Both on paper and form - RSA looks like a much more dangerous team than India and most likely semi final match ups.

[IndiaWC8311]

3 minutes ago, neel roy said:

 

We struggle against all SLAs.. Wellalage caught us pants down, kuhnemann won a test against us, so did herath..we couldnt hit out against Imad Wasim and scored 10 runs off his 2 overs in wt20 in 2021..santner killed us in 2016 wt20and even reccently in windies we struggled against akeal hossain..also we dont have a left hander like Pant who can give nightmares to SLAs like he did to jack leach.. so the moot point is we have to play him carefully..

Two reasons for our struggles

 

We don't have enough left handers to counter them (Dube would tear them to pieces)

We need players who can play the inside out shot well and refverse sweep (Surya, gaikwad and Rahane and Gill to less extent only guys who can play inside out shot well)

[sandeep]

33 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

@sandeep  - The manner in which RSA has been mauling teams is frightening.

 

Pls answer this for me - If you agree that RSA batting is far more potent than NZ.

 

How much would RSA have potentially / hypothetically scored in Dharamashala against us on that track . Easily 320+ ?

 

Would we have been able to chase that against their bowling ? 

 

 

yes, I think if India have to chase anything below 330 odd against SA, I think we can manage it.   Both teams have to bat on same track.  Its not going to be that they will manage 330 and suddenly when we come to bat its going to turn into a bowlers paradise.  SA bowling is good but not that much better than NZ overall.  

 

And btw, I don't think its a done deal that India will concede 330 to SA - not every day is sunday, yes they have piled up big scores but mostly against weaker bowling units than ours.  

[nitinbwj]

I was sceptical of India's chase against NZ as well but Rohit batted the way he has batted this WC. Fearless hitting. Took on Henry, Boult. Rabada, Ngidi, Ciertzee are not the same in India and if they are attacked, they are derailed pretty quickly. That Maharaj needs to be played carefully like we did to Santner. Anyways, I don't think we will concede anything more than 310 and that too in worse case scenario against SA. 

[Lone Wolf]

1 hour ago, Serpico said:

We will not see them in finals, nz team is very clinical in their approach. It'll be a close match and Nz has more clutch players

 

India just needs to stay on the top and prepare for Aus. Zampa is back in form and Travis head will join the team next week. So Aussies will be much more powerful than in the first match. Hopefully Rohit will see through Hazelwood's initial spell 

Probability of facing SA in semis is less...   Assuming we top the table or even lose to them in Group stages. 

They finish at top & we at 2nd or vice versa. 

 

Things are tricky other way around... 

 

If NZ loses to Australia...  There is a real shot of India facing NZ in Wankhede.   No easier game either way. 

[Lone Wolf]

Incidentally I back India to win finals in Ahmedabad...  The track against Pakistan would be ideal against SNA... 

 

Semis is our biggest hurdle this time around. 

Win Semis trophy is there for the taking. 

[Suhaan]

16 minutes ago, IndiaWC8311 said:

Dube would tear them to pieces)

Dube?

Edited October 24, 2023 by Suhaan

[Nash]

25 minutes ago, IndiaWC8311 said:

He is a winning mentaltiy bowler who has learned for years under MSD and champion set up at CSK. There is a reason we struggle against him

I remember when SA was playing in India in 1990s. There was bowler name Pat Symcox : https://www.espncricinfo.com/cricketers/pat-symcox-47267

He was extremely effective to keep our batsman quit. When being asked sachin which African bowler he think hard to play, he said Pat Symcox. I can't find video for this anywhere right now. Santner has same easy bowling action and he bowls a good areas. I dont know wha tis so hard to hit him with foot movement agression and going deep in backfoot.

[neel roy]

4 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said:

Incidentally I back India to win finals in Ahmedabad...  The track against Pakistan would be ideal against SNA... 

 

Semis is our biggest hurdle this time around. 

Win Semis trophy is there for the taking. 

 

i kind of agree. wankhede and eden are small grounds.. mishits from beasts like klassen and stoinis can clear ropes..and they will target kuldeep with slog sweeps.. ahmedabad is a larger ground and so they will be circumspect.. also calcutta in november has huge huge dew issues.. you can literally feel the dew from 6 pm.. and so toss becomes important. 

[Suhaan]

2 minutes ago, Nash said:

I remember when SA was playing in India in 1990s. There was bowler name Pat Symcox : https://www.espncricinfo.com/cricketers/pat-symcox-47267

He was extremely effective to keep our batsman quit. When being asked sachin which African bowler he think hard to play, he said Pat Symcox. I can't find video for this anywhere right now. Santner has same easy bowling action and he bowls a good areas. I dont know wha tis so hard to hit him with foot movement agression and going deep in backfoot.

They also had underated fast bowler Fanie Devilliers very difficult to put off

[Nash]

Just now, Suhaan said:

They also had underated fast bowler Fanie Devilliers very difficult to put off

Yeah. him also. His bowling action was little different : 

Look at the manju 31 ball 7 run. 

 

 

[Lone Wolf]

5 minutes ago, neel roy said:

 

i kind of agree. wankhede and eden are small grounds.. mishits from beasts like klassen and stoinis can clear ropes..and they will target kuldeep with slog sweeps.. ahmedabad is a larger ground and so they will be circumspect.. also calcutta in november has huge huge dew issues.. you can literally feel the dew from 6 pm.. and so toss becomes important. 

Eden is smaller but pitch doesn't has true bounce & hit through the line bounce & carry like Wankhede.  It is a typical flat pitch with a ultra fast outfield...  But it nullifies SA bowlers too...  Unlike Wankhede which has carry & trueness like Capetown & Centurion 

[neel roy]

based on probabilities and simulations Aus or NZ will be in 3rd and 4th.. NZ has 4 tough games.. saf with its humongous run rate just needs to win 2/ 4 matches to finish second considering india will beat sl and netherlands at a minimum to finish top..so basically we will have to plan against hazlewood and stac and boult and matt henry ( i fear him the most.. just see how many plays and misses Rohit and Gill had..)..

[Lord]

9 minutes ago, Nash said:

Yeah. him also. His bowling action was little different : 

Look at the manju 31 ball 7 run. 

 

 

 

looks like he wasn't even bits and pieces.

[Lone Wolf]

3 minutes ago, neel roy said:

based on probabilities and simulations Aus or NZ will be in 3rd and 4th.. NZ has 4 tough games.. saf with its humongous run rate just needs to win 2/ 4 matches to finish second considering india will beat sl and netherlands at a minimum to finish top..so basically we will have to plan against hazlewood and stac and boult and matt henry ( i fear him the most.. just see how many plays and misses Rohit and Gill had..)..

Not Boult but Henry...  Boy is bowling quick in 140's with seam movement at an immaculate length. 

He is super tough to deal with.  Then ofc unhittable Santner. 

[IndiaWC8311]

20 minutes ago, Nash said:

I remember when SA was playing in India in 1990s. There was bowler name Pat Symcox : https://www.espncricinfo.com/cricketers/pat-symcox-47267

He was extremely effective to keep our batsman quit. When being asked sachin which African bowler he think hard to play, he said Pat Symcox. I can't find video for this anywhere right now. Santner has same easy bowling action and he bowls a good areas. I dont know wha tis so hard to hit him with foot movement agression and going deep in backfoot.

The mechanics of the action if you watch closely is there is a very slight pause before release which allows Santner / Symcox to figure out batsman and what they are doing with their feet and thereby they can adjust line and length accordingly

 

They are very smart cunning bowlers who may look innocuous but they have subtle changes that makes it difficult at times

 

I used to do this in my peak playing days. I would open the bowling with the new ball but bowl crafty spin with the older bowl with a slight pause in action

[neel roy]

12 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said:

Not Boult but Henry...  Boy is bowling quick in 140's with seam movement at an immaculate length. 

He is super tough to deal with.  Then ofc unhittable Santner. 

 

One thing we must all applaud and accept is Rohit has worked his socks off in terms of playing left arm seam..somewhere read a statistic.. in terms of all the 16 wickets india has lost in the 5 matches only 5 is due to bowlers getting us out or deceiving us-

 

1. Rohit against hazlewood and against nz
2. Iyer against boult
3. rahul against santner
4. kishan against pak

 

All the rest  ( 1 was run out) was due to the player hitting out and getting out and there was no asking rate pressure in any of them.. rohit has got out 3 times just while bashing, same kohli against nz or even bangladesh..and iyer as well against bd..

Edited October 24, 2023 by neel roy

[Suhaan]

2 minutes ago, neel roy said:

kishan against pak

Kishan vs Aus rather

Edited October 24, 2023 by Suhaan

[IndiaWC8311]

10 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said:

Not Boult but Henry...  Boy is bowling quick in 140's with seam movement at an immaculate length. 

He is super tough to deal with.  Then ofc unhittable Santner. 

Agreed Henry is the real deal. He was first spotted by CSK and trained well under Eric Simmons and ever since he was destined to do well.

Very under-rated bowler who has always played back up to SOuthee / Boult but has always impressed whenever he got a chance

[kubrickian]

India will most likely finish at the top of the table and play SF at Mumbai. The question is should India still look to chase in the SF being they are most comfortable as a chasing side and have won all the games so far chasing ? My answer is no, because if they need to chase 320+. it will be a big challenge especially at Mumbai, with the extra zip off the surface under lights and against SA, Aus or NZ bowlers or whichever team we play against and also  with the pressure of knock out scenario. Rather India should look to post 320+ batting first and look to defend it.

 

Edited October 24, 2023 by kubrickian

[IndiaWC8311]

34 minutes ago, Suhaan said:

Dube?

Best spin hitter in India