Air India Flight 171 from Ahmedabad to London Gatwick crashes into medical students' hostel: 280+ fatalities

[randomGuy]

4 minutes ago, MechEng said:

 

An aircraft cannot fly with the fuel switch being in off state, you need insane amount pickup to take off an aircraft.

 

Also look at the time timestamps in report where both switches were turned off.

Arey to switch off show kiye ja sakte hain electronically or with some machanical device installed underneath the switch....is that something unthinkable? I have read the articles telling that BOTH switches were turned off within 1 sec IMMEDIATELY after the max speed and take-off.

[Vickydev]

6 hours ago, IndianRenegade said:

I don't know man but this doesn't look good. Here is the guidleline:

 

 

So the "flaw" was you could move from one position to the next without lifting the knob/switch which means your action should be more deliberate than just truning the knob. I could undestand a trained pilot making a mistake & inadvertently turning the knob on one of the switches, but unintended switch movement on both the switches! its kind of stretching it.  

 

 

video on how the switches work.

 

 

Yeah difficult to tell, the lock feature is there for a reason though to prevent switches being moved accidentally. If the disengagement allows the switch to be moved without lifting them up it could open up various possibilities

[Vickydev]

So it took 1s to go from one switch to the next when going from run to cutoff but switching them BOTH back to run took 4s

 

"As per the EAFR, the Engine 1 fuel cutoff switch transitioned from CUTOFF to RUN at about 08:08:52 UTC. The APU Inlet Door began opening at about 08:08:54 UTC, consistent with the APU Auto Start logic. Thereafter at 08:08:56 UTC the Engine 2 fuel cutoff switch also transitions from CUTOFF to RUN."

 

https://aaib.gov.in/What's New Assets/Preliminary Report VT-ANB.pdf

 

So the question.. is it physically possible to do the first bit in just 1s?

[kepler37b]

38 minutes ago, MechEng said:

 

Now Indian government has given green signal to Boeing and other OEMs to investigate this issue in greater detail, this is needed.

 

There could be a possibility that the machinery was not in sync or something else that led to cutoff of fuel supply to the engines. But that also seems unlikely since the co-pilot could see that both switches were turned off.

 

Maybe by December we will get closer to the truth, but my hunch tells me it was deliberate and done in the cockpit.

That Steve guy in the video sounded very sad and sympathetic to the pilots. Unfortunately some ICF ers are shooting the Messenger. 

[MechEng]

15 minutes ago, Vickydev said:

So it took 1s to go from one switch to the next when going from run to cutoff but switching them BOTH back to run took 4s

 

"As per the EAFR, the Engine 1 fuel cutoff switch transitioned from CUTOFF to RUN at about 08:08:52 UTC. The APU Inlet Door began opening at about 08:08:54 UTC, consistent with the APU Auto Start logic. Thereafter at 08:08:56 UTC the Engine 2 fuel cutoff switch also transitions from CUTOFF to RUN."

 

https://aaib.gov.in/What's New Assets/Preliminary Report VT-ANB.pdf

 

So the question.. is it physically possible to do the first bit in just 1s?

 

Boeing 787 is not IoT enabled that would allow a terrorist to operate outside the aircraft and somehow get the switches turned off immediately after takeoff. 

 

Also, if you look at the video shared by @IndianRenegade, it takes some effort to turn fuel switches off unlike your on-off buttons on electronic devices.

 

Plus the co-pilot could visually verify that the switches were in off position indicating that the theory of fuel cutoff due to internal mechanism flaw while showing switches in on positin on the outside is unlikely.

 

[MechEng]

20 minutes ago, kepler37b said:

That Steve guy in the video sounded very sad and sympathetic to the pilots. Unfortunately some ICF ers are shooting the Messenger. 

 

It's tough for me to believe that such a thing could happen too but being an international commerical pilot is a taxing job. Flying non stop for close to 10-12 hours requires a lot of concentration and the odd hours of flying coupled with jet lags due to different time zones takes a toll. 

 

Adding to the above, we are unaware of the personal lives of both captain and the co-pilot too.

Edited July 12, 2025 by MechEng

[Vickydev]

21 minutes ago, kepler37b said:

That Steve guy in the video sounded very sad and sympathetic to the pilots. Unfortunately some ICF ers are shooting the Messenger. 

Not saying this because he is saying something we dont want to hear but because he has shown to be speculating in the past. He jumped on the bandwagon that it was pilot error from his first video on the topic from grainy as f#ck CCTV images saying the flaps were engaged incorrectly which was difficult for the best of experts to acertain, and was later proven to be wrong. Even here he came out with the video before the official report even out.

 

Now he maybe correct in his assesment, but he is not a source I find trustworthy.

[Vickydev]

24 minutes ago, MechEng said:

 

Boeing 787 is not IoT enabled that would allow a terrorist to operate outside the aircraft and somehow get the switches turned off immediately after takeoff. 

 

Also, if you look at the video shared by @IndianRenegade, it takes some effort to turn fuel switches off unlike your on-off buttons on electronic devices.

 

Plus the co-pilot could visually verify that the switches were in off position indicating that the theory of fuel cutoff due to internal mechanism flaw while showing switches in on positin on the outside is unlikely.

 

From the video are we certain the lock is engaged or are they disengaged? Because if the switches are locked into position then obviously that'll make them harder.

 

This is what he quoted

"In order to move the switch from one position to the other under the condition where the locking feature is engaged, it is necessary for the pilot to lift the switch up while transitioning the switch position. If the locking feature is disengaged, the switch can be moved between the two positions without lifting the switch during transition, and the switch would be exposed to the potential of inadvertent operation"

[ravishingravi]

 

[Vickydev]

Just not a fan of speculating deliberate action from either of the pilots until the investigation is complete. This has huge consequeces, and also because our people are too emotional. They will start looking into the lives of each of the pilot lives without knowing who might have even done it, maybe even harassing the innocent one's family

[MechEng]

31 minutes ago, Vickydev said:

From the video are we certain the lock is engaged or are they disengaged? Because if the switches are locked into position then obviously that'll make them harder.

 

This is what he quoted

"In order to move the switch from one position to the other under the condition where the locking feature is engaged, it is necessary for the pilot to lift the switch up while transitioning the switch position. If the locking feature is disengaged, the switch can be moved between the two positions without lifting the switch during transition, and the switch would be exposed to the potential of inadvertent operation"

 

Which kind of explains how the fuel got cutoff immediately after takeoff, easier to turn off the switches in unlocked stage.

 

Even then, the accident angle seems highly unlikely since both the pilots were too experienced to turn the switches off accidentally.

 

I'd say even an inexperienced pilot would not do that "accidentally" since flying an aircraft entails a lot of responsibility and this comes with the training.

Edited July 12, 2025 by MechEng

[ungboysj]

Always thought Indians are mentally strong living such a difficult life since birth

 

Really disappointed that a indian pilot carried out a mass suicide 

[crictime]

This accident needs a pin point understanding of the root cause - whether it was a boeing mechanism failure, sabotage or a pilot error without any intention of sabotage. Not less than 281 lives have been lost. Understanding the precise cause is crucial for corrective actions. Government should not let this sweep under the carpet.

[crictime]

Releasing such reports without  identifying the cause and providing conclusion leads to speculation not only by the families who have lost their dear ones, but also by other people in general. 

Edited July 12, 2025 by crictime

[coffee_rules]

7 hours ago, ravishingravi said:

 

All Indians should be seething in anger against the P@ki-infested BBC

 

 

[ravishingravi]

Just now, coffee_rules said:

All Indians should be seething in anger against the P@ki-infested BBC

 

 

 

It's quite amazing how much Pakistani have infested all global outlets. BBC, dw, France 24, trt, Reuters, AFP. 

[coffee_rules]

8 hours ago, kepler37b said:

That Steve guy in the video sounded very sad and sympathetic to the pilots. Unfortunately some ICF ers are shooting the Messenger. 

Don’t be so gullible . He has done a lot of speculation on the various causes including fuel contamination. His attire and manners could fool anybody. There is no concluded proof yet on how the fuel switches were switched off. It could be a malfunction too as reported by FAA advisory. Don’t be jumping to conclusions by a preliminary report just like the BBC headline

Edited July 12, 2025 by coffee_rules

[coffee_rules]

11 hours ago, IndianRenegade said:

The way the report is written makes it unlikely, it describes a sequence of events. at 8:8:42 is when max airspeed is achieved & immediately after that engine fuel cut off happens one after another within the span of a second.

 

This is when one of the pilot enquires about the cut off switches.

 

it is switched back to run @ 8:8:52 & 56. The report never mentions any other actions on it.

 

Either there was mechanical flaw that caused the unintentional engagement of cutoff or a pilot did it intentionally. 

I don’t want to jump into the pilot angle until the complete investigation is over. My company has been found liable in many investigations recently (that Alaskan airplane accident opening doors), there are a lot of moving parts and mechanisms electronic equipment made to work. It is not flawless

[coffee_rules]

5 hours ago, crictime said:

Releasing such reports without  identifying the cause and providing conclusion leads to speculation not only by the families who have lost their dear ones, but also by other people in general. 

India is not China. Preliminary reports indicate transparency and shows the authorities are doing something instead of dwindling their thumbs

[coffee_rules]

Air India (Tata) and Boeing have everything to lose if it is a mechanical flaw or maintenance lapse. An operational flaw is very easy to blame on for both giant corporations.