environment in that country. This has ramifications for the entire region. Scary. singhvivek141 and ravishingravi 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingravi Posted October 28, 2022 Share Posted October 28, 2022 Its heading towards a showdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maniac Posted October 28, 2022 Share Posted October 28, 2022 Pakistanis used to argue ISI is greater than CIA and Pak army is why India hasn’t attacked them and made Akhand Bharat. when I say Pakistanis I am speaking about the ones that have access to the internet and I come across on forums. I have 0 clue how an average Pakistani in some gaon/pind think. The ones I have met in real life bar 1 annoying one have been decent and cordial people and never once discussed politics/ religion/history etc. Just regular folk like us. Now going back to the above, the same demographic who all now happen to be Imran Khan fans (exceptions exist) are calling the ISI and their army incompetent Imran Khan sandeep 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarke Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 The latest (and biggest) of the snakes that went out of control & bit the army back. The guy was recently contesting 8 diff seats at the same time if he didn't have a ban to serve, wonder how many seats he'd be contesting in general election ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffee_rules Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 Yes, IL attacking military in speeches speaks of his political power. Sad that he will be brought down now , by hook or crook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First class Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 If any one could do it , it was Imran Khan and I'm glad he brought Pakistani Army into its knees. Bhutto and Sharif both tried it but failed , but both of them were selfish , corrupt and unpatriotic , , not Imran Khan . I was never so optimistic about Pakistan's future , but I'm sure good days are ahead for Pakistan. If IK makes a comeback , army will be limited to its professional duties. IK is an educated, peace loving and strong leader, what Pakistan has been missing until now. I'm sure Kashmir issue will not be resolved peacefully as long as Pakistan has weak and corrupt leaders . It will be resolved, if ever, between two strong political leaders with big public support and army stays away. Iconoclast 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingravi Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 18 minutes ago, First class said: If any one could do it , it was Imran Khan and I'm glad he brought Pakistani Army into its knees. Bhutto and Sharif both tried it but failed , but both of them were selfish , corrupt and unpatriotic , , not Imran Khan . I was never so optimistic about Pakistan's future , but I'm sure good days are ahead for Pakistan. If IK makes a comeback , army will be limited to its professional duties. IK is an educated, peace loving and strong leader, what Pakistan has been missing until now. I'm sure Kashmir issue will not be resolved peacefully as long as Pakistan has weak and corrupt leaders . It will be resolved, if ever, between two strong political leaders with big public support and army stays away. Your points are valid. But optimistic ? This is going to be an all out civil War now. A country which is completely damaged trying to somehow survive through this phase. I can't imagine what cost Pakistan will pay for this righteous conflict. Not to mention. Imran's life is now under serious threat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingravi Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 I saw the whole 90 min press conference and it's nothing short of unbelievable. It's like Ajit Doval press conference against Rahul Gandhi. Pretty amazing. He says that ISI is non political but they meet political leaders including Imran Khan. The handpicked journalists were also scared to see this. They were wondering if a major threshold has been crossed now that DGISPR is openly doing press conference. sandeep 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First class Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 2 hours ago, ravishingravi said: Your points are valid. But optimistic ? This is going to be an all out civil War now. A country which is completely damaged trying to somehow survive through this phase. I can't imagine what cost Pakistan will pay for this righteous conflict. Not to mention. Imran's life is now under serious threat. No, I'm not too optimistic but realistic , there won't we any civil war. Army's top brasses are also under pressure from Army's Jawans and officers, majority of them agree with IK, they are also regular citizen of Pakistan and not any foreigners and care about Pakistan . Its only top brasses who cannot digest the power they're given. Army had to face this kind of pressure until now. Ik will be back in power and there will be some change in army's role in civilian matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandeep Posted October 30, 2022 Author Share Posted October 30, 2022 8 hours ago, First class said: No, I'm not too optimistic but realistic , there won't we any civil war. Army's top brasses are also under pressure from Army's Jawans and officers, majority of them agree with IK, they are also regular citizen of Pakistan and not any foreigners and care about Pakistan . Its only top brasses who cannot digest the power they're given. Army had to face this kind of pressure until now. Ik will be back in power and there will be some change in army's role in civilian matters. I hate to say this, and really hoping nothing tragic happens, but tell me this FC bhai, what happens if/once Imran isn't around? Do you think PTI can sustain without him? Doubt it. Do you really think the military mafia that has ruled over your country pretty much since 1950s, is simply going to hand things over to Imran, just like that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandeep Posted October 30, 2022 Author Share Posted October 30, 2022 I have said this many a times on ICF chit-chat forum, but this guy summarizes it quite nicely - pakjabis have a very long history of surrendering. Clarke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First class Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 8 hours ago, sandeep said: I have said this many a times on ICF chit-chat forum, but this guy summarizes it quite nicely - pakjabis have a very long history of surrendering. This guy is famous for saying stupid things , just to stay in the news, but people now ignore him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Autonomous Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 @sandeep We have bajwa trending as gaddar. Ab punjabi bhi traitor hogaye hain after pakhtoon, sindhi etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Autonomous Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 IK was biggest mistake of establishment, he has turned out to be a nightmare for the army. Ptoblem is - he isn't just a problem for the army - he is danger to existance of Pakistan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingravi Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 Good Luck to those in Pakistan. It's not an easy situation to forecast. But I just don't see how you get on the good side of it. IK won't go. Establishment won't stop. What a nightmare scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First class Posted October 30, 2022 Share Posted October 30, 2022 Hoping under IK's next tenure , starting 2023 , Army's role in politics will be very limited, if not abolished, two parties MQM and PNL-N will be wiped out from their strong holds and Pakistan will have better relations with its neighbors . IK committed many mistakes in his first tenure , which he admits , hope he has learnt form them . I'm hoping a peaceful and strong Pakistan will emerge under IK. Never in the history of Pakistan we had ever seen such a popular leader , with public support in every corner of the country. Bhutto was strong in Sindh and Southern Punjab , Patwari party ( RIP ) was strong in central Punjab , IK is popular everywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandeep Posted October 31, 2022 Author Share Posted October 31, 2022 14 hours ago, First class said: Hoping under IK's next tenure , starting 2023 , Army's role in politics will be very limited, if not abolished, two parties MQM and PNL-N will be wiped out from their strong holds and Pakistan will have better relations with its neighbors . IK committed many mistakes in his first tenure , which he admits , hope he has learnt form them . I'm hoping a peaceful and strong Pakistan will emerge under IK. Never in the history of Pakistan we had ever seen such a popular leader , with public support in every corner of the country. Bhutto was strong in Sindh and Southern Punjab , Patwari party ( RIP ) was strong in central Punjab , IK is popular everywhere. what sort of fantasy delusion is this? You are expecting an entrenched bureaucracy that has owned the country for decades, and has so much personal incentives and wealth at stake to simply hand over power to a populist nutjob? If it was that easy, how is it that when Imran was already PM he couldn't hold on to it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingravi Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 1 minute ago, sandeep said: what sort of fantasy delusion is this? You are expecting an entrenched bureaucracy that has owned the country for decades, and has so much personal incentives and wealth at stake to simply hand over power to a populist nutjob? If it was that easy, how is it that when Imran was already PM he couldn't hold on to it? Exactly. This is fool's paradise. But then its Imran Khan. The man has innate capacity to manifest things. I never would have thought I would see a day where DGISI is crying press conference. Imran is loose cannon but he is a man obsessed. If there was ever an example for "The Secret", this the one. The only one who seems to make Paulo Coelho's words come to life. So, I can understand why they are hopeful. sandeep 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandeep Posted October 31, 2022 Author Share Posted October 31, 2022 1 hour ago, ravishingravi said: Exactly. This is fool's paradise. But then its Imran Khan. The man has innate capacity to manifest things. I never would have thought I would see a day where DGISI is crying press conference. Imran is loose cannon but he is a man obsessed. If there was ever an example for "The Secret", this the one. The only one who seems to make Paulo Coelho's words come to life. So, I can understand why they are hopeful. we can laugh and make jokes, but this is a 'container' caravan careening wildly out of control, and with a dummy at the wheel who can't see beyond his own nose and magical belief that he is the 'savior' that was promised. The ramifications for greenbros self-inflicted chaos are serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First class Posted October 31, 2022 Share Posted October 31, 2022 35 minutes ago, sandeep said: we can laugh and make jokes, but this is a 'container' caravan careening wildly out of control, and with a dummy at the wheel who can't see beyond his own nose and magical belief that he is the 'savior' that was promised. The ramifications for greenbros self-inflicted chaos are serious. You guys think you know more about Pakistan then I do, and if you're happy to have your own interpretation of the situation over there , then enjoy and have fun. People in Pakistan also have brain and heart and they also think and feel about their country but you guys think otherwise , I have no issue if that gives you a bit pf pleasure, why not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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